Would you kill the Joker?

[lunavixen]

I would have few qualms about it i think, I mean, after all the people he has killed, families he has ruined and sheer amounts of destruction he has wrought on Gotham City, and seeing as the police and Batman won't kill him, I think I could. He's one of those prisoners that can't (or is not willing) to be rehabilitated. I mean, what Batman and Comissioner Gordon are trying (to rehabilitate him and show him that the law works) is a noble idea, but I think he's too far gone.

 

[TwiZtah]

Yes, yes I would. None of that fucking pansying around that Batman does. One clean shot through the skull would save thousands of people their lives, just think if Batman would have done that 70 years ago.

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

You bet your ass I would. It's so stupid, this whole "Ohh nooo if we kill him, then we'll lose that part that separates us from him! We'll be no better than him, that's just what he would want!" Fuck's sake, assholes, you're worried more about your pride in not letting him "win" than actual lives? At that point I'd say you're already a monster -- a monster that allows the constant deaths of thousands of people for the sake of your own selfish needs.

So yeah, fine, the Joker wins. Big whoop. Kill the fucking clown already.

This is why I prefer the less serious Batman iterations, because this stupid "moral dilemma" is a complete non-issue.

 

[HellbirdIV]

What if you don't kill him, but break him? Destroy his arms, legs and mouth and make him dependent on regular medical treatment. It'd be incredibly cruel, sure, but he'd live and he'd be almost entirely neutralized.

This. I would assume the gun has more than one bullet? If I shoot his spine in two separate spots, blow out his knees and wrists and maybe shatter his pelvis, break his jaw and his elbows.

If that's not an option at all, then yes, I would be morally obligated to kill him. The Joker clearly will not remain in prison if his reputation is to be believed, and he's a mass-murderer intent as hell to keep on murdering for the rest of his life.

There is no option for rehabilitation, redemption or lifetime hard labour for the state that could possibly keep him from hurting and killing more people in the future.

The Clown's gotta go.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

Well ok yeah, the impact is different. However you're still lowering yourself to his level, aren't you?

So? What's more important, maintaining your position on your higher level or preventing all the suffering he'll go on to cause?

And that's even if you were actually going to his level, which would be the level of murdering people because it's fun. You'd be lowering yourself to the level of someone who kills someone to protect the people they would inevitably go on to hurt and kill; it's much higher up on the morality ladder.

Maybe it is, but I cannot kill someone in cold blood while they lie defenceless on the floor, even if it is the Joker. Now if he was up and awake an we were in some sort of life or death struggle then maybe I'd kill him.

Okay, if such a situation ever comes up, make sure to give the gun to someone who puts the lives and safety of dozens, if not hundreds, of other people over their desire to not do anything that goes against their morals.

Hey there's no need to attack me!!

I don't think he was attacking you, merely stating that if you are unwilling to take action you should step aside and let someone else make a crucial decision, you yourself stated that you wouldn't be able to do it unless very specific circumstances were present. Though you don't seem to comfortable with it since you regard his comment as an attack.

Ok maybe it was a knee jerk reaction to assume it was an attack.

Well you could probably consider it an attack. I was basically calling you someone who's too selfish to put other people's lives over your desire to feel good in the knowledge that you didn't go against your morals for a few seconds, because that's what you kinda are. So you should give the gun to someone who either doesn't have a moral issue with it, or who is willing to set their morals aside for two seconds for the sake of others.

Yeah, and I take offence to that remark.
Besides, I feel death would be too good for him.

 

[happyninja42]

The real question is "Will you take the law into your own hands?"

That question, I dunno. In a purely theoretical discussion, I would like to say yes. This subject is one that I personally find frustrating about the Batman universe. Corrupt legal system or not, how many bodies does one person have to pile up before the death penalty is considered appropriate? Crazy or not, doesn't matter to me. At some point, (personally when someone has wracked up a body count in the double digits or more), their sanity shouldn't be an issue. They are a clear and present danger to society, and given the revolving door system of the Mental Health Industry (not counting breaking out in comic book universe), I think putting them down is the overall better choice. The likelihood of them getting out is ridiculously high in a comic universe, and they will, as you say, kill again and again. At what point do you say "the value of this one crazy murderer's life is greater than the mountain of bodies he has made" ? When does that scale tip the other way?

I don't know, personally, I would like to think I'd kill him. Assuming all the variables you mentioned:

1. Well known, documented history of mass murder
2. Inability of justice system to properly protect the public by keeping him locked away.
3. Certainty that he will continue to kill again. (Very likely including myself if he gets out of this Perfect Situation)


I would say yes, I would kill him.

I do find it funny though, that the regular police force can't seem to shoot him. I mean either they are Stormtrooper accurate, or prohibited from using lethal force. If they are prohibited from using lethal force, then why do they have guns?

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Batman doesn't kill not because he's a pussy. He just knows his limitations. He's self aware enough to know that he's two steps away from being one of the real crack pots. One justifiable murder with joker could easily turn into "Eh, I've killed guys I found to be bad before, what's one more?"

Yes, the Joker's evil. Yes, he doesn't deserve to breathe the same air as us or especially of those families he has robbed of loved ones... But what's the difference between killing many because you have an uncontrollable insane urge to... and killing many those who go against your moral code (which just happens to be aligned somewhat similarly to the legal system)? When is it senseless murder, and when is it murder that you can happen to just explain away saying "well, he was a criminal so it's ok!"?

Also, this isn't defense of batman. I dislike him as a character. But I can understand why he does what he does.

What if you don't kill him, but break him? Destroy his arms, legs and mouth and make him dependent on regular medical treatment. It'd be incredibly cruel, sure, but he'd live and he'd be almost entirely neutralized.

DC is a universe of science and magic and mutagens.

Given that Joker is often quoted as a chemical genius, you'd probably give rise to cyber joker, or Bang Baby Joker.

 

[GamerAddict7796]

Without any hesitation.

That man has killed thousands over a number of years and yet Batman still thinks he cspan be rehabilitated? No thanks.

Even morally there's nothing to worry about. If his next victim was one of your family, you'd soon want retribution so you'll be doing many, many people a favour.

 

[Froggy Slayer]

No. I'd get him put into a prison that isn't in Gotham, though. A bit harder to break out.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Batman doesn't kill not because he's a pussy. He just knows his limitations. He's self aware enough to know that he's two steps away from being one of the real crack pots. One justifiable murder with joker could easily turn into "Eh, I've killed guys I found to be bad before, what's one more?"

Yes, the Joker's evil. Yes, he doesn't deserve to breathe the same air as us or especially of those families he has robbed of loved ones... But what's the difference between killing many because you have an uncontrollable insane urge to... and killing many those who go against your moral code (which just happens to be aligned somewhat similarly to the legal system)? When is it senseless murder, and when is it murder that you can happen to just explain away saying "well, he was a criminal so it's ok!"?

Also, this isn't defense of batman. I dislike him as a character. But I can understand why he does what he does.

What if you don't kill him, but break him? Destroy his arms, legs and mouth and make him dependent on regular medical treatment. It'd be incredibly cruel, sure, but he'd live and he'd be almost entirely neutralized.

DC is a universe of science and magic and mutagens.

Given that Joker is often quoted as a chemical genius, you'd probably give rise to cyber joker or Bang Baby Joker.

captcha: Good morning.

It's afternoon, Captcha, but you one crazy *****...

 

[XMark]

Batman doesn't kill not because he's a pussy. He just knows his limitations. He's self aware enough to know that he's two steps away from being one of the real crack pots. One justifiable murder with joker could easily turn into "Eh, I've killed guys I found to be bad before, what's one more?"

Yeah, with the kind of psychological issues Batman has, allowing himself to kill someone could be what tips him over to the dark side. If Batman became evil, he would be much worse than the Joker.

 

[loc978]

I'd kill him, but not with the gun... unless it's a smoothbore with bullets I cast myself (and is not an autoloader. I don't want to let a casing hit the ground). Also, do I have gloves and a full hooded mask on? Last thing I want is to leave evidence for Batman to trace later.

 

[Robot Number V]

I wouldn't have to. I could shoot him in the leg so he can't escape, and let the cops take him. As a mass-murderer, there's no fucking way he wouldn't end up with a in a maximum security prison somewhere with a death sentence over his head. For those of you are saying he would escape, I direct you to this conversation:

There has never been an escape from a super-max prison.

Yeah, because Arkham Asylum is just a white-collar prison with a revolving door...

We're talking about a comic-book world here, my friend. There might not be any escapes from super-max prisons in reality, but the Joker doesn't exist in reality. He exists in a world where breaking out of a super-max prison is just something on his to-do list for Thursday.

If we're talking comic-book world here, then no one would be able to kill him.

Anyone like us normal shmucks pointing a gun at an essential character's head like the Joker always die in the comic book world. Usually being surprised by a trick up the joker's sleeve that ends up being a horrible death for the one with a gun. He wouldn't have himself in that situation to begin with.

Normal unknown people can't stand up to villians or heroes in the comic book world, so the hypothetical is impossible I'm afraid XD

I see there are quite a few more pages, so this conversation might keep going, but I'm pretty convinced. If I even have the ability to kill the Joker, then it means that we're talking about the real world, not the comic-book world. And in the real world, people don't escape super-max prisons.

EDIT: Also, if I kill the Joker, Batman WILL find out. I would not want to be me when that happens.

 

[Robot Number V]

cant we, you know, just cripple him for life?

not beat him to pulp but really just cut off his arm and legs.

I've seen a couple of people saying this, the supposed "morality" of it confuses me. How exactly is putting someone through unimaginable pain and crippling them for life LESS wrong then just shooting them in the head?

 

[Durgiun]

Might as well ask me if I'd accept a blowjob giving robot that ran on dreams.

I'd kill the Joker without hesitation. And then I'd patiently wait for the Joker to come back to life somehow and kill me.

 

[MHR]

Since I'm 100% sure of all factors involved, yes.

As quickly as possible before he wakes up.

Sometimes murder is justified, but I'd still lose sleep over it. I'd probably do exactly the same thing if presented with future situations like this one though.

As far as the joker coming back to life. I'd shoot him now in the brain and since he's unconscious he probably wouldn't even know I'm the one who did it. I'd have delayed his schemes and probably saved hundreds of people.

I'd love to see whatever could bring a multiple headshot victime back to life, intellect, personality and all. Cybernetics or regeneratives would be useless.

I have no idea what a lazarus pit is though.

 

[McMarbles]

Only if it was funny.

I think ultimately, the Joker deserves to go out as the punchline rather than the setup.