X-Com 2 confusion (potential spoilers!)

[cathou]

i have more trouble with the damn snakeman that can reach you soldiers from an insane distance...

honestly, i dont mind the turn counter. first it's logical, since you are not in control of the battlefield. and i'm sorry, but it force you to find a different way to play than just spam overwatch...

 

[Terminal Blue]

I did notice that a lot of fairly early game enemies are quite tough compared to their EU counterparts.

The basic thing I've found after abandoning my first playthrough and starting a new one is to rush better weapons and increased squad size as quickly as possible. In EU it was always better armour, but timed missions in EU were extremely rare whereas in XCOM2 they are the norm (incidentally, I think that is the single best change they have made because it punishes overwatch spam). Being able to kill enemies quickly is essential both from a survival perspective (being able to take out nasty but relatively fragile enemies like stun lancers and sectoids really fast) and in terms of completing the mission objectives before the time runs out. Also, make sure everyone has grenades. The destructo-scenery is way, way better in this game and everyone having the ability to knock out cover makes things so much easier. Not to mention the new armour mechanic makes grenades incredibly handy.

The first time I played, I saw things like the advanced warfare centre and went "woah, gotta build that early so my guys can get more skills", and yeah I got the occasional awesome result out of it but things like that are a massive luxury.

The other thing I tried doing in my current game was building a lab, which in EU was pointless. I can't quite figure out how much impact it's having, but my research does seem to be a lot faster this time through. I'm much further along and haven't encountered some of the really horrible late-game enemies which stopped my previous playthrough.

And yeah, sectoids can shoot, but the AI doesn't seem to use them really aggressively. They seem to be more a lurky psi unit who will try to stay out of direct danger, which is occasionally super, super annoying when they've mind controlled someone and are now hiding halfway across the map. But yeah, derpy sectoids are nothing new, at least they don't kill each other any more.

 

[The Eupho Guy_v1legacy]

2: It feels like Firaxis, in order to balance things, made the Sectoids really, really stupid in order to balance the game. I've had multiple occasions where a Sectoid had a perfectly lined up flanking shot on one of my guys that likely would have killed him, and instead he'll just do reanimate, and then I'll promptly kill him the next turn, so re-animate was useless.

Yeah, you know what - I just played a mission in which the sectoid shot. I didn't even know they could shoot! I'm serious - I've soldiers around them that would have been really easy to flank, but they had never done that, so, I thought they only had psi abilities. They hadn't actually taken a shot ever in the 10 missions I've played. I think this one was actually the 10th but still.

I think this one sectoid may have shot now, since I had an exposed soldier there. Again, since I didn't know they could kill one just like that.

Wait, they shoot? I have never seen that happen in my game as of yet. I've only ever seen them reanimate or mind control, even if they have a pretty good shot on offer. I'll have to keep that in mind.

 

[cathou]

2: It feels like Firaxis, in order to balance things, made the Sectoids really, really stupid in order to balance the game. I've had multiple occasions where a Sectoid had a perfectly lined up flanking shot on one of my guys that likely would have killed him, and instead he'll just do reanimate, and then I'll promptly kill him the next turn, so re-animate was useless.

Yeah, you know what - I just played a mission in which the sectoid shot. I didn't even know they could shoot! I'm serious - I've soldiers around them that would have been really easy to flank, but they had never done that, so, I thought they only had psi abilities. They hadn't actually taken a shot ever in the 10 missions I've played. I think this one was actually the 10th but still.

I think this one sectoid may have shot now, since I had an exposed soldier there. Again, since I didn't know they could kill one just like that.

Wait, they shoot? I have never seen that happen in my game as of yet. I've only ever seen them reanimate or mind control, even if they have a pretty good shot on offer. I'll have to keep that in mind.

i've seen them use a weapon a few times. they seems to use it only if they dont have any other options

 

[Zenja]

I am a little disappointing at the difficulty spike in this game like it is trying to be Dark Souls of TBS when Xcom was never really known for difficulty. The original was pretty easy, and the remake was more that when you suffer a loss to the squad, it was almost devastating. Maybe the community around Xcom celebrates being able to defeat Impossible? I don't know.

XCOM was always renowned for...if not overpowering difficulty...at least an overwhelming capricious viciousness. To quote Jake Solomon:

But for all of its unpredictability, X-Com was not cruel. It did not delight in your failures. It simply did not care. It did not care if you slowly clawed your way to victory or if you fell, and the entire Earth fell with you. X-Com did not take the time to congratulate you or admonish you with silly snips of music, or gaudy showers of UI, or bombastic cinematics. X-Com just kept the dark wheels of its simulation turning, inexorably turning.

I agree with the viciousness (permadeath always is), but not the difficulty. The original Xcom was bugged to only have 1 difficulty (I believed "Experienced" despite having multiple choices so it didnt matter what you picked and they never bothered to patch it. Terror from the deep is known for the weapons not making sense as to the 'difficulty'. Apacalypse, I havent really played.

Maybe the remake EU had a community that acted like Xcom is all about difficulty but it wasn't that way before. I also think Firaxis likes using fake difficulty too often. For example satellite spam in the remake. Or in this one, forced turn timers. You know it wouldn't be so bad inf enemy spawns weren't random. For example, an escort VIP mission I had, I had a guy on the roof of a building, I decided he needed to come down into the building via ladder for that turn until everyone could climb up together with the VIP.
Next turn I send him right back up, there is a sectoid and a stun lancer up there now. So unless they can jump up buildings (I was guarding the only ways up both inside and outside.) that means that not only has Firaxis implemented very strict turn limits, but they are throwing in random spawns (non-tactical gameplay) on top of it. I can't agree that this makes the game 'more tactical' but instead it makes it more RNG, less tactical. The more random we make it, the closer it gets to roulette instead of chess. These turn limit things only force you to make your guys sprint across the map more often half the time running blind into fog of war to make objectives and/or run in guns blazing because why on earth spend turns setting up an ambush?

I have been playing with the modded turn times that adds 4 turns to every mission, and I often finish with 2-5 turns to spare, meaning that most of the time I only need 1 or 2 more turns sometimes I don't need it. But more importantly, I don't think anyone is wanting overwatch spam, it just sucks running your troops into the fog in a game with permadeath when the numbers are arbitrary. I figure each turn represents 45 seconds roughly. At 8 turns, that is a 6 minute mission. A 9 minute mission with 12 turns. I now play at 12 turns (9m) and 16 turns (12m). Still keeping the time for ADVENT response at 10-12 minutes instead of 7-10 minutes. Does it make it arbitrarily easier or does the Firaxis timers make it arbitrarily harder, that is certainly going to be a matter of preference. I just know I don't like speed completion determining the fail state and difficulty of a tactics/objective game.

 

[Zenja]

For example, an escort VIP mission I had, I had a guy on the roof of a building, I decided he needed to come down into the building via ladder for that turn until everyone could climb up together with the VIP.
Next turn I send him right back up, there is a sectoid and a stun lancer up there now. So unless they can jump up buildings (I was guarding the only ways up both inside and outside.)

Are you sure? Most buildings have a few pipes leading up the side of them plastered around the place.

I don't have a save file to go back and double check due to Ironman, but I am like 95% sure. (Other 5% is only there to admit, I may have missed something despite checking.) I did look though as this was extremely frustrating. Xcom EU had this problem during its launch too. It could have to do with patrols "hopping" around the map, a wall gets in the way mixed with that bug where if you jump off a 3 story building to the second story balcony, you often jump to the ground floor inside the building then warp to the 2nd story balcony. There is some type of glitch in the terrain just as Xcom EU had. The reason I went back down wasn't in fear of aliens showing up on the roof, that was secure...or so I thought. It was because a drop ship was coming with reinforcements in a place that could see on the roof, but would have been unable to get up, but could shoot up there. So the plan was to storm the roof next turn and have the high ground to clear a path to the extraction point.

I don't actually know how it happened, but something is wonky. There is a small margin that I totally overlooked a way up, but I highly doubt it as I looked and figured, "maybe they can jump up... can they?" Then later realized that I am pretty sure they can't. But I have also had a psizombie spontaneously catch on fire where there was no fire. I have also recently had an alien shoot a car on their turn once when they missed me and the car blew up at the end of their turn, not mine. While I am complaining... the level of horrendously unoptimized stuff Firaxis puts out highly disappointsd me. Especially, for turn based games and their AI isn't even smart they just cheat so what are they processing?

All that said I adore Xcom and will put many hours into it, but maybe we need to raise a bit of a stink about either optimization or the level of bugs in a turn based game. It's not like this game is as intricate and elaborate as Skyrim or Fallout. I speak of these shortcomings out of love and hope that they will improve the game, not to be cynical. I don't like to defend games, I like for the game to defend itself... and as much as I love Xcom, NONE of the games do a good job at defending themselves. I can excuse Bethesda because nobody even comes close to making sandboxes as big and interactive as theirs. I can name a list of turn based games that do better than Xcom, even indie studios. Then again I am also the type of guy that if the mod community fixes everything, I am ok with it and Firaxis gave us open modding this time around. I wish I knew how to mod.

 

[Pseudonym]

Maybe it's just me, but I'll take stun launchers over thinmen any day. Thin men in EU had high aim and crit chance, and light plasma rifles with extra aim and medium damage against my low health soldiers. They also jumped on buildings further increasing their hit chances. Run into enough of them without and sometimes even with carapace or skeleton armour and they were bound to get lucky shots in on your best units and kill them in one hit early in the game. These melee guys are a threath, but at least my soldiers recover from being knocked unconscious and as long as I am careful with my droid-medic, I'll just get them back up on their feet. (I play on commander/classic difficulty) Apparently flashbangs also work really well, I'll check those out.

Since I'm in an xcom2 thread anyway, I might as well ask. Maybe I just missed it stupidly but I was unable to find the ironman button in xcom 2 somehow. Can anyone tell me where it is?

 

[Zenja]

Since I'm in an xcom2 thread anyway, I might as well ask. Maybe I just missed it stupidly but I was unable to find the ironman button in xcom 2 somehow. Can anyone tell me where it is?

Right after you select difficulty and click the green button to start the game, two more green buttons show up. The top one starts the game on Ironman, the bottom one starts the game without Ironman.

 

[Thyunda]

I'll tell you what the real issue with XCOM2 is. The real big fucking issue.

Scotland inexplicably seceded from the UK during the invasion. Also, there are four accents from the British Isles and they're limited to the UK. I mean, I know it says UK English but I want my Irish soldiers to sound Irish.

 

[Salakayin]

I'll tell you what the real issue with XCOM2 is. The real big fucking issue.

Scotland inexplicably seceded from the UK during the invasion. Also, there are four accents from the British Isles and they're limited to the UK. I mean, I know it says UK English but I want my Irish soldiers to sound Irish.

Actually, to be fair to the first point, Scotland had it's own flag back in Enemy Unknown/Within as well. I remember such because I had a Scottish Support that was completely awesome at his job. So they've always had their own separate flag in these XCOMs.

 

[Lil_Rimmy]

Quick recommendation for all of you who don't like the current way missions go:

First off, there's a mod that increases turn timers by 4 and 2 depending on the mission, really nice. However, the BEST mod is that mod where timers only start ticking down if concealment is broken, meaning you have a really big reason to stay stealthy.

So that's nice, but I also increased squad size to 6 (and upgraded to 8 eventually) and upped enemy numbers because I prefer the Long War style. It feels a lot more fun when you don't literally wipe out half or more of your squad on a single lancer. God forbid if you get the amazing combo of 2 lancers and a sectoid that will rush and mind fuck you.

 

[Thyunda]

I'll tell you what the real issue with XCOM2 is. The real big fucking issue.

Scotland inexplicably seceded from the UK during the invasion. Also, there are four accents from the British Isles and they're limited to the UK. I mean, I know it says UK English but I want my Irish soldiers to sound Irish.

Actually, to be fair to the first point, Scotland had it's own flag back in Enemy Unknown/Within as well. I remember such because I had a Scottish Support that was completely awesome at his job. So they've always had their own separate flag in these XCOMs.

I know - but that doesn't make it better. Because it implies that the Scottish secession caused the invasion.

 

[Jandau]

What I'd like to know is why the hell is everyone obsessed with THE COMMANDER? Seriously, the early game is nothing but every character gushing about how awesome you are, how much they adore you, how many Bothans died to get them the info on your location and how everything is going to turn around now that you're here. WHY? Aren't you the guy who lost? Aren't you the chump who failed and let Earth get taken over? ***tiny early game spoiler ahead*** Even the Aliens are all aboard the fan-train, as they kept you alive for 20 years to run combat simulations in your super-brilliant tactical brain. To go with that, is it possible that everything that happened in mid-late game in the first XCOM is still "canon", only it's all a simulation that was run inside your head?

 

[Old Father Eternity]

I know - but that doesn't make it better. Because it implies that the Scottish secession caused the invasion.

"Quick, the Commonwealth of Nations is more splintered than ever, the time for invasion is nigh"
Now if only their supreme leaders were called The Tallest'

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Since I'm in an xcom2 thread anyway, I might as well ask. Maybe I just missed it stupidly but I was unable to find the ironman button in xcom 2 somehow. Can anyone tell me where it is?

You need to disable the tutorial.

Once the tutorial is disabled, starting a new campaign will prompt you for Ironman.

 

[DoPo]

WHY? Aren't you the guy who lost? Aren't you the chump who failed and let Earth get taken over?

You're also the one Earth trusted was qualified enough to stop the alien invasion. Nobody else seems to have stepped up - it seems that you're simply the best out there.