"You can't love animal's if you're not a vegetarian"

[MHR]

You can love animals while eating meat the same way you can love a woman while screwing another woman.

 

[Chris OBrien]

This was only a short while ago but I got to thinking about the pokemon world and how everything there is vegetarian or eats rocks, there's not one animal that eats meat even though clearly they are carnivorous in design. And in my head I wondered if every pokemon and human was vegetarian then wouldn't there not be enough food for everything and there'd be overpopulation in both humans and pokemon if there's no predators to keep the populations in check? Heck, the pokemon only fight once they have trainers. This must be the kind of world vegetarians and vegans want, but I just can't see a biologically designed organism as achieving our level of society and intelligence in such a world, we probably wouldn't even evolve past the plankton level.

Actually, you're wrong on several counts.

According to the Pokedex in the Anime, Farfetch'd are rare, because they were over-hunted due to being so delicious, especially when cooked with the leek they hold. Characters in the Anime also fantasize about Magikarp Sashimi. They're shown eating various meats, though no origin for them is given.

In-game Pokedex entries for several of bird Pokemon mention hunting for prey, including Bug Pokemon. The Fire Red Pokedex entry for Pidgeotto specifically mentions them eating Exeggcute. The Pokedex entry for Taillow specifically mention them eating Wurmple. In-game lore in Diamond and Pearl mention people eating Pokemon in the past, and say to release the bones down a river so the Pokemon can be reborn.

yeah, it may be true in the dialogue, but tell me, have you actually seen any character or pokemon actually eat meat? They may fantasize about it but I've only ever seen then have stew, minus meat, bread, and fruit, and heck, the pokemon most likely to be used for food is kept in the safari zone as an endangered species even when they clearly outnumber most other species. The pokemon themselves, at least in the anime, only appear to eat what looks like dog food, the junk food trainers carry, or fruit, and in rare cases maybe minerals. So far, I've yet to see an actual piece of meat in the mouths of humans or pokemon.

Then you should look at this:

[/quote]

but does any of what they're eating resemble a pokemon? practically the only animals they have in that world are pokemon, I haven't seen an actual chicken or lobster before. and if they don't have animals like we do, then that can't be meat, or at the very least, what they are eating is composed of pokemon not yet seen[/quote]


How much of the meat served as food in our world resemble the animal it comes from?


[QUOTE=FulfilledDeer][QUOTE=GTwander]How come nobody has really brought up that one fallacy that fish/seafood is ok because they don't have faces, beg for their lives or scream?

I seen a lot of shallow reasons as to why one death is worth more than another.[/QUOTE]

Wait, are you trying to point out vegetarians that think fish/seafood is okay are inconsistent? Because, yes, they are. But I'm not sure if vegetarianism proper encapsulates that idea.[/quote]

A person who eats fish or seafood is not a vegetarian. If that is the only meat/animal product they eat, they are pescatarians. The only reason there has ever been any confusion on the matter is because many people (usually Catholics) have been told that "fish isn't meat."

Calling a pescatarian a vegetarian is no more accurate than calling an average meat-eating human a "carnivore."[/quote]

I'm just going by what you've put on my plate so to speak, and to me, that meat that they are shoveling down looks like poultry and lobster. But from what you've shown, that food doesn't resemble any pokemon, and pokemon are the only animals of that world, I mean, the closest pokemon to resemble that food look like this:
[img src="http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/ken_sugimori/update1/085.png"]
and
[img src="http://www.pokemoncharacters.com/images/pokemon/342crawdaunt.gif"]

and these do not come close to what they're eating, the drumsticks alone would likely be two feet long and the entire table would be needed for a crawdaunt
just based on this information, I still believe that every living thing inside the pokemon world, up until they show it on screen, is vegetarian[/quote]

I don't necessarily disagree with you and I didn't post that image. I was just pointing out that just because the meat doesn't look like any discernible pokemon, doesn't mean it isn't.

But just for fun--

The drumsticks are probably from the Pidgey evolutionary family. The lobster could be crab, in which case it's probably from Krabby's family. To me, it looks a bit more like sausage, which could be from any number of pokemon that resemble boars or bovine.

Granted, humans produce food for vegetarians and vegans that are meant to look and taste similar to meat, so it's still reasonable to assume the pokemon universe is vegetarian. Still, members of Team Rocket were shown in the anime to attempt to catch and eat a Far Fetch'd. The issue was never explicitly addressed, but I think canon is that most humans in the Pokemon Universe are practicing omnivores (Ash frequently talks about hamburgers and Misty is seen eating a hot dog at least once).[/quote]

"The lobster could be crab" I just had to laugh at this
there's a big difference between the two and surely if it did come from Krabby's then it would either be a mutation or a krabby with a birth defect because true crabs do not have extended thoraxes

Captcha: "It's Super Delicious"
Quit reading my mind, I know that already[/quote]

You're assuming that whatever it is, it's the whole thing. I looks to me like claw meat that's been pulled from the exoskeleton.

 

[BNguyen]

This was only a short while ago but I got to thinking about the pokemon world and how everything there is vegetarian or eats rocks, there's not one animal that eats meat even though clearly they are carnivorous in design. And in my head I wondered if every pokemon and human was vegetarian then wouldn't there not be enough food for everything and there'd be overpopulation in both humans and pokemon if there's no predators to keep the populations in check? Heck, the pokemon only fight once they have trainers. This must be the kind of world vegetarians and vegans want, but I just can't see a biologically designed organism as achieving our level of society and intelligence in such a world, we probably wouldn't even evolve past the plankton level.

Actually, you're wrong on several counts.

According to the Pokedex in the Anime, Farfetch'd are rare, because they were over-hunted due to being so delicious, especially when cooked with the leek they hold. Characters in the Anime also fantasize about Magikarp Sashimi. They're shown eating various meats, though no origin for them is given.

In-game Pokedex entries for several of bird Pokemon mention hunting for prey, including Bug Pokemon. The Fire Red Pokedex entry for Pidgeotto specifically mentions them eating Exeggcute. The Pokedex entry for Taillow specifically mention them eating Wurmple. In-game lore in Diamond and Pearl mention people eating Pokemon in the past, and say to release the bones down a river so the Pokemon can be reborn.

yeah, it may be true in the dialogue, but tell me, have you actually seen any character or pokemon actually eat meat? They may fantasize about it but I've only ever seen then have stew, minus meat, bread, and fruit, and heck, the pokemon most likely to be used for food is kept in the safari zone as an endangered species even when they clearly outnumber most other species. The pokemon themselves, at least in the anime, only appear to eat what looks like dog food, the junk food trainers carry, or fruit, and in rare cases maybe minerals. So far, I've yet to see an actual piece of meat in the mouths of humans or pokemon.

Then you should look at this:

[/quote]

but does any of what they're eating resemble a pokemon? practically the only animals they have in that world are pokemon, I haven't seen an actual chicken or lobster before. and if they don't have animals like we do, then that can't be meat, or at the very least, what they are eating is composed of pokemon not yet seen[/quote]


How much of the meat served as food in our world resemble the animal it comes from?


[QUOTE=FulfilledDeer][QUOTE=GTwander]How come nobody has really brought up that one fallacy that fish/seafood is ok because they don't have faces, beg for their lives or scream?

I seen a lot of shallow reasons as to why one death is worth more than another.[/QUOTE]

Wait, are you trying to point out vegetarians that think fish/seafood is okay are inconsistent? Because, yes, they are. But I'm not sure if vegetarianism proper encapsulates that idea.[/quote]

A person who eats fish or seafood is not a vegetarian. If that is the only meat/animal product they eat, they are pescatarians. The only reason there has ever been any confusion on the matter is because many people (usually Catholics) have been told that "fish isn't meat."

Calling a pescatarian a vegetarian is no more accurate than calling an average meat-eating human a "carnivore."[/quote]

I'm just going by what you've put on my plate so to speak, and to me, that meat that they are shoveling down looks like poultry and lobster. But from what you've shown, that food doesn't resemble any pokemon, and pokemon are the only animals of that world, I mean, the closest pokemon to resemble that food look like this:
[img src="http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/ken_sugimori/update1/085.png"]
and
[img src="http://www.pokemoncharacters.com/images/pokemon/342crawdaunt.gif"]

and these do not come close to what they're eating, the drumsticks alone would likely be two feet long and the entire table would be needed for a crawdaunt
just based on this information, I still believe that every living thing inside the pokemon world, up until they show it on screen, is vegetarian[/quote]

I don't necessarily disagree with you and I didn't post that image. I was just pointing out that just because the meat doesn't look like any discernible pokemon, doesn't mean it isn't.

But just for fun--

The drumsticks are probably from the Pidgey evolutionary family. The lobster could be crab, in which case it's probably from Krabby's family. To me, it looks a bit more like sausage, which could be from any number of pokemon that resemble boars or bovine.

Granted, humans produce food for vegetarians and vegans that are meant to look and taste similar to meat, so it's still reasonable to assume the pokemon universe is vegetarian. Still, members of Team Rocket were shown in the anime to attempt to catch and eat a Far Fetch'd. The issue was never explicitly addressed, but I think canon is that most humans in the Pokemon Universe are practicing omnivores (Ash frequently talks about hamburgers and Misty is seen eating a hot dog at least once).[/quote]

"The lobster could be crab" I just had to laugh at this
there's a big difference between the two and surely if it did come from Krabby's then it would either be a mutation or a krabby with a birth defect because true crabs do not have extended thoraxes

Captcha: "It's Super Delicious"
Quit reading my mind, I know that already[/quote]

You're assuming that whatever it is, it's the whole thing. I looks to me like claw meat that's been pulled from the exoskeleton.[/quote]

well, I see a body (with segments - indicating an abdomen and thorax) and what looks to be two pincers

 

[Chris OBrien]

I don't like PETA but confrontational ads aren't the issue I have with them. If people want to support an industry, why shouldn't they be made to acknowledge the suffering they cause.

Because most people aren't causing it consciously or even really intentionally. There is no mens rae or even any sort of negligence in play. We are simply living for the way we have lived for many, many years.

I don't want to get too involved in your back and forth, but what you write here is exactly why PETA and others use those sort of tactics. Continuing to live a certain way just because you have previously is a poor justification for anything--i.e. slavery, the civil rights movement, women's suffrage, etc.

 

[BNguyen]

This movie shows what nature is about. It is in animal's nature to eat each other and humans are animals. it doesn't make animals wrong or evil. It's just nature

I find it amusing that this film was intended for children when blood, gore, and murder run rampant throughout it alongside frankly, quite disturbing imagry

 

[Starbird]

I don't like PETA but confrontational ads aren't the issue I have with them. If people want to support an industry, why shouldn't they be made to acknowledge the suffering they cause.

Because most people aren't causing it consciously or even really intentionally. There is no mens rae or even any sort of negligence in play. We are simply living for the way we have lived for many, many years.

I don't want to get too involved in your back and forth, but what you write here is exactly why PETA and others use those sort of tactics. Continuing to live a certain way just because you have previously is a poor justification for anything--i.e. slavery, the civil rights movement, women's suffrage, etc.

I'm not opposed to their motives. Well, most - trying to make people aware of their positions and the conditions of animals before we eat them is okay, but trying to force everyone to become vegetarian isn't.

What I'm opposed to are their methods, especially when it involves persecution of small business owners, physical assult on people wearing fur (yes, throwing red paint or blood all over someone in public is assualt) or guilt trip/grossout emotional tactics rather than actual argument.

Woman's rights and civil rights are an entirely different issue (since they involve human rights rather than animal rights) but even then attacking innocent people to get your point across isn't acceptable.

 

[AMMO Kid]

My dog is lying next to me. I just pet my dog a little because I love my dog. I'm not a vegetarian.

Myth debunked.

 

[Chris OBrien]

This movie shows what nature is about. It is in animal's nature to eat each other and humans are animals. it doesn't make animals wrong or evil. It's just nature

I find it amusing that this film was intended for children when blood, gore, and murder run rampant throughout it alongside frankly, quite disturbing imagry

Watership Down is about human beings. Using animals instead of humans is a literary device.

 

[Chris OBrien]

I don't like PETA but confrontational ads aren't the issue I have with them. If people want to support an industry, why shouldn't they be made to acknowledge the suffering they cause.

Because most people aren't causing it consciously or even really intentionally. There is no mens rae or even any sort of negligence in play. We are simply living for the way we have lived for many, many years.

I don't want to get too involved in your back and forth, but what you write here is exactly why PETA and others use those sort of tactics. Continuing to live a certain way just because you have previously is a poor justification for anything--i.e. slavery, the civil rights movement, women's suffrage, etc.

I'm not opposed to their motives. Well, most - trying to make people aware of their positions and the conditions of animals before we eat them is okay, but trying to force everyone to become vegetarian isn't.

What I'm opposed to are their methods, especially when it involves persecution of small business owners, physical assult on people wearing fur (yes, throwing red paint or blood all over someone in public is assualt) or guilt trip/grossout emotional tactics rather than actual argument.

Woman's rights and civil rights are an entirely different issue (since they involve human rights rather than animal rights) but even then attacking innocent people to get your point across isn't acceptable.

I don't agree with their methods either (certainly not assaulting people), but guilt trips and emotional tactics are actual arguments. They are arguments that appeal to pathos rather than logos. In other words, they pull on your sense of sympathy rather than rely on logic.

Regardless, I'm just pointing out that maintaining the status quo for no other reason other than because it is the status quo is asinine. No, animal rights is not the same as woman's rights... because they are different. Just like civil rights and women's rights are different. Just like child abuse and animal abuse are different. That's how an analogy works. You compare two unlike things and they inform each other.

If you focus on they ways the animal rights/welfare issue is unlike the women's rights or women's suffrage, you are missing the point. Before it became common knowledge that smoking cigarettes was incredibly unhealthy, many more people smoked than do today. How many people do you think made efforts to quit once they became informed about their behavior? I'm certain some disregarded the data at first, but we as a society have changed in response to the emergence of new information in the last forty years.

The point is, continuing to eat animals just because one has always eaten animals is no better a reason to do it than continuing to behave in any way merely because one has always behaved that way.

 

[ThunderCavalier]

It wasn't a joke, people have treated me like crap my whole life where as dogs tend to be far nicer so to me one puppy is worth more than a thousand babies.

Hey, that's your viewpoint and opinion. I can't really change that, can I?

Can't say I support you, but hey, if that's what you believe.

 

[Insanely Asinine]

"I saw someone spouting BS on facebook I should tell Escapist."

I love animals.. down to the bone.

Hell I love animals down to the marrow.

 

[Crazycat690]

Well, I eat meat but I while I like animals, I don't love all animals. Let me explain, I love cats, best animal ever, and I wouldn't eat a cat or an animal closely related to cats, but a cow? Don't get me wrong, I don't hate cows nor do I want them to suffer, but I have no problems eating meat from a cow.

Also, what about humans? I don't like humans, I like certain individuals, sure, but as a whole? Nah, still don't eat people, well I would rather eat a human than a cat, I can tell you that right here and now.... But there are three reasons I don't eat humans: 1. It's very illegal and would get me in trouble, 2. You're not able to buy human meat, meaning I'd have to kill and prepare the meat myself, and I couldn't do that with any of the other animals I eat so humans are no different, 3. Humans simply don't look tasty, at least IMO.

 

[Quaidis]

I don't hate the animals I consume. If anything, I respect them and thank their existence for being food on my plate and sustaining my life. In fact, I think it's a crime that some farms treat animals like factories treat cheap products - throwing them uncaring in tiny cages for their lives, similar to how puppy mills work. And damn those puppy mills.


Also, just because I eat one animal doesn't mean I eat them all. Putting 'animal' into a full category and judging someone from eating one creature as if they're intending to fully consume them all is rather ignorant in my opinion. Just because I dine on cattle does not mean I intend to eat sea cows. And I like both.

 

[TheMonkeysUnkle]

That is definitely one of the most idiotic ideas I've ever heard, and I've heard a lot of them.

 

[Shaved Apple]

I love animals and I'm not a vegetarian.

 

[RoBi3.0]

You can not love animals if you are not a vegetarian. <-------------- this is an absolute statement, which is bad. Why? Because, only a Sith deals in absolutes. All people that believe this statement are Sith and therefore a danger to the balance of the Force and will lead to the enslavement of all sentient life forms and eventually to destruction of the universe.

Radical Vegetarianism will be the death of us all. You have been warned.

 

[EvilRoy]

I don't like PETA but confrontational ads aren't the issue I have with them. If people want to support an industry, why shouldn't they be made to acknowledge the suffering they cause?

http://theconversation.edu.au/ordering-the-vegetarian-meal-theres-more-animal-blood-on-your-hands-4659

Forcing acknowledgement.

 

[MeatsOfEvil]

My parrot and I eat chicken together all the time. Nothing wrong with it.