Zero Punctuation: Deus Ex: Human Revolution

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Simonism451

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Oct 27, 2008
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Nocturnal Gentleman said:
To be honest I really didn't like this game. At no point did I feel total immersion despite wanting to badly. I didn't care for the stealth in this game. Tranquilizer darts and stun guns aren't "one size fits all" approaches. People would die if you used them on everyone. Plus when you take down people from the shadows everyone checks on the same pile of knocked out people. Can't anyone figure out the guy who's darting their friends is still in the area?

The character models also bothered me. Mostly because of their faces. Even if the person is supposed to be upset their expression can't change at all, so it just makes the entire scene comical. The voice acting also didn't help. Finally during stealth I can break stealth and shoot up people, then go back to stealth mode, and nobody brings up the fact that I was killing people in the building despite being caught by cameras occasionally.

Finally, I don't know about anyone else but the color scheme gave me a horrible headache. I didn't even want to play anymore after a while.

I will give this to the game though, the story was fairly interesting and the augmentation powers were somewhat fun. Especially the freaky looking wall break power.
Sorry, if that sounds insulting but: Really?
Yes, (some of) your points are correct, but really?
You know there's something called Willing suspension of disbelief, an ability needed to enjoy every piece of fiction.
Without it, you couldn't watch and enjoy the Star Wars films because you know that ,in Space, no one can hear your Death Star explode.
You couldn't play the beginning of Uncharted 2 because Drake would most likely cut his finger of while trying to climb up that hanging train.
And even in games as realistic and hardcore as the first Operation Flashpoint, the magic abilities of a medic to regrow legs apparently torn of by a grenade, would make every immersion impossible.

So ,if the fact that Tranqulizer darts (advanced future cyberpunk tranquilizer darts at that) would be a stupid idea to use on human enemies in real life turns you away from a video game, then I'd maybe consider sticking to documentaries and other non-fiction media.

This does not that there were no moments in the game that broke my sense of immersion (while it's nice and just plausible that some employees of Montréal based Picus Communication write some of their personal e-mails in (canadian) french, it leaves open the question why all citizens of upper and lower Hengsha city communicate digitally in English but often speak Mandarin on the streets), however after a minute or so I was able to take that as given and just continue to enjoy the surprisingly well fleshed-out world and the interesting quests.

And now onto something completly different:
To all you people out there saying that the way the endings were made is justified, "because we all know what happens in the original Deus Ex".
Screw you!
Screw
You!
Because that's the fan in you talking, believing that continuity or canon or whatever you might call it, is more important than the experience and choice of the player. You could hardly be more wrong. By supporting this mindset you are stripping videogames of their biggest advantage as a narrative medium: interactivity and choice.
I'm not saying that every game needs multiple endings or the illusion of free choice and there are enough good examples out there that prove that (the Uncharted or Prince of Persia series and many others), but if a game includes all those things, then the developers should have the balls to go through with it, even if it means declaring three of the four as "non-canon" and maybe upsetting a few fanboys.(It's not as if this didn't happen before, the evil ending of Bioshock leaves no way for Bioshock 2) However, if you make a choice and there are no consequences to that choice, then this choice is unimportant and therefore obsolete.
"Wait!" some of you will cry out "But can't that be used as a narrative tool, showing that one man can hardly change the fate of humanity as a whole and that our perception of interactivity in videogames is an illusion, while we are actually just following a handfull of slightly differently painted tubes, created by the developers."
Yes, you are right, a lack of choice or first creating and then brutally destroying the illusion of interactivity can be used for misguiding the player and get him to think, as popularly demonstrated by above mentioned Bioshock and its "Would you kindly...", but in this case I think you would be giving Eidos Montréal too much credit. This does not mean, that I am not confident that they could come up with something clever like that, their excellent world building shows that they might be interested in a bit more than just taking your money, while developing their games. It means that the way the endings were made are not convincing me to believe that they were intended that way. See, I have nothing against games that don't take me by the hand and repeat Every. Single. Plot. Point.(plot point plot point) three times for the slower ones of us, but I'm not going to suspect a deeper meaning behind something that seems to me more like simple lazyness.
If I'm wrong and Eidos actually wanted to show the limits of choice, then they could have made it a lot more clear without spelling every single letter of the actual meaning.
How about this:
Make a voiceover by a bitter old Jensen explaining that even though Darrow's unadultered confession caused an uproar and worldwide riots, the powers-that-be managed to discredit the video as a fake, painted the old man as a senile lunatic and put the blame for the augmentation malfunctions on a group of australian terrorists.
Or maybe let David Sarif explain, that even the widespread "NuPo-panic" wasn't enough to stop progress and the dangers of human augmentation were soon replaced by the fears of a newly rising terrorist threat.
And I want to know what happens to all the the characters that aren't in the original. I want to know what happens to the kidnapped scientists, I want to know what happens to Tai Yong Medical and the city of Hengsha after Zhao's death.
Fallout 2's ending told me about the fate of nearly every important location I visited and about what happened to my companions after the end of the game and that was more than ten years ago, surely with all our future space-man technology we are able to do something as simple and yet as effective as that again.
 

Nocturnal Gentleman

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Mar 12, 2010
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Simonism451 said:
Just because I have a very strict range of disbelief doesn't make it stupid. If you've seen people die from stun gun attacks you wouldn't take it as a harmless attack either. All the things I mentioned just ruined the experience for me. Simple as that. maybe it's petty to you but I don't care.

It's the very reason most tranquilizer or knock them out with a blunt object scenes annoy me elsewhere. That's not stealth. It's easy to kill people doing those things.

Also, not liking that doesn't mean I can't like star wars. Everything about stuff like that is fantastical. In no way does any of that pass like a version of reality. So if there is sound in space that doesn't bother me because so much isn't passing for fact anyway. Deus Ex is different. We can make robotic arms, we can use hormone manipulation, and there are real world conspiracies. While still an alternate world it passes itself as a more probable alternate world. It tries to show technology that we could probably make one day (sooner in their reality). So I take it much more seriously.

Besides the stealth bothered me so I didn't use it. Not the biggest issue. Not nearly as much as the face animations, voices, overall story, and color problems bothered me. Those problems made me take the game back.
 

Daemonate

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Jun 7, 2010
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BlackWidower said:
Daemonate said:
BlackWidower said:
Daemonate said:
To people who missed Yahtzee's point:
Is this your opinion or Yahtzee's opinion. If it's his opinion, why not just let him explain it, and if it's your opinion, why did you preface it with that line.

Daemonate said:
But is it as good as the game who shares its name? You know, that game whom many pundits consider to be one of, or in fact THE best game ever made? Well, not quite. But if you expected that, I think gaming in the modern age must be a long tortuous string of bitter disappointments
To expect that games get better overtime. That every game released is better than games that were released a decade ago is expecting disappointment? See, maybe it's just me, but I'd like to expect that people get better at their craft over time...not worse.
Wha..?? Yes, nice idea, but as I said; where have you been for the last ten years?

Games like Deus Ex, System Shock 2, Thief Metal Age, Planescape Torment, Baldur's Gate 2, Quakeworld, Tribes 2, etc, etc have not been bettered in their respective niches. They have scarcely been APPROACHED, let alone surpassed - and as Yahtzee points out, due to the strain of current-gen tech on development teams, they're simply never going to.

So, even when developers aren't getting worse - which due to larger team sizes, multi millio dollar budgets and and corporatisation of development houses, is par for the course - they can't do what they once did in terms of depth of gameplay and focus on particular elements.

So no, it isn't unreasonable to expect game developers to get better than what they are now, but it's ridiculous to expect them to suddenly get better than golden-age era games.
And you're saying we should just accept that and move on!? I'm sorry, but just because that's how things have gone for the past ten years doesn't mean we shouldn't complain about it.

Yes, I expect things to get better, and when they don't, which is frequently, I'll admit, I complain, and I will continue to complain.
Well, OK, even though I expect you will continue to be sadly disappointed. But you shouldn't go chiding DEHR for your unrealistic expectations - because then you become part of the problem. DEHR is one of the best steps to fixing what's been wrong with games this past decade. Is it there yet? No. But it IS one of the best games of the era. If you are overly critical of it, MORE critical of it than of a grey-ware tripefest that they didn't even try on, then the publishers get the message that they may as well no try and get things right.

And the game is FUN. It's really quite fun, and moving, and effective as a narrative, even if the earth didn't move as in the original, so harping on its faults is really mean-spirited and disingenuous.
 

BlackWidower

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Nov 16, 2009
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Daemonate said:
BlackWidower said:
Daemonate said:
BlackWidower said:
Daemonate said:
To people who missed Yahtzee's point:
Is this your opinion or Yahtzee's opinion. If it's his opinion, why not just let him explain it, and if it's your opinion, why did you preface it with that line.

Daemonate said:
But is it as good as the game who shares its name? You know, that game whom many pundits consider to be one of, or in fact THE best game ever made? Well, not quite. But if you expected that, I think gaming in the modern age must be a long tortuous string of bitter disappointments
To expect that games get better overtime. That every game released is better than games that were released a decade ago is expecting disappointment? See, maybe it's just me, but I'd like to expect that people get better at their craft over time...not worse.
Wha..?? Yes, nice idea, but as I said; where have you been for the last ten years?

Games like Deus Ex, System Shock 2, Thief Metal Age, Planescape Torment, Baldur's Gate 2, Quakeworld, Tribes 2, etc, etc have not been bettered in their respective niches. They have scarcely been APPROACHED, let alone surpassed - and as Yahtzee points out, due to the strain of current-gen tech on development teams, they're simply never going to.

So, even when developers aren't getting worse - which due to larger team sizes, multi millio dollar budgets and and corporatisation of development houses, is par for the course - they can't do what they once did in terms of depth of gameplay and focus on particular elements.

So no, it isn't unreasonable to expect game developers to get better than what they are now, but it's ridiculous to expect them to suddenly get better than golden-age era games.
And you're saying we should just accept that and move on!? I'm sorry, but just because that's how things have gone for the past ten years doesn't mean we shouldn't complain about it.

Yes, I expect things to get better, and when they don't, which is frequently, I'll admit, I complain, and I will continue to complain.
Well, OK, even though I expect you will continue to be sadly disappointed. But you shouldn't go chiding DEHR for your unrealistic expectations - because then you become part of the problem. DEHR is one of the best steps to fixing what's been wrong with games this past decade. Is it there yet? No. But it IS one of the best games of the era. If you are overly critical of it, MORE critical of it than of a grey-ware tripefest that they didn't even try on, then the publishers get the message that they may as well no try and get things right.

And the game is FUN. It's really quite fun, and moving, and effective as a narrative, even if the earth didn't move as in the original, so harping on its faults is really mean-spirited and disingenuous.
It's not unrealistic or unreasonable for an art-form to get better over time. I'll give you it's probably better than Gears of War or Call of Duty, but that's like saying it's better than a pile of horse shit! That's not the point. I think it should be better than what has came before it.
 

Arbre

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The boss fights of the first Deus Ex sucked big times. They were messy, short and required picking the biggest weapons and firing randomly.
If there was one thing Deus Ex is not worth remembering, it is those boss fights.
 

Ayjona

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Jul 14, 2008
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Even taking into account that Yahtzee has made hyperbolic judgement into an entirely new form of interpersonal communication, the simple facts mentioned in the review makes the game sounds absolutely awful, for those looking for an experience similar to Deus Ex.

While I won't waste much breath lamenting what modern console standards does to classic games, it would be nice if SOME new releases in classic franchises actually lived up to at least some of the hopes of fans of the original.
 

OldNewNewOld

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Mar 2, 2011
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I have some problems with this game.
i'm playing, or at least I tried to play it, but it's unplayable on my PC.

I have some crazy delay with my mouse. FPS is nice, everything works perfectly fine expect that the camera moves 0.5-1 second later. I tried everything, downloaded the latest patch but nothing helps.


Good thing I took the game from my friend to test it before buying it. :(


Also, this captcha is less and less readable. Soon I will need a bot to read it for me. :S
 

Undeadpool

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Aug 17, 2009
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I disagree with the notion that this game isn't a "true" RPG because you're good with all weapons. You're a damn ex-SWAT officer, it would make absolutely 0 sense if your character weren't proficient with rifles and pistols of all shapes and sizes. A game that gives you the supreme level of customization that this game gives you doesn't need to apologize for not having a "laser cannon specialization" skill tree that would only come up in the last third of the game (thanks Fallout "big gun" skill!).
Furthermore, I don't understand the hate that the boss fights get. I spec'ed stealth/hacking and still had no trouble with any of the bosses (the first one can be overcome by throwing barrels at him just like Dash O' Pepper always taught us, the second one can be mostly circumvented if you have the electricity immunity, which I got to explore, and the third one was fought without ANY of my augs and I still beat him. Oh and I hacked my way past the last boss). I find it very ironic that people who complain the loudest about the bosses being too "combat oriented" are also the ones who apparently weren't looking for any kind of solution other than "SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT!!!"
 

rosner1917

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Sep 17, 2011
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QUOTE: "DX:HR has far more profound questions to ask and answer than DX1"

I feel the urge to disagree vehemently. DX 1 had a wide range of topics, and a wide range of great, well written, thought provoking, philosophical dialogues. It talks about the structure of society, democracy, freedom, human condition and such. The "hidden" dialogue with the Morpheus A.I. is its crowning moment of awesome, personally.

The only "questions" HR asks is 'should I fuse my body with some mechanical thingy, or should I not?'. And the best the writers can come up with is "no, you will be no longer human at all!" or "yes, you will be more tham human!". Mundane is a euphemism to most of the bland, dull and plainly unispired dialogue from HR.

I miss Sheldon Pacotti. Greatly.
 

Air13ourn

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Feb 26, 2009
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While I understand that people are somewhat upset over the ending, as I was originally, there really is meaning to it. If we consider DE:HR to be a story driven game, that is.

At first I was kind of disappointed, why is there no conclusion, why is it just push a button and receive and ending, why couldn't it be a reflection of my actions?

But if I may, the ending is supposed to be the way it is, it isn't lazy writing. The entire concept is that the power of only a small few dictate how humanity will continue to exist, how much power they have over the world, how fast they can direct our thoughts through the media which is easily manipulated by them. Each ending was plausible with Adam's explanation, as well.

No conclusion with Adam or his friends is on the same level. The point of the game is about humanity and technology. It isn't about Adam, Pritchard, Megan, Sarif, or any specific person. If they made it more personal, the viewer would lose any worldly meaning.

But that's just how I feel about it.
 
Nov 12, 2010
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I just finished it. I must admit: it has weakened towards the end significantly, just like Yahtzee said. The endings were all moronic, because the premise for them was moronic. "Deus Ex" Helios ending will beat any of them any time. Also the final boss fight was... weird. Square Enix must have had a hand in it.

Still: gameplay-wise I think it's better than the original, even if half of the upgrades are useless.
 

Cyberjester

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Oct 10, 2009
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http://www.auger-loizeau.com/index.php?id=7

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cochlear_implant

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16315-invention-vision-amplifier.html?DCMP=OTC-rss&nsref=invention

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QComFWf0DUo 0:08

http://www.uniquepicturehunter.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/uvtattoostattoopicturespichunter-8.jpg

Coincidentally, also why Cyberpunk > Steampunk.
And why I should spend all my money on games as soon as I get it.

The debate over human augmentation has now ceased, except for those few unmodified nutjobs who we shall cast out of society for being boring.
 

Jungy 365

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Sep 13, 2010
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I don't know, I liked the ending somewhat, although I appreciate Yahtzee's stance on it, as it would be cooler if we saw bits of how the world continued. But to me, the four different endings felt necessary, as the game makes a point to not take sides, and encourages the player to think. After seeing what happened in this world, and what could happen, it's a good way of the player knowing what they took away from the experience. As far as moral choices go in games, one of the best, if lacking evidence of significant impact.
 

Killspre

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Aug 8, 2011
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I found Dues Ex HR incredibly mediocre and punishing you for whatever way I chose to play it. This game seems to reward the more stealthy except when it comes to the bosses where its more rewarding to have played it Gears of War style and when I chose to run and gun I felt like I was missing half the game. Upgrades are useless, most are just there to make small shortcuts appear in the game, while the rest do nothing really that helpful or needed. Invisibility? Not needed, guards are thick and easy to get away from. Typhoon? Not needed, only helpful if the surrounded your ass and if they did odds are you'll die before you even use it. There was even one for accuracy which you will never need because I was able to shoot people from across the room with my pistol. Would someone please also explain to me the mighty logic of how slitting a guys throat is somehow louder than breaking his arm, letting him scream, then punching him in the face? Story wise I never quite understood wtf I or the enemies I was killing were after. From what I could get they want me dead because I got to their hacker, and I want them dead for..I guess the love interest. I never get that feeling though he just seems to kill them because they try to kill him, in fact if they just gave him her he would probably let them on their way. Perhaps to appreciate this game you have to play Dues Ex, but overall its either and easy shooter or an easy stealth game never any middle ground to me.
 

charliesbass

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Feb 22, 2012
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I picked this up for 5 quid at HMV, despite all that Yahtzee said about it. Honestly, I was surprised. If I played a bit of it before day of release, I wouldn't of paid full price for it, but I would certainly of got it for 30 quid.