Zero Punctuation: Diablo 3

[DanHibiki]

I'd play diablo3 if I knew that there was a way to finish it, but there isn't you just play through once then get sucked in to an endless grind and upgrade cycle that will end when Blizzard unleashes it's cyber army and destroys the earth.

 

[TheFederation]

i kinda thought that he wouldn't like this game

 

[Furbyz]

I could be wrong, but I think part of the idea of randomly generated dungeons is, besides replayability, is that your experience will be different than your friend's experience so you can stand around the water cooler comparing.

Yeah, just a question since I dont have the game.

Does the dungeon "design" change the gameplay the slightest? Or will you still just keep moving forward and clicking on the enemy to kill it.

Frozen Synapse uses random generated levels and they make sense for the style of game that it is. It does matter if the rooms are small or big due to the classes in the game

Speaking as someone who's made it all the way into inferno(ridiculously difficult highest difficulty where everyeone's tactic is this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEyk63UaBI4 ), the random generation does matter. It's not just the dungeons, literally everything, including the tactics of what you fight, is randomly generated.

Where the open space, choke points, and high ground in relation to the champion packs and what those champions spawned with can make hard fights much easier or vice versa.

Yahtzee actually might have liked the multiplayer in this. Pretty much no one ever speaks and the amount of monsters multiplies to the point where if you're alone you might get a teeny challenge even on Normal. Might.

 

[Dr Jones]

You can fully customise your action bars by havingboth evil dogs and the ability tomake enemies shit themselves.

Options -> Gameplay -> Bottom Right Option whose name I forget because it's a shit term.


It's a shame Blizzard doesn't exactly tell anyone this. The only way you discover this is by accident or Chinese Whispers; which is what i'm doing now, rather a CHINESE SHOUT.

He mentions that in the credits.

 

[Yahtzee Croshaw]

I'll take this quotes thank you:

"Sorry, can't hear you over the sound of all my money~♫!"

 

[Emiscary]

Thank you for taking the piss out of disproportionately popular things Mr. Croshaw.

 

[irishda]

Correction, it has a typical Metzen style ending...that is to say the usual, cliched high fantasy, chosen one, save the world and create rainbows and puppies ending.
The previous games didn't. Diablo 1 and 2 had pretty murky bittersweet endings and D2's expansion ended on a cliffhanger with it heavily hinted that your actions only made things worse.
Diablo always had a somewhat peversely satisfying approach in that way...no matter how well you do you always lose somehow in the end. Pretty fitting for gothic/pseudo-low fantasy.
Then 3 came along with a new writer, bucked out all the old tropes and story style and inserted generic black and white, chosen one saves teh wurld plot # 460175

Game's good enough, if you don't like dungeon crawlers it won't make you like them though.

Correction, most Blizzard games have a Metzen ending. Metzen's been involved with most of the stories for the games ever since Warcraft 2. And ALMOST ALL Blizzard games have pretty much had bittersweet endings, especially when taken with their expansion packs.

Spoiler: Spoiler for pretty much all Blizzard games since 1995

WC2 has most of Azeroths greatest heroes are trapped in Outland facing destruction. WC3 has most of the world ravaged by the Legion and Arthas becoming the Lich King. Starcraft has Aiur being destroyed by the zerg. Kerrigan beating both the UED and the Protoss. And Mengsk instills a new dictatorship.
Diablo the hero is the new vessel for Diablo. Diablo 2 the Prime Evils succeed in corrupting the World Stone, with unknown consequences for the world when it's destroyed.

Diablo 3 is a conclusion (probably), the ending probably isn't going to be bittersweet, otherwise people would complain that it wasn't very conclusive. Or they'd be pissed cause it's an obvious hint at another sequel.

That's what I hate the most about video game stories, no ones ever happy if the story evolves or if the characters grow. They want the status quo. Take the Sands of Time trilogy. Everyone ragged on the Prince's "darker" look despite the fact that he was constantly hunted and it was clear after the third one that he had begun to develop his darker half at that time.

 

[Chairman Miaow]

I'm waiting till the real money auction house opens up and if it's really that good to buy Diablo 3. Hopefully I'll be able to make it a second job.

I think somewhere they said that it is going to be suspended indefinitely due to player concerns about it.

and so the reason for always online is?....

 

[Darth_Payn]

I agree that Bellial can suck my chicken.

Is that what the kids call it now?
But yeah, this was another funny review and Take That to Blizzard. Best line: "I can't hear you over the sound of all my MONEY!!!"

 

[beefpelican]

I could be wrong, but I think part of the idea of randomly generated dungeons is, besides replayability, is that your experience will be different than your friend's experience so you can stand around the water cooler comparing.

My wall was over there and a shirt with +1 dropped.

-Really? Mine was over here and pants with +1 dropped.

Did you fight that boss and do that one story bit?

-Well... yeah... But the path there was... different, I guess. Sort of.

If they made it at all like Diablo 2, then sometimes you won't even fight some bosses, or have some quests available, because they weren't generated. It does make for different games.

But the core experience is the exact same.

It's a silly concept if you're not going to go all the way with it. The little shit they change is so pointless and comes down to little more than varying distractions along the grind fest to Hell.

"I got the quest to find the sign at the bottom of the first dungeon!"

"Well I got the quest to kill the guy at the bottom of the first dungeon!"

Riveting.

This is a fact. Personally I prefer a game with a well designed map that seems in some way related to the function of the building. Like the factories in Fallout 3, for instance. They were all kind of samey (they were factories) but their design seemed like an actual building that people would work in, and the fact that it was made by a person, rather than randomly generated from tiles, allowed the designers to throw in little hints of a world beyond the one you actively experience. (Ex. a locked door, behind which you find a corpse with a shotgun, a bunch of bullets, and empty cans of food). That sort of implied story makes me care about the world.

That said, what I just described has to do with my own preferences, which tend towards story heavy games. Diablo is not one of these. It's more of a hacky slashy turn monsters into pulp and time into wonderfully wasted time sort of a game. For that, a randomly generated dungeon causes players to play different tactical situations (monsters from both sides rather than one, teleporting monsters rather than extra strong ones, skeletons rather than zombies) every time they boot up the game. Given that these situations are the focus of the game, randomization of maps and enemies allows many more of them to exist, as an algorithm can generate a whole lot more situations than a human. Personally I don't like it as much as a human touch, but I understand the usefulness all the same.

Also, I like that 'inferior pants' is an actual item description in Diablo. Though the "Superior Leather Pants of Thorns' are my favorite random drop thus far. Simply due to the extreme discomfort anyone wearing them would have.

 

[tautologico]

If they made it at all like Diablo 2, then sometimes you won't even fight some bosses, or have some quests available, because they weren't generated. It does make for different games.

There are lots of optional dungeons and events (side quests) that may or may not appear in each playthrough, and I think you can't get all of them in a single playthrough, so there is a little more change than just rearranging rooms.

 

[elvor0]

I'm waiting till the real money auction house opens up and if it's really that good to buy Diablo 3. Hopefully I'll be able to make it a second job.

You can only get diablo dollars to spend on diablo again, can't make it out to your bank account.

Problem?

That that isn't true? You can take it out of the game through paypal. Otherwise what would be the point in the difference between the RMAH? "Diablo dollars" are gold ¬¬. And the fact that Blizzard takes a cut is normal; Ebay does it, As do most real life Auction houses, k'know to pay for the cost of the servers/selling it for you.

I could be wrong, but I think part of the idea of randomly generated dungeons is, besides replayability, is that your experience will be different than your friend's experience so you can stand around the water cooler comparing.

My wall was over there and a shirt with +1 dropped.

-Really? Mine was over here and pants with +1 dropped.

Did you fight that boss and do that one story bit?

-Well... yeah... But the path there was... different, I guess. Sort of.

If they made it at all like Diablo 2, then sometimes you won't even fight some bosses, or have some quests available, because they weren't generated. It does make for different games.

I remember on one playthrough of the first Diablo I didn't have to fight the Butcher.

You always have to kill the Butcher in Diablo 1--it's a main story quest.

Well one time I didn't. Don't ask me to explain it, 'cause I don't really understand it either.

You most certainly do NOT have to always kill the Butcher in Diablo 1. The first main quest you get is random between three different ones.

Killing the Butcher, which gives you his cleaver, Killing the Skeleton King Leoric, which gives you his crown, and purifying the contaminated well by clearing out a cave of monsters, which gives you a ring.

Just as an aside, playing multiplayer results in absolutely no fighting over shiny pants because everyone generates their own pants. You can't see or pick up each others pants, though you can trade.

And that said, yes, I also hate the always online requirement for single player. "Oh you're playing solo? TOO BAD, SERVER MAINTENANCE."

Oh the server maintenance is a pain in the arse anyway, not the fixing stuff or actual issues, but the fact they go down every Tuesday at 2-11, I understand it for WoW, but why for D3?

 

[Hexenwolf]

I could be wrong, but I think part of the idea of randomly generated dungeons is, besides replayability, is that your experience will be different than your friend's experience so you can stand around the water cooler comparing.

My wall was over there and a shirt with +1 dropped.

-Really? Mine was over here and pants with +1 dropped.

Did you fight that boss and do that one story bit?

-Well... yeah... But the path there was... different, I guess. Sort of.

If they made it at all like Diablo 2, then sometimes you won't even fight some bosses, or have some quests available, because they weren't generated. It does make for different games.

I remember on one playthrough of the first Diablo I didn't have to fight the Butcher.

You always have to kill the Butcher in Diablo 1--it's a main story quest.

Well one time I didn't. Don't ask me to explain it, 'cause I don't really understand it either.

You most certainly do NOT have to always kill the Butcher in Diablo 1. The first main quest you get is random between three different ones.

Killing the Butcher, which gives you his cleaver, Killing the Skeleton King Leoric, which gives you his crown, and purifying the contaminated well by clearing out a cave of monsters, which gives you a ring.

Just as an aside, playing multiplayer results in absolutely no fighting over shiny pants because everyone generates their own pants. You can't see or pick up each others pants, though you can trade.

And that said, yes, I also hate the always online requirement for single player. "Oh you're playing solo? TOO BAD, SERVER MAINTENANCE."

 

[Abedeus]

What a surprise. He found the boring, shit game the with forced online, both boring and shit and hated the forced online.

Quick question.

You played it?

Yes? Okay, I guess your OPINION is that it's bad.

No? Shut the hell up and don't judge things without knowing them, thanks.

I hope he didn't actually pay blizzard money to review the boring, shit game the with forced online. That would be contributing to more boring, shit, forced online games.

Something with Blizzard haters is and their love for boredom and fecal matter...

But obviously Blizzard made the game online-only because they hate people and they LOVE having to maintain server for characters and crucial game data unavailable in the client to prevent dupers and hackers breaking the game like they did in Diablo 2.

I still don't get why people who didn't play any of the sequels review THIRD game in the series. That's like reviewing Lord of the Rings: Return of the King without watching or reading previous chapters.

"So, this dumb halfling thing called... Fredo... or something... takes a magical... ring that... gives him magical powers... and has to destroy it by throwing into the core of the planet.. and the sun... or something... ANYWAY IT'S SHIT CAUSE IT'S LONG AND HARD TO READ/WATCH."

FYI - Normal Mode is easy on purpose. D2's normal was also very easy. You could finish it in a matter of hours, and with friend's help, you could hit level 80 in 4-5 hours and get to Hell difficulty. Dungeons are randomly generated for the purpose of multiple play-throughs, either due to difficulty levels or different characters.

I really, really can't understand how he can criticize not having melee attacks on a caster (despite being able to... remove that left-click and get normal attacks, if he did research).

"Hurr, I'm a squishy mage with almost no health or defense or melee abilities... I'LL SWING MY DAGGER AT THEM". For that exact reason, Normal Mode is easy... people going into melee with casters on purpose.

Seems to me like this is one of the most forced, uneducated, prejudiced reviews he's had to date.

 

[Hugga_Bear]

If they made it at all like Diablo 2, then sometimes you won't even fight some bosses, or have some quests available, because they weren't generated. It does make for different games.

All the quests are available always in Diablo 2 and all the Uniques are in the same place (random 'bosses' are random and not really bosses, just tough guys with mean friends). Diablo 2 randomly generated maps and enemies from a pre-set list but the quests and the run of the quests (vague map, reward, end boss of quest) was always the same...

Always online is ridiculous, though Yahtzee need not fear people stealing his shiny trousers online, since drops are individual (a feature I really do like). He noted that you can change buttons in the credits so that complaint is out.
The randomly generated maps is for replay, it's more fun to go through a different map layout than the same one every time (gambling principle? I'm not sure, it just is for me anyway). When you're looking for shiny things (definitely gambling principle) it helps.

I enjoy the game, I think I preferred Diablo 2 but thinking about the Diablo 2 I first played and the V1.10 expansion I actually loved...I'm willing to give D3 time. The always online DRM can go suck a donkey though, I hate it. I don't know what the solution is that they're looking for but it's certainly not that. Goddammit I want to be able to play offline as well.

 

[Abedeus]

I'm waiting till the real money auction house opens up and if it's really that good to buy Diablo 3. Hopefully I'll be able to make it a second job.

I think somewhere they said that it is going to be suspended indefinitely due to player concerns about it.

and so the reason for always online is?....

Files necessary for dupers, hackers and other scum that destroyed D2 economy are server-side. You can't access them through client, you "borrow them" for your session. You only have textures, sounds, videos. They have item data, monster data, affixes, prefixes, item properties and so on. You can't even make a maphack because you don't have map data.