Adam Sessler and his God of War Ascension Review: Bro's Before Ho's

[Smolderin]

So Adam Sessler just posted his review of God of War Ascension today on youtube. For those of you who don't know, he was the former host of G4's X-Play but is now working for Rev3Games. I have been watching Sessler for years now and I highly respect his opinion. He pointed out alot of good things about God of War Ascension, but one bit of critisism he pointed out was rather interesting. The link to the video is below, but for those who are to lazy, I wrote what he said down below.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjIpPUE8epA

"There is one more depressing aspect of God of War Ascension. After the very best boss battle in the game, there is a cut scene which displays one of the most violent things I have ever seen in a video game. It is Kratos, boot stomping a Furies face in. While the image of a woman's face being kicked in is borderline, the overall dark nastiness of the franchise, and it's lack of gender role outside the famous sex scenes, kept it just inside a tonal context. But following the conclusion of the cutscenes, you get a trophy.....this one (*shows image of a playstation trophy*) Bro's before Ho's. This gut punch of misogyny irredeemably sours this game and is shocking to see a talented developer with traffic in such a contemptible attitude. I have always liked the adult fantasy of the God of War games, in all it's overall silliness, and in this moment, it is reduced to frat house joke making it making me ashamed for thinking that it was ever more than that in the first place".

-Adam Sessler

I was actually curious to see what the escapist community had to say about this, if they have anything to say about it at all. Do you agree with him? Do you think he is reading to deep into it? Post your thoughts below.

EDIT: Remember guys, Sessler's problem wasn't with the violence itself, it was with the achievement you get after the event of the violence.

 

[StriderShinryu]

Having not played the game (and having not had any plans to play it either way), I can't speak from personal experience. I do, however, think he makes a very good point. Within the context of the a, many things can be appropriate. Just take a gander at the current forum topic where the idea of a player character that commits rape is being discussed for an example. Once you get into out of game factors like achievements or marketing, that context goes away very quickly. Getting an achievement for beating a boss is fine. In fact, it's pretty much expected. But there's no reason why the developers had to title it as they did. I doubt it was intended as deliberately misogynistic, but it was still a pretty stupid decision.

 

[Phasmal]

Well that's pretty fuckin' dumb.
But, to be honest, I do think God of War IS a `frat house joke`.

Inb4 OMG WHY DO PEOPLE HAVE OPINIONS ABOUT THIS AND WHY CAN'T THEY JUST BE COOL ABOUT THIS LIKE I AM?!??!

 

[shrekfan246]

EDIT: Redacted, because I really don't feel like getting quoted a million times while I'm asleep.

Yes, the use of the term is stupid.

Especially because Kratos, as a character, wouldn't put his 'bros' before any hypothetical 'hos', and would likely kill everyone indiscriminately.

But the use of a stupid frat-house term doesn't automatically make something misogynistic.

 

[Daystar Clarion]

Would he have had the same issue had the boss been male?

If no, then he's reaching for offense, and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

If yes, then he's misusing the term "misogyny", and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

This.

Sometimes I think people just want to be outraged at something, no matter how petty it is.

 

[Phasmal]

Would he have had the same issue had the boss been male?

If no, then he's reaching for offense, and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

If yes, then he's misusing the term "misogyny", and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

This.

Sometimes I think people just want to be outraged at something, no matter how petty it is.

Eh.
Should the question really be `If the context were different, would it be different?` (because, well, duh)?
I would have thought the question would be `considering the context, is that a dumb thing to call a trophy?`.

I would say yes, but I'm hardly outraged, this shit is the background noise of being in this community.
Either way, it's all the same to me, GoW isn't exactly courting my interest to begin with.

 

[Smooth Operator]

Well better keep them torches lit and pitchforks sharp we got another angry mob meeting soon.
Yes someone put in a childish expression ... doesn't mean it's the end of the world or that they intended malice.

But hey witch hunts are just more fun, oh I'm sorry that was terribly sexist of me, I mean "hunting people of magic capabilities that may be either gender".

 

[Daystar Clarion]

Would he have had the same issue had the boss been male?

If no, then he's reaching for offense, and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

If yes, then he's misusing the term "misogyny", and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

This.

Sometimes I think people just want to be outraged at something, no matter how petty it is.

Eh.
Should the question really be `If the context were different, would it be different?` (because, well, duh)?
I would have thought the question would be `considering the context, is that a dumb thing to call a trophy?`.

I would say yes, but I'm hardly outraged, this shit is the background noise of being in this community.
Either way, it's all the same to me, GoW isn't exactly courting my interest to begin with.

I'd say it was pretty dumb, but I would also spend around 3 seconds thinking that.

If you're gonna get worked up over something, then get worked up over something.

 

[Phasmal]

I'd say it was pretty dumb, but I would also spend around 3 seconds thinking that.

If you're gonna get worked up over something, then get worked up over something.

Well, nobody is really making a fuss about it, but it's silly to say it has to be outrage or nothing.

I think it'd probably be better for everyone if we can just go `loldumb` without anyone having to get mad or feel persecuted over nothing.

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

Some times I think that the time we will truly reach equality is when we can be subjected to fictional depictions of both men and women being brutally killed and be equally appalled/indifferent/outraged/uncaring/aroused by both. As someone has already said, Sessler probably wouldn't have cared at all if this was some guy-monster getting its' face kicked in instead of a girl-monster, which might suggest *he* ought to think about his own ideals concerning gender.

But yeah, the name of the trophy is kind of stupid.

 

[shrekfan246]

Would he have had the same issue had the boss been male?

If no, then he's reaching for offense, and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

If yes, then he's misusing the term "misogyny", and honestly I would think Sessler would be better than that.

This.

Sometimes I think people just want to be outraged at something, no matter how petty it is.

Eh.
Should the question really be `If the context were different, would it be different?` (because, well, duh)?
I would have thought the question would be `considering the context, is that a dumb thing to call a trophy?`.

I would say yes, but I'm hardly outraged, this shit is the background noise of being in this community.
Either way, it's all the same to me, GoW isn't exactly courting my interest to begin with.

The only part of the context I was changing is the gender of the boss in question.

My question was assuming everything about the context was the same, except for the gender. Same name for the trophy (though using a slightly different meaning, I suppose, since it would more be implying killing 'bros' before something else involving 'hos'), same boss-fight, same boot-stomping cut-scene afterwards, but male boss instead of female.

Because if you don't still find it offensive or anything in that case, then I believe you're reaching to find offense in this case.

And if you do still find offense, then it's not because this particular situation is "misogynistic", as Sessler felt the need to throw in to his assessment.

Bash it because it's stupid, sure, but there was no need for him to throw caution to the gender-war wind like that.

 

[Phasmal]

Shrekfan for some reason I cant quote you atm.
But if the boss was male the phrase `Bros before Hos` wouldnt make any freaking sense so of course it would be different.
Either way, I've said my bit and I'm kinda out on this.
EDIT: Also, you can't reliably genderswap things like this when you have to consider the context surrounding gender in this community anyway. But yeah. It's silly, but nothing to get upset about.

 

[Fappy]

Well that's pretty fuckin' dumb.
But, to be honest, I do think God of War IS a `frat house joke`.

Inb4 OMG WHY DO PEOPLE HAVE OPINIONS ABOUT THIS AND WHY CAN'T THEY JUST BE COOL ABOUT THIS LIKE I AM?!??!

Yeah... I didn't realize people actually took this franchise seriously >.>

OT: I guess within the context of the graphic man-on-woman brutality it's pretty fucked up, but I think some light gender-related humor isn't something we should shy away from. I'm by no means defending God of War in this regard (it treats women about how Greek myths do within and without the context of the actual game), but I do fear that we're getting a bit too squeamish when it comes to gender relations in gaming. For example:

"While the image of a woman's face being kicked in is borderline..."

Why is this borderline? It fits the thematic vision of GoW's overtly violent set pieces. Why should it matter if it's an ugly man's face or a pretty woman's? What difference does it make? Kratos isn't getting off on it nor (I assume) is the Fury a helpless victim, but rather Kratos' enemy.

Also, a bit off topic but this reminded me of the fact that the BlazBlue franchise has some hilarious achievement names. There's an achievement for running Relius' Ignis gauge to 0 called "Domestic Battery". It is a brilliant play on words because Ignis is a robot/puppet version of his wife who has had the energy beaten out of her XD

 

[jcfrommars9]

Adam Sessler is reading too deeply into it in my opinion. It's well known in the series, that man, woman or creature, it makes no difference to Kratos as he alludes to. And frankly, that Fury isn't the only person whose face Kratos smashes in the series or even in Ascension. Given the nature of the battle between Kratos and that particular Fury, "Bros before Ho's" seems fitting.

 

[Luca72]

Well that's pretty fuckin' dumb.
But, to be honest, I do think God of War IS a `frat house joke`.

Inb4 OMG WHY DO PEOPLE HAVE OPINIONS ABOUT THIS AND WHY CAN'T THEY JUST BE COOL ABOUT THIS LIKE I AM?!??!

Pretty much. I think the God of War fanbase has more crossover with the COD/GOW crowd than anyone else. I think Sony knows what kind of audience they're making this game for. That moment will get a couple of laughs and high fives and then be immediately forgotten.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

But if the boss was male the phrase `Bros before Hos` wouldnt make any freaking sense so of course it would be different.

IMO it doesn't make any sense regardless of the boss' gender. Kratos would need bros for that. Being the omnicidal ball of generic rage that he is, any and all prospects tend to expire rather quickly.

Anyway, stupid trophy name is stupid.

 

[jcfrommars9]

Guys! Guys! Guys!

It's not the actual violence itself Sessler's critical of. It's the trophy you get afterwards. The trophy which says Bro's before Ho's. The trophy that squarely frames the violence in gendered terms.

Look, I know some of you hate the feminazis, and think any attempt at gender debate is "OMG stop overreacting!" but please read or listen to what is beign said here. Sessler clearly says that the act itself was not what he had an issue with, as it is pretty standard for the God Of War series. Anyone remember how Kratos kills Hera in GOW3? The issue here is the way the game rewards you for doing so in a way that roots the act squarely in misogynistic terms.

I know this prolly won't change anything, but I hope the majority of Escapists here are able to differentiate between what they think is being said, and what is actually being said.

I can tell the difference. But all the same, It's just a play on words. Nothing misogynistic intended. Particularly considering what the Fury did to Kratos before he started stomping on her face.

 

[lord canti]

I'll give Adam some credit if he makes a fuss over the widow maker trophy in Tomb Raider.