Advanced RPGs?

[Tallim]

Disgaea? The calculation system is very odd, but the levels go up to 9,999 and you can reincarnate the characters multiple times, just to build better stat growth each time. Plus you can level items, weapons, armor, and so on. It also easily lasts over 300 hours, and there's a ton of character classes (many that have to be unlocked), and uniques you'll get as you go through the story. And that's not even touching on the skills evilities systems.

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

I think your missing the point of why a lot of people don't like JRPG's.
There's just too much stuff, all the list's and list's of endless items and spells, i find it to be too much.

On saying that some people like that and i suppose that's up to them.

But the OP said they wanted a complex rpg. You will struggle to find a western one.

Of course there are always Roguelikes.

 

[child of lileth]

Disgaea? The calculation system is very odd, but the levels go up to 9,999 and you can reincarnate the characters multiple times, just to build better stat growth each time. Plus you can level items, weapons, armor, and so on. It also easily lasts over 300 hours, and there's a ton of character classes (many that have to be unlocked), and uniques you'll get as you go through the story. And that's not even touching on the skills evilities systems.

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

One day I will have to play that though I believe it has childish voice acting which is a turn off. I'm not against JRPGs but I find the lack of choice well, meh.

There's this thing called an options menu that lets you switch the voices. Or is that too Japanese for all of you too? God forbid there be such a thing as variety.

Besides that, if you play Disgaea (any of them) for the story, your doing it wrong. It's all 100% skippable, and mostly pointless anyway.

 

[Weaver]

Disgaea? The calculation system is very odd, but the levels go up to 9,999 and you can reincarnate the characters multiple times, just to build better stat growth each time. Plus you can level items, weapons, armor, and so on. It also easily lasts over 300 hours, and there's a ton of character classes (many that have to be unlocked), and uniques you'll get as you go through the story. And that's not even touching on the skills evilities systems.

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

Hold on, that sounds like the best RPG ever made!

JRPG bias be damned! I want that game!

I like Disgaea, but it's barely an RPG. There is an inventory system, but it's shallow. The majority of the game is just playing on all these battlefields. It's more of a turn based strategy game than an RPG. There is basically nothing to explore and the plot is paper thin and largely ignorable.

To me an RPG needs to have a lot of exploration and a solid story driving it. If we just have loot and people leveling up as criteria for an RPG then almost every game is an RPG. Disgaea is 95% in the TBS genre and 5% in the RPG genre in my opinion. It's also a massive, massive grind fest.

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TO OP

Nethack is hard and fun.

If you want something cool play Betrayal at Krondor. It's old as hell and looks like ass, but it I remember it being very complicated.

 

[Cheefa_Da_Reefa]

try oblivion(play a monk makes the game really fun ), morrowind fallout3 and try some of the persona games....(its jrpg but change is good>_< )

 

[Fbuh]

Well, it seems to me if you are looking for something new, then you should try a couple of jrpgs. Lost Odyssey was actually pretty good, despite the general air of hate that seems to surround jrpgs.

 

[Grey_Focks]

I see some people saying Disgaea...I was told the same thing. Do you like grinding? Lots and lots of grinding? If so, then it just may be for you. If not, you'll hate every second of it. And I'm sorry, but I need an RPG to have a story, or if not then have fun/rewarding gameplay. Disgaea had neither, and as such I cannot recommend it to anyone other than hardcore JRPG fans who enjoy grinding.

OT: Dragon Age was too simple for you? Never heard that one before. I suggest you find some willing friends, and start playing DnD then. I hear 4th edition is quite new player friendly, but most old time DnD players hate it, seemingly for all the reasons that make it so accessible to new players.

 

[child of lileth]

Disgaea? The calculation system is very odd, but the levels go up to 9,999 and you can reincarnate the characters multiple times, just to build better stat growth each time. Plus you can level items, weapons, armor, and so on. It also easily lasts over 300 hours, and there's a ton of character classes (many that have to be unlocked), and uniques you'll get as you go through the story. And that's not even touching on the skills evilities systems.

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

One day I will have to play that though I believe it has childish voice acting which is a turn off. I'm not against JRPGs but I find the lack of choice well, meh.

There's this thing called an options menu that lets you switch the voices. Or is that too Japanese for all of you too? God forbid there be such a thing as variety.

Besides that, if you play Disgaea (any of them) for the story, your doing it wrong. It's all 100% skippable, and mostly pointless anyway.

I didn't know...sorry?

I enjoyed Lost Odyssey and Enchanted Arms, as I said I like JRPGs but I admit that WRPGs do appeal more to me (obviously as you know).

Just saying.

If someone has a legitimate reason to hate a game, or a genre of games, that's fine. But laziness isn't an excuse. That would be like me saying every Western RPG is like Harry Potter, without me at least trying a few of them to say specifically what I don't like about each example. They obviously aren't all like that, and it would be ignorant to say so. Just like how people say every game ever is just like Final Fantasy. It's ignorant, and with my example, the people that first quoted me obviously never even saw a screen shot, or watched any kind of gameplay. Let alone tried the game out before they decided it must be shit.

 

[child of lileth]

I've seen gameplay so I was aware of the crap voice overs so that makes me not ignorant!

Go scapegoats! Wooh!

I meant that part as just a general thing of how ignorant the usual Western bias people are (read: the first guy to quote me in this thread), not specifically at you. That's my fault for not being clear about that in the other post.

 

[Kuranesno7]

Deus Ex?

 

[Slaanax]

Temple of Elemental Evil, go to Co8.org it has all the patches and updates you need to play the game effectively even on windows 7.

 

[child of lileth]

Disgaea? (Snip)

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

That was my thought...
It sucks that people like the OP, who crave complicated RPGs, are so close minded to any game particular genre that would probably suit them. I guess it's just "cool" for the kids to hate on JRPGs these days.... sigh.

OP:
Like the above: Disgaea
Moar SRPGs: FF: Tactics, Makai Kingdom, Phantom Brave, Soul Nomad, La Pucelle, Front Mission (1 - 4)...
Action RPG: Demon's Souls

Yes, they're all Japanese. Get over it!

Thank you. I can at least now know there's at least some non-bias users on the site.

I keep forgetting Demon's Souls is Japanese too. It's strange how so many Western-bias players loved that game, but won't give any other non-Western game a chance, just for the usual reasons. Their loss, I guess.

 

[Thaius]

I've heard the original Fallout games are pretty complex. You may want to check them out.

 

[child of lileth]

Thank you. I can at least now know there's at least some non-bias users on the site.

Welcome to the battleground that is the Escapist... I've been fighting this pointless battle for too long (and I've only been here since Sept. '09)... There are others like me, just keep a look out for them.

BTW, I do like WRPGs as well. But I did think DA:O was excrutiatingly boring.

To be honest, I've tried a handful Western-style ones before over the years, and I tried to like them, but I just really couldn't get into them. It's just not my thing. Kinda like how I used to like fighting games, but the modern ones are just too complicated for me to play without losing within seconds. lol

But the point I always make is that I at least did try some, instead of being like all the people that just say they hate the ones they do with no actual reason for it.

 

[MisterShine]

Fallout 1 and 2, Planescape Torment, Arcanum. Take your pick.

OP, this man is a Prophet of God and will lead you to the Promised Land.

And to back up the people who said Disgaea: YES it is a jrpg, but it's still very good. And humorous. Try it out!

 

[TOGSolid]

Oh wait. It's Japanese, so it must be shit. Nevermind.

And a total clone of FF! That's what all JRPGs are modelled on right?
OT: Seriously, go back and play DA:O again, and this time mean it

You really have no idea of what you are talking about, right? Comparing Disgaea to FF just because they are both japanese is like comparing Dragon Age to Fallout, just because they are both western. And DA is not so complex... any item has 2 stats and there weren't many options to begin with, which is ridiculously shallow compared to Baldur's Gate or Neverwinter.

Disgaea has so many classes and things to max that is almost obscene. If you are willing to dig it, it would last you ages. If JRPGs is really not your thing, I would go with Diablo or Torchlight.

I can't stand jRPGS and even I liked Disgaea. I highly recommend it to even the staunchest anti-weeaboo.

I don't see why people love DA:O so much. To me it felt like a dumbed down, 3D version of Fallout1/2 and Arcanum (gameplay-wise). Sure it is pretty deep compared to other console games, but compared to old more DnD based games like these, it is rather shallow. Sure they might have not had that much stuff dealing with stats, but the sub-quest DnD based nature of the game is quite in-depth and interesting.

It surprises me to know that a fan of Arcanum could think DA:O is complicated. When you get a market of people obsessed about graphics you get DA:O. I would like to see a modern isometric RPG in the same vein of the games of old, with graphics equivalent to fallout tactics, today's coding with yesterdays graphics could make one 3 times better than those old ones. No, I do not consider torchlight one, it is the same diablo vein of kill stuff, instead of DnD exlporation.

DA:O is pretty simple, but to the current gen of gamers who don't know better, it's pretty damn complex. The old Infinity Engine games still take a giant shit all over it as do the old Fallout games, Arcanum, etc.

And Torchlight is the easiest Roguelike I have ever played. Avoid it unless you're new to the genre.

Fallout 1 and 2, Planescape Torment, Arcanum. Take your pick.

OP, this man is a Prophet of God and will lead you to the Promised Land.

True story, and I lol'd heartily.