All Skyrim needs is...
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That is true but none of those mods will match the experience of a game designed that way from the ground up. Except maybe finisher moves. I can replace the leveled monsters and items with static ones but the map and the quests were designed for the original leveled experience, leaving me with very choppy and unpredictable progression. I can get rid of fast travel but, again, the maps and quests were designed with it in mind. In any case, you have to identify the problem before you can arrive at the solution.SextusMaximus said:
He's just saying what he wants, that's not a crime lol. Morrowind's balanced fast travel system was effective for the smaller scale of the game. I miss it although I don't realistically expect another title to make use of it. Morrowind did place a lot of markers on your map, but it left most things for you to discover by other means. It didn't put literally everything on the map like other titles. This had an enormous impact on the gameplay. All right, some people hated it, but it was significantly different.SajuukKhar said:
I always wished they would find ways to make the skills more unique. I agree pointless skills don't belong in the game but more skills is definitely on my wishlist. I really like how they organized the melee weapons as skills in Skyrim. The weapons that play the same fall under the same skill now, so the skill represents that playstyle, not a jumble of unrelated styles. And this way choosing between short axes, swords, and maces lets me specialize even further through gear choices in addition to skill progression and perks.
Just one more reason I think saying Skyrim didn't improve anything can be the result of tin ear.
I really don't like how the shopkeepers never have powerful, unique items. Also with regenerating health, and equipment never breaking, you can actually play through the entire game without visiting any of them. I have a mountain of gold, and the only thing I use it for is bribing people.
In Oblivion, it was an accomplishment when I no longer had to make routine trips into town. I could mend my own gear, and take care of my wounds. Before that I had to loot everything I could get my hands on, just to fund my adventuring. The only stuff I loot in Skyrim is arrows, gold, ingots/ore, lockpicks, soul gems and health potions.
In Oblivion, it was an accomplishment when I no longer had to make routine trips into town. I could mend my own gear, and take care of my wounds. Before that I had to loot everything I could get my hands on, just to fund my adventuring. The only stuff I loot in Skyrim is arrows, gold, ingots/ore, lockpicks, soul gems and health potions.
How were the stories nonsensical and fruitless?Soopy said:
-Companions gave you Lycanthropy, easily one of the most OP things in the base game, made even more OP with Dawnguard.
-The Dark Brotherhod gave you the shrouded armor, a really great stealth based armor, and a crap ton of cash for killing the emperor.
-The Thieves Guild gave you Nightengale armor, a pretty good sneak based armor, along with some of the most OP powers in the game via nightengale blessings.
-The college of winterhold got you the Archmage robes, probably the best mage robes in the game, and the staff of Magnus, a pretty good staff.
On top of that I don't see how any of the stories didn't make any sense
Companions: you find out they are werewolves - they bribe you with lycanthropy to keep your mouth shut - you hunt some werewolf hunters with them - you find out the boss doesn't want to be a lycan so you get the stuff that can cure him - the werewolf hunters retaliate for your previous attack killing Kodlak in the process - you free Kodlaks osul with the cure you found.
College of winterhold: you join up, go on an expedition, find some magical orb, you try to get info about the orb, you get told the orb is uber dangerous and needs to be stopped so you have to find the staff of magnus, you do stuff to find the staff, you return and put down Ancanno before he screws up the planet
Dark broterhood: You join up, find out they have are having a hard time, the night mother shows up, you find out you are he listener, you end up gettign a contract to kill the emperor, you do a series of quests that are aimed at taking out the emperors defences and secuing a route into his residence, you get betrayed, the DB base gets destroyed, the Night Mother tellyou to go on, you kill the emperor, you get a crap ton of cash.
Thieves Guild: Starts off doing several quests to get some protection money from people, and secure the Thieves guilds last big client, Maven, Holdings, you find out the person behind the attacks on Maven is an ex-guildy you killed the last guild master, you hunt her down only to find out that it was really the current guild master who did it, you help her find proof of her innocence, you take it to the guild who asks you to hunt down mercer, you make a deal with the htives guilds patron nocturnal to get powers to help you beat mercer, you track mercer down and kill him.
I don't see how you can say
-Killing off a group of werewolf Hunters, adnd freeing a guy souls from damnation
-Killing the Emperor of Tamriel
-Stopping a madman from blowing up the planet using a magic Orb
-Bringing back the Mob to rule over the nations crime ring
Amounts to nothing.
Fruitless, because they give you nothing useful that you can't make yourself in about 1/4 the time. The Nightingale armour looks cool. But its really no better then anything you can make.
The Werewolf form is weak as piss. My character is stronger with a sword...
The DB questline was alright though.
The Werewolf form is weak as piss. My character is stronger with a sword...
The DB questline was alright though.
Here's my one big gripe about Skyrim (and oblivion while we're at it.)
The enemies scale to your level. This is complete and utter bullshit. It's like they made the game so that f'ing five year olds could play it. I can kill a dragon at level 10? A DRAGON?! Bullshit.
Bethesda, take of the kiddie gloves.
The enemies scale to your level. This is complete and utter bullshit. It's like they made the game so that f'ing five year olds could play it. I can kill a dragon at level 10? A DRAGON?! Bullshit.
Bethesda, take of the kiddie gloves.
-I was not aware that Morrowind was the only one not to have fast travel. I don't care if the old school TES fans hated not having it, I loved.SajuukKhar said:
-I did mark places on the map, I wish it didn't. (I do enjoy drawing my own maps)
-The old weapons skills were great for role-playing, The armour skills were great for role-playing, and acrobatics was fun.
-That's probably true that won't improve the story a whole lot, but that I still say the time used could be put to better use, like story, content, more dungeons, fun, etc.
-Was not aware you could turn them off, thank you.
I remember nothing of the sort. I do remember going through long dungeons and getting crappy rings (that I hoarded anyway) but it was an adventure none the less. I play the game to adventure and role-play and have fun not to get the shiniest items and most gold. You can go into a dungeon having no idea what you might find and it would be a surprise when got them, although when you said "you find out the locations of the best items beforehand" it sounds like you played with a walkthrough and FAQ beside you.
I thought this thread was aimed at Vanilla Skyrim (with the expansion packs/DLC included). I do have it on PC and I will mod it next time I feel like playing it, Which I doubt will be very soon.SextusMaximus said:
When I first started playing Skyrim I was quickly overwhelmed with all the quests and by doing them one by one and quickly had a burnout. Then I started roleplaying and I find it amazing. I'm a console player myself, even though I played Morrowind and Oblivion on the PC. It's true what they say though, mods can really help you roleplay with the game. For example, I played as a Kahjit assassin in Oblivion and there was a mod that could make me do saltos and very acrobatic and stylish combat.
One complaint I Have with Skyrim, as well as all the other games (and yes, there is a mod for that) is population. How is the Imperial city imperial if there's only 20 people in it
. With skyrim I had that feeling less, but it was there nonetheless.
Another thing is that I have less of a happy feeling when get a weapon in Skyrim or Oblivion than I had in Morrowind. Special weapons really felt special.
So yeah, roleplaying and mods can help. That's why I'm going to upgrade my pc, because even with all its flaws, Skyrim still is a great game.
One complaint I Have with Skyrim, as well as all the other games (and yes, there is a mod for that) is population. How is the Imperial city imperial if there's only 20 people in it
. With skyrim I had that feeling less, but it was there nonetheless.Another thing is that I have less of a happy feeling when get a weapon in Skyrim or Oblivion than I had in Morrowind. Special weapons really felt special.
So yeah, roleplaying and mods can help. That's why I'm going to upgrade my pc
, because even with all its flaws, Skyrim still is a great game.
I think there's three big things Skyrim needed to do to make it a much deeper and overall more rewarding RPG:
1) Stop having us level up the more we do something. Look, i know it's a good idea on paper, but when actually playing, it makes the whole thing just too...meh. I think lockpicking is the easiest way to describe why i think this system sucks. By simply playing through the game and picking locks as i go along i can eventually, after 20 hours, maybe less, pick master level locks without putting a single point into the lockpicking tree. Since the game has you level up a skill by doing it, and then letting you put a skill point into whatever area you want, it ended up being pointless putting anything into the lockpick tree. This should instead work whereby I cannot unlock anything above novice until i get the perk that lets me unlock apprentice locks, and so on. This is desirable since it now means that my experience will be different from someone who put points into lockpicking, rather than the only difference in our experience being how many lockpicks we broke before we unlocked the door. Plus, this would encourage Bethesda to put more valuable items in higher level locks.
2) Use the epic enemy variety at your disposal, Bethesda. Someone posted earlier that everything can be summed up by bandits for shallow caves, draugr for medium caves, and falmor for deep caves. That's just pathetically basic on Bethesda's part. Where's the caves overrun by minotaurs? Bethesda has such awesome enemy variety in their previous games, where's that all at in Skyrim? You're supposed to add things to sequels, not remove things, especially something as important as enemy variety.
3) Use a more random, Diablo-esque style loot system. Probably the most apparent problem with Skyrim is its lack of any interesting weapons. Sure, the actual designs are cool, but once you find a glass sword or something, thats it - game over - nothing else worth finding. The only weapons that ever appear with any decent magic properties are useless iron weapons. This means that if you manage to find some great equipment early on, you'll be stuck using that for ages. And the unique weapons you can get from certain quests never seem to be as good as what you already have. I feel like Skyrim has this great potential to be the best loot-hunting game ever with its huge open world and countless caves to go spelunking into, but without anything fun to find, it just becomes stale.
1) Stop having us level up the more we do something. Look, i know it's a good idea on paper, but when actually playing, it makes the whole thing just too...meh. I think lockpicking is the easiest way to describe why i think this system sucks. By simply playing through the game and picking locks as i go along i can eventually, after 20 hours, maybe less, pick master level locks without putting a single point into the lockpicking tree. Since the game has you level up a skill by doing it, and then letting you put a skill point into whatever area you want, it ended up being pointless putting anything into the lockpick tree. This should instead work whereby I cannot unlock anything above novice until i get the perk that lets me unlock apprentice locks, and so on. This is desirable since it now means that my experience will be different from someone who put points into lockpicking, rather than the only difference in our experience being how many lockpicks we broke before we unlocked the door. Plus, this would encourage Bethesda to put more valuable items in higher level locks.
2) Use the epic enemy variety at your disposal, Bethesda. Someone posted earlier that everything can be summed up by bandits for shallow caves, draugr for medium caves, and falmor for deep caves. That's just pathetically basic on Bethesda's part. Where's the caves overrun by minotaurs? Bethesda has such awesome enemy variety in their previous games, where's that all at in Skyrim? You're supposed to add things to sequels, not remove things, especially something as important as enemy variety.
3) Use a more random, Diablo-esque style loot system. Probably the most apparent problem with Skyrim is its lack of any interesting weapons. Sure, the actual designs are cool, but once you find a glass sword or something, thats it - game over - nothing else worth finding. The only weapons that ever appear with any decent magic properties are useless iron weapons. This means that if you manage to find some great equipment early on, you'll be stuck using that for ages. And the unique weapons you can get from certain quests never seem to be as good as what you already have. I feel like Skyrim has this great potential to be the best loot-hunting game ever with its huge open world and countless caves to go spelunking into, but without anything fun to find, it just becomes stale.
Good combat. Proper good combat. And slightly less uncanny valley-ish residents. I mean, it's a marked improvement on Oblivion, but that's not exactly hard.
Failing that... I think co-op. Co-op would likely save Skyrim's faults.
Failing that... I think co-op. Co-op would likely save Skyrim's faults.
You don't HAVE to, but that's all most people did with it. And it's not just about it being overpowered. The idea of it was to make magic more interesting by making it wide open, personalized and customizable. In practice people just picked their favorite overpowered spell that worked in most situations. They were using fewer spells, not more. Spell-making was having the opposite of the intended effect. So now that's it gone and magic is a little more structured, many people are actually working with more tools than they were before.Soopy said:
I sympathize if you were actually putting spell-making to good use, but like attributes I can understand why it's gone.
Unless you have a 100 smithing skill, and a super high enchant skill with perks, it isn't that easy to make something better then the Nightingale armor.Soopy said:
Yes you can make some really OP weapons and armor using smithing skills and enchantment exploits, but why would you?
I can open up the console and type TGM to turn on godmode, but would I blame the game for me doing that? no.
Beyond that, there are plenty of people who don't smith or enchant, because it isn't part of their character style, or because they don't believe in breaking the game via exploits.
Shorter loading times. The return of spellmaking and more enchanting options (maybe I want to make a hat that can kill me), the ability to remove enchantments without destroying the item. Keep the compass and fast travelling (if you don't like it don't use it)
I recall how leveled-everything totally broke Oblivion and sucked the excitement right out of exploration lol.SajuukKhar said:
I have to disagree with you here. More static loot and monsters was great. I actually don't remember doing many long dungeons for no reward, though I do remember some short tombs. I just don't know why you are saying the loot was terrible. You found good stuff around. No one stopped doing dungeons when they got the items they wanted lol. And it's not like that was easy. In part because you couldn't do them all at level one =0. There were a couple of items that were too easy to obtain but beside that I much preferred that system.
The tradeoff for Morrowind was that you were actually discovering something. With all leveled loot it doesn't matter where I go or what I do, it's just a waiting game. I don't feel like I'm earning the loot, I just feel like I'm waiting long enough to be given it. If I can do anything at any time because enemies are leveled, I see how that could be liberating, but it means I am not progressing. Again, my motivation to go out and do things is deflated. I may as well just rest until the same cave respawns a million times as far as loot and leveling up is concerned.
I have literally gone through every single cave, Dwemer ruin, velothi tower, and old crypt, in Morrowind, and I can safely say that 90% of the time, there was quite literally nothing of value in those places, except the same generic magic rings I had gotten in the last 50 caves, or yet another magical sword that I had also gotten in the last 50 caves.Rooster Cogburn said:
Most loot in Morrowind was vendor trash, I have kept more loot in Skyrim, because Skyrim's loot was actually useful, compared to Morrowind.
As for exploring in Morrowind, I never felt like I was earning the loot in Morrowind, or that I was doing any more "discovering" then I am in Skyrim.
Dungeons didn't feel like a challange or interesting, they felt like the game designers randomly level locked places for no reason, and when I ran into a place that was level locked I felt like the game devs were saying "HERES ALL THIS COOL STUFF, TOO BAD YOU CAN'T EXPERIENCE IT RIGHT NOW, GO OUT INTO THE WORLD AND GRIND YOUR ASS OFF TO RAISE UR SKILLS"
Having static monsters only turned the game into a boring grind were you were forced to go ut and kill 500 cliff racers to level your skills just so you can go into a cave that they put level 30 monsters in when the quest that leads you there was level 5.
Having to grind didn't make the game feel more rewarding in any good way, it just made the game feel really grindy.
Morrowind felt like a MMO at times, but not a good MMO like guild Wars 2 is, a grindy Korean MMO where anything remotely fun was level locked until you went out and killed 500 generic enemies to level up.
It needs a better story (the main antagonist reasoning is a particular thorn in my ass for this),
the enchanting system needs to be redone, as does the magic,
they (bethesda) needs to quit removing shit from their games (weapons, armor, clothing, spells, ect) also the clothing and armor system in this game pissed me off.
they need to refine the lore, the need to return to the old character creation,
the game needs to be more flexible, and less NAY! NO MORE of this lead me by the nose bullshit,(seriously why the fuck can't I just go to lord Drakon or whatever the fuck the big bad's name is in dawnguard and kill his ass? I'm the fucking Dragonborn! I made Alduin the son of the god of gods into my *****, but nooooooo we can't take initiative and act like an intelligent being? Instead we have to be led around by our fucking noses into the shitty fucking fetch quest that you want us to do! fuck you bethesda!)
The soul carin fuck that place! seriously, FUCK THAT PLACE!
and finally, quest locked dungeons. In an Elder Scrolls game. Are you fucking kidding me?
the enchanting system needs to be redone, as does the magic,
they (bethesda) needs to quit removing shit from their games (weapons, armor, clothing, spells, ect) also the clothing and armor system in this game pissed me off.
they need to refine the lore, the need to return to the old character creation,
the game needs to be more flexible, and less NAY! NO MORE of this lead me by the nose bullshit,(seriously why the fuck can't I just go to lord Drakon or whatever the fuck the big bad's name is in dawnguard and kill his ass? I'm the fucking Dragonborn! I made Alduin the son of the god of gods into my *****, but nooooooo we can't take initiative and act like an intelligent being? Instead we have to be led around by our fucking noses into the shitty fucking fetch quest that you want us to do! fuck you bethesda!)
The soul carin fuck that place! seriously, FUCK THAT PLACE!
and finally, quest locked dungeons. In an Elder Scrolls game. Are you fucking kidding me?
Skyrim doesn't have a dodge move, and isn't as lethal or have the same punch to the melee combat that Dark Souls does.CannibalCorpses said:
EDIT: There's also parrying with most shields and some daggers, and other weapons may have certain properties when placed in the left hand.
Oh, that's rubbish. It'd be simple.Doom-Slayer said:Last I checked, and you know I could be wrong, but Dark Souls is a 3rd person game and Skyrim is primary a 1st person game. Kiiiind of cant just transfer those systems over very easilyhazabaza1 said:
lolwutBhaalspawn said:
"Skyrim 5: Skyrim"
I'm guessing that was just a typo, but it's still funny.
I personally think Skyrim is the best Bethesda game yet.
Sure there are still instances of the problems that I have with Bethesda's games.
The combat still hasn't evolved past the press button to swing your crowbar stage; and it doesn't help that melee combat (to me) just doesn't really work in first person.
As someone before me mentioned, give it a combat system more similar to Dark Souls. And, I'd really like it if they made a third person mode that didn't suck.
Also the radiant AI still produces some immersion breaking moments of stupidity and every person I walk past still spouts the same 3 freaking lines at me.
And the glitches, there are times when the game still feels like a beta test.
And the story is still pretty barebones and I hardly care about most of the characters.
I think they should just drop the overarching plot, or do like Fallout New Vegas did and give you a bunch of different paths to take to get there and have them amount to vastly different things.
I mean, I like saving the world and all, but my amoral Khajiit assassin really isn't up to the task of being the Nordic Hero of legend. I like going through Skyrim as a blade for hire, taking on any job for the coin; and in a land ravaged by civil war, there's plenty of coin to be made.
But still, Skyrim is the most fun I've had with any of Bethesda's games, so it gets a win in my book.
Sure there are still instances of the problems that I have with Bethesda's games.
The combat still hasn't evolved past the press button to swing your crowbar stage; and it doesn't help that melee combat (to me) just doesn't really work in first person.
As someone before me mentioned, give it a combat system more similar to Dark Souls. And, I'd really like it if they made a third person mode that didn't suck.
Also the radiant AI still produces some immersion breaking moments of stupidity and every person I walk past still spouts the same 3 freaking lines at me.
And the glitches, there are times when the game still feels like a beta test.
And the story is still pretty barebones and I hardly care about most of the characters.
I think they should just drop the overarching plot, or do like Fallout New Vegas did and give you a bunch of different paths to take to get there and have them amount to vastly different things.
I mean, I like saving the world and all, but my amoral Khajiit assassin really isn't up to the task of being the Nordic Hero of legend. I like going through Skyrim as a blade for hire, taking on any job for the coin; and in a land ravaged by civil war, there's plenty of coin to be made.
But still, Skyrim is the most fun I've had with any of Bethesda's games, so it gets a win in my book.