Alleged harassment, threats of doxxing, hitpiece journalism, 'fake' gamer girls... Oh my!

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport? Like its branded as one because EActivity or EHobby won't sell mountain dew ads.
But we don't say Warhammer 40k is a tablesport, no its wargaming. Likewise we don't think board games like Betrayal at house on Haunted Hill should be in the Olympics.
I just don't think getting paid to do something, even if its competitive, qualifies an activity as a sport.
Also it opens up so many cans of worms. Which games would be chosen? Which genres? Overwatch has a competitive league because Blizzard, its creator, wants one to get more money from fans.
But is the Olympic committee going to approve Overwatch? Or any other game? Would there be a tournament fighter medal? Racing medal?
The whole idea of Olympic video gaming is absurd if you ask me.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport? Like its branded as one because EActivity or EHobby won't sell mountain dew ads.
But we don't say Warhammer 40k is a tablesport, no its wargaming. Likewise we don't think board games like Betrayal at house on Haunted Hill should be in the Olympics.
I just don't think getting paid to do something, even if its competitive, qualifies an activity as a sport.
Also it opens up so many cans of worms. Which games would be chosen? Which genres? Overwatch has a competitive league because Blizzard, its creator, wants one to get more money from fans.
But is the Olympic committee going to approve Overwatch? Or any other game? Would there be a tournament fighter medal? Racing medal?
The whole idea of Olympic video gaming is absurd if you ask me.

As someone who is actually Greek and hence has a cultural stake in the Olympics, I really don't care about whether gaming is or isn't there. I don't think putting games there would degrade them any more than the fact that it's not all men participating or the fact that the athletes participate clothed. I'm not attached to the traditional ways of doing things but at the same time I see no reason why gaming has to be a "sport" per se.

I think it's a lot of misguided people who believe it being a sport would grant it legitimacy. I reject that sort of borrowed legitimacy.

I fully believe gaming can forge its own sort of legitimacy and it is doing just that already, and with record speed I might add. Just go to a LoL major world tourney in Korea and tell me it's any less legitimate lol.


I think seeking to get competitive gaming in the Olympics is kinda like trying to make movie-like games to get some sort of recognition because movies are supposedly more valuable. Games don't need to be something else in order to be respectable. Being games is already wholly respectable in and of itself.

 

[McElroy]

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport? Like its branded as one because EActivity or EHobby won't sell mountain dew ads.
But we don't say Warhammer 40k is a tablesport, no its wargaming. Likewise we don't think board games like Betrayal at house on Haunted Hill should be in the Olympics.
I just don't think getting paid to do something, even if its competitive, qualifies an activity as a sport.
Also it opens up so many cans of worms. Which games would be chosen? Which genres? Overwatch has a competitive league because Blizzard, its creator, wants one to get more money from fans.
But is the Olympic committee going to approve Overwatch? Or any other game? Would there be a tournament fighter medal? Racing medal?
The whole idea of Olympic video gaming is absurd if you ask me.

Money talks. The Chinese are probably very much cool with the idea of getting to market their most profitable games to a global audience. Nowadays games are under strict corporate control, which is the main reason I don't want them to take any "official" spotlight horizontally to traditional sports. Games would need third party unions to ensure EA, Blizzard, Tencent or whatever didn't fuck with their "sport" freely.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport?

Nah.
Sports measure skill between opponents. People dedicate entire lives to hone them.
Competitive games require some skill for sure but it doesn't take long to develop it. There's never been a single multiplayer game where I don't luck out in the first couple of tries and kill a maxed-out player who's been at it for weeks/months/years.
(Which cues the nasty messages)

 

[WindKnight]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

That being said, teabagging in front of a live audience of billion people, would be a sight to behold. Damn, now i'm a bit sad.

And then you'll have to explain to your non-gaming friends and family what he's doing, and then having them wondering if you do that, and if you do, wondering 'what the hell is wrong with you'.

 

[Mcgeezaks]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport?

Nah.
Sports measure skill between opponents. People dedicate entire lives to hone them.
Competitive games require some skill for sure but it doesn't take long to develop it. There's never been a single multiplayer game where I don't luck out in the first couple of tries and kill a maxed-out player who's been at it for weeks/months/years.
(Which cues the nasty messages)

Just because you killed someone who's been at it for ''weeks/months/years'' in a pub game doesn't mean anything, play against someone who's actually made it to the pro-circuits and you'll see what a night and day difference it is. People dedicate their lives to these games as well, playing one certain game for at least 8 hours a day and getting better and better, to say it doesn't take long to develop a real skill for a game is bs.

 

[Trunkage]

I love competitive gaming but I share in the distaste for esports for a different reason than the one expressed here. In fact, for the exact opposite one. It's not that it lacks decorum but rather that it requires too much of it which causes people to be fake and betray themselves. I remember a fighting game commentator and player who split with Capcom (and went to play guilty gear like a smart person) over complaints regarding them trying to sanitize their community in order to fit in with esports to a degree that it made him feel he was "unable to be black" according to his own words.


In the circles I traveled, being esports is tied to being artificially wholesome. It's a fake thing you do to rake in advertisers and sponsors (you don't have to actually be recognized by the actual esports itself to be trying to be esports). A good example was how the ass slap wrestler from sf5 couldn't use the costume her user liked during a tournament that was being broadcast at espn so he used a weird different one and everyone was like "why isn't he using his usual costume" when that happened.

Additionally, attempts to court esports have seeped into game development according to the creators of dead or alive 6, with them altering the game in a way that esports would feel better with including.


All in all, competitive gaming rules but esports is a show in selling out and should go away.

heaven forbid grown men aren't allowed to have slur spewing baby temper tantrums live

wouldn't want to betray who they really are after all

Well, yes, heaven forbid, cause in a free society you should be able to act like an idiot and have it be dealt with like normal and not pre-emptively curtailed for the sake of the feelings of fuck knows who. (probably some corporate market analyst or some overly-religious fanatic in the boonies)

a free society does not freedom from consequences. If slurs sold well, it would be dominant. But it doesn't always

Thinking like this would have prevented progressive change like weed legalization, gay marriage, emancipation, suffrage and so on. Sometimes popular opinion is conservative fear-based BS so future-looking corporations can also make a living in eschewing the status quo and carving out their own path. Success of youtubers with crass shows showcase this to be the case.


Basically, I don't think the consequences of people being authentic as they enjoy games would be anywhere close to the degree of bad that scared marketing executives who are not part of the culture themselves paint them as being. A 70 year old churchgoer isn't going to be buying many arcade joystick controllers anyways. A soccermom is not going to be participating in a money match in the latest pantyshot fighter. There's basically no notable consequences to speak of and a whole lot of "conventional wisdom" holding things back.

Being Authentic? Nah they're putting a show on for you. It's not real. They act like a dick to show how tough they are. You know, like a bully. And like a bully, its a thin veneer for their own social insecurities.

This is a generalization but from the hundred Asians I know, they hate bullies. I've seen them walk out, en masse from stand up comics who weren't insulting Asians. They were insulting whites and these Asians dont truck with that nonsense.

Maybe it's to pander to Asians? Clearly the money is more in not having insults. Maybe looking at previous big games that didn't curtail insults gives us clues. I remember when LOL and DOTA were young, and there was a third contender (before Smite) with Hero in the name. It died becuase it wouldn't curtail insults even to the little extant of LOL and DOTA. It just became so toxic nobody wanted to play. And that's toxic compared to two games I just referenced.

 

[Satinavian]

Never understood why immature insults are supposed to be part of competitive online gaming.

They certainly were not part of any online gaming activity or community i ever took part in. But then i don't do shooters which is, as i understood, at least where this teabagging nonsense comes from.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport?

Nah.
Sports measure skill between opponents. People dedicate entire lives to hone them.
Competitive games require some skill for sure but it doesn't take long to develop it. There's never been a single multiplayer game where I don't luck out in the first couple of tries and kill a maxed-out player who's been at it for weeks/months/years.
(Which cues the nasty messages)

Just because you killed someone who's been at it for ''weeks/months/years'' in a pub game doesn't mean anything, play against someone who's actually made it to the pro-circuits and you'll see what a night and day difference it is. People dedicate their lives to these games as well, playing one certain game for at least 8 hours a day and getting better and better, to say it doesn't take long to develop a real skill for a game is bs.

How can you dedicate your life to a game that's only been around for a few years?
Pro-gamers weren't practicing Overwatch 10 years ago, they were playing Magic the Gathering and watching the Dark Knight.
and in 2 or 3 years there will be another FPS game that 'pro-gamers' would have spent their whole lives training with.

 

[Mcgeezaks]

Never understood why immature insults are supposed to be part of competitive online gaming.

They certainly were not part of any online gaming activity or community i ever took part in. But then i don't do shooters which is, as i understood, at least where this teabagging nonsense comes from.

Oh come on, are people seriously offended by teabagging? Jesus Christ.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

Never understood why immature insults are supposed to be part of competitive online gaming.

They certainly were not part of any online gaming activity or community i ever took part in. But then i don't do shooters which is, as i understood, at least where this teabagging nonsense comes from.

Oh come on, are people seriously offended by teabagging? Jesus Christ.

No, but it is fucking tacky

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport?

Nah.
Sports measure skill between opponents. People dedicate entire lives to hone them.
Competitive games require some skill for sure but it doesn't take long to develop it. There's never been a single multiplayer game where I don't luck out in the first couple of tries and kill a maxed-out player who's been at it for weeks/months/years.
(Which cues the nasty messages)

Just because you killed someone who's been at it for ''weeks/months/years'' in a pub game doesn't mean anything, play against someone who's actually made it to the pro-circuits and you'll see what a night and day difference it is. People dedicate their lives to these games as well, playing one certain game for at least 8 hours a day and getting better and better, to say it doesn't take long to develop a real skill for a game is bs.

How can you dedicate your life to a game that's only been around for a few years?
Pro-gamers weren't practicing Overwatch 10 years ago, they were playing Magic the Gathering and watching the Dark Knight.
and in 2 or 3 years there will be another FPS game that 'pro-gamers' would have spent their whole lives training with.

Skills transfer between games. I don't play shooters but with fighters, as long as you learn the fundamentals completely and learn how to go about absorbing the elements of the game in one game you're instantly better than 90% of players in all games just due to that. Not gonna say that you wouldn't be better if you had been playing the same one game for all this time but to think that every beginner in a new game starts on the same footing is very misguided.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

Trash talk (that tbagging is a facet of) is a way of having fun and camaraderie to some. To others it's a way of angering your foe so they'll play worse and so on. Some people are genuinely sadists about it but I don't think most people use it in order to genuinely make anyone upset and are just messing around. .


Personally, I'm always polite and will only reciprocate trash talk if someone else initiates it against me and only if they're somewhere around my skill level so that I won't be confused for showing off or bullying some salty newb for no reason, but it's still fun when that happens once in a while so I get why people would do it.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

honestly heres my take

the end goal of e-athletes is to eventually be treated like real athletes

real athletes hold themselves to a higher standard and do not overtly taunt or trash talk

therefore e-athletes should hold themselves to that standard as well

you wanna be treated like adults? act like it

I'm sure some athletes do and then get criticized for it or obtain a "bad boy" image and what have you.

But yeah I don't see any value to any type of boastful behavior. I just consider my own opinion of people as being dumbasses as a sufficient penalty for peoples' behavior and don't see a point to doing anything beyond that. It helps since if I happen to be wrong I won't be supporting something that's actually incredibly unpopular just cause of my personal feelings, too.

I think people will organically fail if they're that unpleasant without the need for anyone's help.

 

[Majestic Manatee_v1legacy]

honestly heres my take

the end goal of e-athletes is to eventually be treated like real athletes

real athletes hold themselves to a higher standard and do not overtly taunt or trash talk

therefore e-athletes should hold themselves to that standard as well

you wanna be treated like adults? act like it

That was and is my opinion on this matter. Professional behaviour is expected and respected in professional profession. It's a tiny bit sad that there are those so insistent on their right to act like a child in what they claim is a professional activity. No one is offended by seeing grown people embarrass themselves like spoilt toddlers, they're only drawing pity and disappointment.

 

[McElroy]

Never understood why immature insults are supposed to be part of competitive online gaming.

They certainly were not part of any online gaming activity or community i ever took part in. But then i don't do shooters which is, as i understood, at least where this teabagging nonsense comes from.

Oh come on, are people seriously offended by teabagging? Jesus Christ.

I mean, as a taunt that supposed to tilt your opponent..isn't offending the point?

are we now surprised offending taunts are offensive? are we that defensive about this?

this is the final hill?

teabagging?

People keep bringing it up. There were a couple of teabags in the first season of OWL IIRC, just a couple, nobody cares. Somebody who would say "why can't they just be good sports about it?" upon learning about taunting in games most likely doesn't understand competitive gaming in general. It's true that some esports brands want even those kind of people on board, and thus stupidity -- taunting included -- must be kept low. However, the main problem is, and will be for the foreseeable future, the games: OW is hard to follow, LoL too, Dota 2 hard as hell to follow. On the other hand, synchronized swimming is hard to follow, so is dressage. It's also almost embarrassing to watch indoor cycling or race walking, and the 1500 metre freestyle.

honestly heres my take

the end goal of e-athletes is to eventually be treated like real athletes

I hope that this is not the case. I think it's the corporations who would want this.

 

[CaitSeith]

honestly heres my take

the end goal of e-athletes is to eventually be treated like real athletes

I hope that this is not the case. I think it's the corporations who would want this.

If that were the case, teabagging would had been removed long ago from the game itself.

 

[Gordon_4_v1legacy]

We aren't going to see Esports at the olympics until we're sure one of the competitors isn't chomping at the bit to scream slurs or teabag an opponent in front of a worldwide audience.

Pretty sure there're a thousand more reasons why we're not going to see Esports at the Olympics any time soon.

I mean is it even fair to call gaming a sport?

Nah.
Sports measure skill between opponents. People dedicate entire lives to hone them.
Competitive games require some skill for sure but it doesn't take long to develop it. There's never been a single multiplayer game where I don't luck out in the first couple of tries and kill a maxed-out player who's been at it for weeks/months/years.
(Which cues the nasty messages)

Just because you killed someone who's been at it for ''weeks/months/years'' in a pub game doesn't mean anything, play against someone who's actually made it to the pro-circuits and you'll see what a night and day difference it is. People dedicate their lives to these games as well, playing one certain game for at least 8 hours a day and getting better and better, to say it doesn't take long to develop a real skill for a game is bs.

How can you dedicate your life to a game that's only been around for a few years?
Pro-gamers weren't practicing Overwatch 10 years ago, they were playing Magic the Gathering and watching the Dark Knight.
and in 2 or 3 years there will be another FPS game that 'pro-gamers' would have spent their whole lives training with.

Skills transfer between games. I don't play shooters but with fighters, as long as you learn the fundamentals completely and learn how to go about absorbing the elements of the game in one game you're instantly better than 90% of players in all games just due to that. Not gonna say that you wouldn't be better if you had been playing the same one game for all this time but to think that every beginner in a new game starts on the same footing is very misguided.

With fighting games my experience has been the opposite of that. Tekken, Dead or Alive, Soul Calibur, Street Fighter, King of Fighters, Mortal Kombat to name a few play very differently to each other. Reflex would be transferable but the muscle memory would be a bastard.