Am I alone in being afraid of Scientology?

[Amnestic]

If your afraid of something that doesn't exist, your weak and shall be afraid for the rest of your life.

Denial of reality is a sad thing. Scientology does exist. Whether their beliefs are true or not is not the issue at hand.

That's like saying "Christianity doesn't exist" when it blatantly does. The Christian God? Maybe, maybe not. But Scientology, just like Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Pork Pies, Calzones, Xbox 360s and boobies, is very real.

 

[Dorian Cornelius Jasper]

That said, the people aren't horrid, and neither is the CoS. They've done some bad things, but what are we comparing them to? The Catholic Church, who were complicit in the brutal Portugese and Spanish colonization of South America? Radical Hinduism? Evangelism? Communism? Our society has a de facto standard for the perceived morality of both secular and non-secular groups existing, and - whether you like it or not - Scientology doesn't stand out as being non-compliant with it.

They also like to censor the internet. There's a lot of people on the internet who don't like being censored--something to do with freedom and anarchic principles. And I don't blame them in the least.

Trying to go up against the internet earns a lot more ire from a lot more people than any long-distant historical atrocity could. Anonymous didn't start protesting Scientology out of nowhere, Anon only started taking it seriously when it attempted to censor all videos depicting Tom Cruise's infamous public creep-out, especially on Youtube (claiming copyright, usually). And that ticked Anon off something fierce.

It's interesting to attempt to compare them to the histories of religions when, in fact, said religions do have their fair share of critics. Many of whom are a bit more fierce in their opposition of said religions than Scientology's critics are of them. (If you don't think Catholicism has any serious critics, then check out the more conservative Protestant denominations.) Communism has plenty of critics and opponents, and for good reason. Same with Evangelical Christians. Radical Hinduism is, well, a bit esoteric for the discussion. Radical Islam, on the other hand, is not well-liked in most of the world.

Frankly, the treatment the CoS has gotten from the media and internet is fair game in comparison. And rather light. (It gets off with a few masked protests and a surprisingly large number of apologists and defenders, so there's no guilt in speaking out against it. It's no underdog, by any measure of the term.)

It's just like every other terrible religion, so people should be allowed to speak out against it. Like they do with every other terrible religion.

 

[manaman]

They have been preaching the horrors of scientology for years. I say give it a few generations. The really strange stuff will drop from their normal practices. Their "holy writings" will get edited a bit, new things added.

In short they will just be another of the many religions. Cause well to tell you all the truth all religions start as crazy cults.

 

[Dorian Cornelius Jasper]

But what is behind still doesn't exist it only has power as long as you belief it does.

The Church of Scientology has a lot of money and little to no ethical compunctions about using it to attack, harass, and attempt to destroy its critics.

Not only does the CoS exist, it likes to play dirty.

There's a reason why people are afraid of them. This has nothing to do with religious beliefs and everything to do with a bunch of scumbags with power and influence.

 

[dante_136]

'Perhaps the same could be said of all religions'

Sorry, but someone had to say it. XD

 

[Flying-Emu]

You're kidding, right? How are you scared of Scientology? They can't do anything to you.

You think so? Really?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_controversies

(This being the closest thing to an unbiased account of the whole hullabaloo you'll find, especially since Wikipedia's started cracking down on wiki-vandalism from both Scientologists and anti-Scientologists in recent years.)

Read: They can't do anything to you unless you let them.

Also the whole thing is a giant ripoff fueled by celebrities who've been wined-and-dined in order to give them a high public profile and funded by money taken from the people they're ripping off.

That said, I've a lot more sympathy for Anonymous than Scientology. And I don't find the latter fascinating in the least, especially since they're the same greedy, ruthless bastards as you'll find in any established religion or cult in human history--who, by the way, never seem to run out of suckers to join their ranks. There's really nothing fascinating about that, unless one's unfamiliar with dealing with the whole "evil bastard" thing.

Scientology makes a group of hackers, trolls, jackasses, and pornmonglers look like the good guys.

So you're saying that it doesn't at least interest you that a group of people are able to convince others into doing things that are logically/morally wrong?

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

'Perhaps the same could be said of all religions'

Sorry, but someone had to say it. XD

No, not really.

 

[Mekado]

If you really want to be freaked out check out operation snow white.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Snow_White

 

[lostclause]

No, you're not.

A long time ago, they sued people for speaking out against them. Not to win, but just keep them in court long enough to screw up their lives forever.
They also harassed (stalked, threaten, break into their homes) and sued ex-members that wanted to tell people about how they believe that all our troubles are caused by aliens.
For these reasons, the cult has been outlawed in Italy, or maybe it was Spain...

I know it's outlawed in Germany (hence why there was a fuss about Cruise playing as von Staffenburg who is a national hero). Not sure about those two though.
For me it's less about their religion itself and more about their action such as in the op. What they believe in is not a problem until it starts affecting the health and wellbeing of their members and, as Cama states, harassing people beyond simply handing out flyers.

 

[Cody211282]

Scientology is one of these religions not even I, an agnostic who will respect religion, can get my head around. Back when I was a keen atheist I just thought of the whole religion as a joke, but this, this is scary. I will still respect it but, I'm lost for words on what to think about it.

Hell I don't even respect it

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

If you really want to be freaked out check out operation snow white.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Snow_White

Believe me, I heard about that. That is disturbing, if only because of the level it got to. But I find it more appalling when a Scientologist is stabbed 77 times by her son because, even though he had been diagnosed as mentally ill, she didn't believe in taking him to a psychologist, and the cult took him off his medication...that's flat-out terrifying.

 

[The_Echo]

Scientology is one of these religions

Every religion

No I'm not really. The thing I find strange is the amount of followers despite a) being a fairly obvious offshoot of pyramid schemes and b) the fact that the one who started the religion

Ah... they're a religion.

Stop. Right there. Scientology is not a religion, it's a cult.

I am not afraid of Scientology, in fact I don't think there are any Scientologists around here to be afraid of. I also trust Anon will take care of things, seeing as they're the only ones with the balls to confront them. http://www.whyweprotest.net/ Why am I the first to link this?

 

[Cody211282]

Scientology is one of these religions

Every religion

No I'm not really. The thing I find strange is the amount of followers despite a) being a fairly obvious offshoot of pyramid schemes and b) the fact that the one who started the religion

Ah... they're a religion.

Stop. Right there. Scientology is not a religion, it's a cult.

I am not afraid of Scientology, in fact I don't think there are any Scientologists around here. I also trust Anon will take care of things, seeing as they're the only ones with the balls to confront them. http://www.whyweprotest.net/ Why am I the first to link this?

Thanks for the link

 

[Inco]

Really funny actually.
I'm agnostic who doesn't mind any religion even if it is preached to me. That's because i listen to the morals in the preaching, ones that can be used in everyday life and just generally help overall. (by the way, i go to this religious thing with a christian friend sometimes. To talk to her and keep her company. That's why i sometimes listen to preaches)

The instant Fear, violence, intimidation or anything that i can deem immoral is brought into the play, i will take a stance against the individual or group in question until they make amends.

This little thing that Scientology has brought in has justified my position against the religion (as i doubt they will make amends) by using these atrocity of a policy.

It disgusts me. It is just too immoral for me to comprehend.

 

[Sark]

Scientology isn't really any weirder than any other religion. As for the money grabbing side, the Catholic Church is one of the richest organisations in the world.

 

[Dorian Cornelius Jasper]

*snip*

You don't have to let them hurt you, you just have to be public enough and unfortunate enough to fall in their crosshairs. And if choosing to speak out against them means "letting them," then at best you're suggesting that people buckle to their intimidation tactics.

And there's nothing interesting about a group capable of convincing otherwise decent people to commit unethical or immoral deeds. This happens all the time, around the world, with appalling regularity. History documents countless injustices committed by people who, in any other situation, would be perfectly normal, well-adjusted, decent folk. Hell, they probably still were when they did it. Often they were just following orders--either military, political, or religious in origin. Heck, do any terrorists think they're evil? No! They're well convinced that they're the underdog everymen against a worldview hostile to everything they hold dear. All it takes is the right nudge and *BAM!* a couple thousand innocents dead and some Palestinians cheering in the streets.

This happens all the time. You can even check up on it in the international news. The internet isn't just for forums and gaming. Not only is this fact of life not news it also says something terribly depressing about the idiotic and gullible animals we humans really are. To find this state of affairs at all interesting or fascinating belies a disturbing naivety regarding the depths to which ordinary people can and do sink.

Romanticizing the badguys is something best left to the bored and sheltered.

Like the American government and i ain't afraid of them either.

...

*golfclaps* Touche.

 

[EzraPound]

That said, the people aren't horrid, and neither is the CoS. They've done some bad things, but what are we comparing them to? The Catholic Church, who were complicit in the brutal Portugese and Spanish colonization of South America? Radical Hinduism? Evangelism? Communism? Our society has a de facto standard for the perceived morality of both secular and non-secular groups existing, and - whether you like it or not - Scientology doesn't stand out as being non-compliant with it.

They also like to censor the internet. There's a lot of people on the internet who don't like being censored--something to do with freedom and anarchic principles. And I don't blame them in the least.

Trying to go up against the internet earns a lot more ire from a lot more people than any long-distant historical atrocity could. Anonymous didn't start protesting Scientology out of nowhere, Anon only started taking it seriously when it attempted to censor all videos depicting Tom Cruise's infamous public creep-out, especially on Youtube (claiming copyright, usually). And that ticked Anon off something fierce.

It's interesting to attempt to compare them to the histories of religions when, in fact, said religions do have their fair share of critics. Many of whom are a bit more fierce in their opposition of said religions than Scientology's critics are of them. (If you don't think Catholicism has any serious critics, then check out the more conservative Protestant denominations.) Communism has plenty of critics and opponents, and for good reason. Same with Evangelical Christians. Radical Hinduism is, well, a bit esoteric for the discussion. Radical Islam, on the other hand, is not well-liked in most of the world.

Frankly, the treatment the CoS has gotten from the media and internet is fair game in comparison. And rather light. (It gets off with a few masked protests and a surprisingly large number of apologists and defenders, so there's no guilt in speaking out against it. It's no underdog, by any measure of the term.)

It's just like every other terrible religion, so people should be allowed to speak out against it. Like they do with every other terrible religion.

Absolutely. But what I was referring to, more specifically, was the momentum in places such as France to ban Scientology when other religions - Catholicism, Islam, radical Protestant sects - are still allowed to exist. What this amounts to, in my opinion, is a simple tyranny of the majority: political figures in France couldn't dismantle Catholicism because of how deeply it reaches into a large number of their citizen's lives (and nor would they want to, necessarily, since it may reach into theirs too), but Scientology can be more easily targeted since its followers constitute a minority, and one that the public is widely discomfortable with.

Of course, it's not that the CoS hasn't done more to deserve condemnation than, say, the Raelians, but on the same hand their record for the endorsement of destructive behaviour isn't nearly as storied as that of several major groups, both political and religious. Perhaps more to the point is that in a society that strives to generate an open intellectual discourse, it is of paramount significance that groups not be singled on the basis of a double standard, lest any govenment damage their credibility as being restrained mediators of the public discourse (I say "restrained" since their may be incidents in which intervention is genuinely warranted).

I don't say this with the intent to posture myself as an 'apologist' for Scientology: indeed, I recognize the sect has a dubious history, and is arguably responsible for the day-in, day-out swindling of a large number of its followers, whether they can truly afford or not (I would not restrict this criticism to Scientology amongst legal groups, however). I am also aware of their social postures, which are byinlarge less than progressive - claiming homosexuality is tantamount to a flawed character, that the disabled committed felonies in a past life, et al. But I would nonetheless stand by my position that calling for the dissolution of Scientology (not what we were originally talking about, w/e) is suggestive of a double standard derived from a historicist public impulse towards the undue persecution of new religious movements.

Scientology is one of these religions

Every religion

No I'm not really. The thing I find strange is the amount of followers despite a) being a fairly obvious offshoot of pyramid schemes and b) the fact that the one who started the religion

Ah... they're a religion.

Stop. Right there. Scientology is not a religion, it's a cult.

I am not afraid of Scientology, in fact I don't think there are any Scientologists around here to be afraid of. I also trust Anon will take care of things, seeing as they're the only ones with the balls to confront them. http://www.whyweprotest.net/ Why am I the first to link this?

Incidentally, googling any small, recently-fund religious sect with the term "cult" beside it turns up a miscellany of high-profile uses of the two words together. Whatever Scientology is (cult, religion, applied philosophy, psychotheraphy equivalent, hate group), it's somewhat cheap to use the term "cult" as a means of deriding it. One can imagine, for example, that early Christianity required significant contributions of both time and money from its followers to flourish in the midst of Roman persecution (many offered up their homes for services and gave vast sums - this is history). Moreover, we know the Roman public initially despised Christians atleast as much as various western ones despise Scientologists.

Not that I support scientology, but you know, you don't have to join. in fact, if you don't pay, they won't let you join.

If the idiots of the world want to throw their money at them and eventually be killed by their church, hey, let em go for it. species will just get stronger

Basically, but not quite. Rather than giving "donations" to the church, for example, it is possible to volunteer for them, thusly gaining access to training techniques which can be reproduced for free outside said context.