Am I Sexist?

[Treblaine]

There is nothing sexist, sexual nor homosexual about wanting to roleplay as a female character. Any more than either gender choosing to play as a male character.

Why are people obsessed with finding ulterior motives in considering females as relatable protagonists?!?!

I think this is just a hangup from the media of how so much of the media depicts male as "the norm" and males as the protagonists. Female protagonists are just so much less common, in action they are definitely exceptional.

 

[JimB]

I know that sex and sexuality are at least somewhat hardwired. I'm also aware that characters in a video game are characters in a videogame. Meaning that, unlike in real life, people have a lot of choice about what their character does.

Maybe it's that I just woke up, but I'm honestly not sure what your point here is. Mind breaking it down for me?

But if you narrow it down to purely the dictionary definition you miss out on a lot of semantic context and as I said, the meaning differs from dictionary to dictionary.

This is a problem that can be solved with the application of more words. Rephrase your original question so it becomes...hm. Actually, I'm not sure what your real question is. I'm going to guess it's, "Do I actively and maliciously engage in behaviors intended to oppress and minimalize women?"

I have a lot of problems with your definition, since I think sexism as a discriminatory practice needs to be viewed as separate from what could be called "natural discrimination" (males finding it easier to understand/identify with other males simply due to common experiential traits).

If we're arguing about the labels to apply to degrees of sexism, then I think we still need to be able to identify the baseline from which those degrees spring.

I had another dictionary definition which was based more on action than thought. And I have now lost the link.

Eh, it happens.

Is using the word 'guy' or 'boy' sexist?

I'm unaware of any situation in which "guy" means anything derogatory. "Boy" can be sexist, depending on its use (also racist, but never mind).

Because I find them both neutral, pleasantly casual when discussing gender. "Woman" just sounds too...cold.

Regardless, a girl is a child. A woman is an adult. I dislike the word "woman" on etymological grounds myself, but the fact remains, an adult who is referred to as a child is one who is not wrong to feel upset by it, because it's disrespectful.

You know, I think that this perspective is what annoys me most of all regarding militant feminists. I have tons of friends. I have female friends. I have male friends. I have male gay friends. I even had a bisexual girlfriend for a time. *All* of them liked to ogle nice examples of what they were attracted to.

And I'd argue that if you're talking about real people being ogled, there's no issue (or at least, not inherently). What you're talking about is a fake person deliberately crafted to be sexualized and to sell that sexuality to men. The game is making the statement that women aren't to be sold to as customers, they're to be used as selling points; and when enough games and movies and TV shows do this, we create a culture where a woman is judged more harshly and more exclusively for her appearance than a man is because we've been trained to view them as objects first and people second.

Unless you are saying that women shouldn't be allowed to ogle/objectify good looking guys either?

Sexism applies equally to both sexes.

Which is why I say, in the context of this argument, you cannot only focus on mental processes, since for the most part they are entirely involuntary and even natural.

It's also entirely natural for human beings with impacted bowels to jam their fingers up their butts and start rooting around until the problem is solved, because that is an animal behavior. However, we've elevated ourselves above the level of mere animals through technology and, more importantly to this discussion, though society, which means we're beholden to the standards of our neighbors.

I'm trying to home in on why I have a problem with people using words like "discrimination" (which is a pretty nasty word) in connection with mental processes that we have little to no control over, it just seems silly to me.

If it makes you feel any better, I'm using the word without condemnation, since your sexism seems to be mild, passive, and ingrained rather than deliberate.

Trust me, I grew up in Southern Africa. If you want to see *real* discrimination, give that a try. First world problems and all that.

That's true, but at the same time, comparative standards are a dodge. You don't get to pick the worst possible example of a phenomenon and then tell people they can't judge you unless you're as bad as or worse than that.

Judgements involve the making of a decision. Making a decision, requiring at least some cognition and conscious choice.

And you decided to buy drinks for pretty girls.

Yes, but should we? This is *really* something you think needs changing? We should try to somehow teach men to be equally attracted to all people?

I...really don't think what I said can be interpreted that way, but maybe I was unclear, so let me be more explicit.

Attraction is a physiological process, and acting upon it is normal. However, once you allow that instinct to become self-justifying, you've absconded your responsibility to use your reason and you're treating people differently based on appearance. The problem here isn't liking pretty people, but rather the decision to put appearance first--which if literally what's happening, since you're choosing whom to talk to at this party based on appearance--and personality second.

Perhaps I should have been clearer in my OP. I will choose male characters in RPGs that I know will involve some sort of romance. If there was no romance, I'd probably play a female character.

Uh, what RPG has mandatory romance? Because I can't think of a situation in which it's not your choice to make fucking happen.

You've made a judgement call that doing the above is somehow sexist.

You asked if it's sexist. You didn't ask if I care enough to try to get you to change your behavior. I don't, because you don't believe me or agree with my stances, so what's the point? Until and unless you come to this on your own, you won't care enough to change, and I have better things to do than rage against what I can't change. Your views on sex are not perfect, but they're tolerable, and I'll take what I can get.

You're a straight, human male.

Wow, that might have actually just summed it all up. You're a dude, you don't want to be staring at a dude's ass for the many hours of a game you'll play, you'd much rather it be a girl's ass.

That really isn't helping his case. You're still objectifying people by viewing them according to their fuckability; and worse, you aren't even doing it to a real person. You're doing it to an image on a computer screen. Something you have absolutely no chance of ever interacting with sexually is something you need to judge on sexual criteria?

Really, phrased the way you put it, I can see the point of that person who said it's homophobic. There is no need to be staring at the male character's ass and fixating on trying to fuck it.

It also doesn't help that, once again, the female character is a girl and not a woman.

 

[BENZOOKA]

No.

It's not discriminating nor fostering negative stereotypes.

Next.

 

[Soundwave]

I've never understood the guy playing girl argument of 'I'd rather stare at a chick ass for 30 hours than a man ass', because I've played girl and guy characters and never even noticed the fact that their ass is wiggling in front of me. I've just been some camera following some dude/chick around.
That's probably just my own experience though, and form your point of view, no, I wouldn't say you were sexist.

You haven't played a Female Orc from WoW, have you?

 

[DugMachine]

I'd say no. Play whatever you want. It's a fucking game in a fucking FANTASY world.

 

[Phasmal]

I'm gonna go with `YESNOMAYBEIDONTKNOWWHOCARES`.

I feel it covers all my bases.
I do find the `nicer ass to stare at` argument hella silly, because if you cannot help but stare at the ass of your character in an MMO all the time... you're doing it wrong.
But to each his own.
Plus so many guys playing girls on MMO has allowed real girls to hide amongst their numbers and get creeped on less.

Though I don't get how roleplaying a straight woman would be hard or weird at all.
I have roleplayed pretty much all combinations of sexuality and gender.

 

[Playful Pony]

No sensible women would call you sexist for that... Those that do are (you guessed it!) not sensible!

 

[Legion]

Is this the wrong address?thought this was a gaming website,not some "oh-my-life-is-so-terrible-am-i-sexist-what-is-this-planet-women-huh-wat-listen-to-my-sob-story-best-soap-oprea-ever" website (facebook and twitter)

No, but as a new person you probably missed the recent debates on sexism in gaming. People are somewhat touchy about the subject, so the OP is merely creating a discussion to see whether people consider his behaviour to be sexist or not.

Do remember that nobody is forced to click on a topic, nor is it mandatory to reply to a topic if it doesn't appeal to you. So if you don't like it, you can always ignore it.

 

[DoomyMcDoom]

I know people on either side of the argument, I personally play male characters in most games, unless I'm playing stealthy even then depends on my role, I think it's because most of the women I know hate violence, or are themselves not violent at all, whereas most guys I've know including myself have had moments of abject brutality come forth from within at times when it may or may not be appropriate.

I figure if I wanna play a big warrior who cleaves people in half with an axe or walks through a building coming out the other side dripping in hiw enemy's blood, and not seeming to give a shit, chances are I'll play a guy, we tend to be more able to emotionally distance ourselves from violence than women, I know I've distanced myself emotionally from many things, it comes easy.

In otherwords, since I relate to male characters, and see them as more fitting in the roles I normally play (warriors, heavy weapons personel, and barbarians), that's my thing, I can totally understand that some guys prefer a female aesthetic to their characters.

It's all good as long as it doesn't hurt anyone.

 

[lord.jeff]

He's not "assigning a personality."

I know. He already said that back when he said he can't play women and he definitely can't play straight women because he can't fathom what it's like to have a vagina and he definitely can't fathom what it's like to enjoy the feeling of a penis inside a vagina, for which reason he cannot comprehend a woman's personality well enough to mimic one.

EDIT: This is my five hundredth post. I wonder how many of those posts have been about sexism. I may need to question how much good I'm actually accomplishing.

With that logic you, you could argue no male author is allowed to write a female character because no male has an idea of what that feels like.

OT: From what you're saying you aren't sexist and as long as you don't treat females any different then you would a male in real life then your not sexist.

 

[Calibanbutcher]

But if I was to play as a man, how would I get my game-and-fap-breaks?


I really don't have anything usefull to contribute to this thread, but this joke had to be made.
But you may use this post to insult me in any way you see fit.
You could:
1. Imply that I am secretly homosexual and confused about my sexuality.
2. Call me out on being sexist for not also fapping to male characters.
3. Insult my inteligence and call me a sexual deviant and pervert.

But please refrain from insulting my avatar, since I quite like it.

 

[AngloDoom]

It's true - if you find the female form attractive you're either gay or sexist.

There is literally no other possibility, you're just going to have to accept that you're not normal like the rest of us, who literally cannot see the fleshy shell which surrounds a woman but simply peer straight into the soul of the individual with no bias and decide to pick our characters in a game based on their raw personality.

 

[kyuzo3567]

Really easy way to settle this.... if we take the OP and reverse every mention of gender (OP is now a female who makes male avatars to play as etc...) is it still just as sexist?
If yes then we're all sexist because we've all done it, or will do it, at some point in time
If no, then that's a double standard and the OP shouldn't be a sexist

Personally I've always found I tend to play better with a female character, I have ever since I was young... I think it started with pokemon crystal actually...


and another thing.... avatars are a bunch of friggin code... you can't really be sexist and discriminate to something that exists only in virtual reality with no thought, emotions, personality etc...

 

[theheroofaction]

I really don't see the problem. If you're going to stare at an avatar for three hours, it might as well be a sexy avatar.

 

[darlarosa]

I think your not necessarily sexist. However I think you present an interesting perspective that does come from objectification.

Let's break it down into basics

1)You play female characters because you enjoy their aesthetics, which is objectification in some way.
2)You do not play female characters in more intensive rpgs
3)You play male characters when you want to get into a story or scenario.

I understand it not feeling "right" or normal if you don't play as one thing. I always prefer to play female characters, for me it just feels correct, as does making those characters usually appear African American. That is just a personal preference. IN that way I guess we are similar but it is just...interesting. On your end it seems to indicate not connecting to a female identity or being willing/able to. Essentially it comes off as taking the male character seriously as opposed to the female characters which are just nice to look at. It does not read so much as a gender or sexual identity feeling more appropriate, so much as an association thing.

 

[KiloFox]

okay...

i'm a guy myself, and i play a female in nearly every non-first person game i play. (even some first person games. my character model in Halo Reach is Female) and i've been asked countless times if i'm female IRL. because i don't do what i've seen a lot of "males playing females" (lets call them "crossgamers" hmm?) do. I.E. dress them slutty and overplay it. instead i model their style like most gamers would imagine a girl would (i'm assuming). i match it all and make it look nice, while still modest.

now unlike OP, i don't have a reason i can spout for doing so. i don't prefer (nessesarily) looking at the female form over a males. i'm gay, if anything that logic should have me playing a male all the time. i don't find role-playing a female easier eaither.

if i had to come up with a reason, i'd say gaming stereotypes.

lemme explain... in games, they tend to construct the male outfit to be big, bulky and badass. lots of spikes and shiny steel and stuff. usually with the character model about the size of a fridge. it does not fit my playstyle (i play rogues and assassins), how i look, (6'4", 148Lbs) or what i find nice to look at.
the female model and outfits tend to be slim and sleek, while still having a "i will fuck up your day" look to it. (when not being slutty) which fits my playstyle perfectly.

 

[Daverson]

Doc* Dave's Sexism Test:
1. Do you believe that women are inferior to men?
2. Do you believe that men are inferior to women?
If you answered no to both of these questions, you aren't sexist! Congratulations!

*Please note that Mr. Daverson has absolutely no formal medical training.