I'm terrible at them, but that isn't much of a reason not to like them. I don't like them because they essentially come down to button mashing. A guy who memorizes every combo can be slain by a guy who taps 'A' repeatedly. I just can't get behind a genre with the button mashing mentality.
Any stubborn anti-fighting game players out there?
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Oh, but it is just so true. If you can button-mash, you can beat the combos. I've proven it myself. Sure you'll lose more often than not, but you'll win more than you should. It'd be like completely guessing on a multiple-choice test: You get an average of 1-in-4 correct (Assuming 4 possible answers to each question). Except you'd actually get more like 3-in-8 or 7-in-16 correct, because the odds aren't as against you. And I'm sure you can provide a video or 10 to show the superiority of combos, but how many people are going to post videos of their defeats at the hands of the mashers? I know for a fact it happens. And I don't like it.Dreiko said:
I think that fighting games get a bad rap due to the thought that only people that can memorize eleventy-billion button combo strings can be good and that's simply not true.
It's odd then that under tournament level play vids on youtube they're filled with comments to the effect of "Yawn, same move over and over again" and not "Holy shit! How can you memorize those 64 hit combos!"
The answer is that the fighting genre is more about what you (or your opponent) could do or might do next than infinite combo loops. 2d fighting games are about controlling space, not doing the most damage. Most of the time the big combos are not a good strategy, one missed link or cancel and you're open to punishment no matter how many combos you know.
Even so, if fighting games aren't for you then don't play them. They are repetitive (more so than most video games anyway, save maybe Sim Racing and Music games) and the learning curve nearly has an overhang, but like everything else in life, you only get out what you put in. Personally, I like the idea of one-on-one competition with only my wits to defend me. One joystick and six buttons each-- now have at it!
It's odd then that under tournament level play vids on youtube they're filled with comments to the effect of "Yawn, same move over and over again" and not "Holy shit! How can you memorize those 64 hit combos!"
The answer is that the fighting genre is more about what you (or your opponent) could do or might do next than infinite combo loops. 2d fighting games are about controlling space, not doing the most damage. Most of the time the big combos are not a good strategy, one missed link or cancel and you're open to punishment no matter how many combos you know.
Even so, if fighting games aren't for you then don't play them. They are repetitive (more so than most video games anyway, save maybe Sim Racing and Music games) and the learning curve nearly has an overhang, but like everything else in life, you only get out what you put in. Personally, I like the idea of one-on-one competition with only my wits to defend me. One joystick and six buttons each-- now have at it!
I have this horrible love-hate relationship with fighting games. I love to play them but they hate me playing them. The only fighting games I agree with are the Budokai Tenkaichi series and even then my ability is questionable.
I'd love to get into Mortal Kobat again (after my arcade youth of loving them) but I can't justify the price of MK9 in case it ends up driving me to suicide *thinks back to BlazBlue*
I'd love to get into Mortal Kobat again (after my arcade youth of loving them) but I can't justify the price of MK9 in case it ends up driving me to suicide *thinks back to BlazBlue*
The fact remains that people who lose to mashers are not quite "there" yet.Imat said:
Sure, it's possible to be adequate at a game and somehow still lose to stupid stuff...but that doesn't mean anything other than the loser's lack of training.
After a certain, quite attainable mind you, skill level, it is virtually impossible to lose to a masher. If it's anything more than that then simply the game you're playing is a terrible game and shouldn't be considered a serious fighter.
Using your personal experience to speak about fighters in general is a big no-no btw. The pavements are filled with the skull impressions of people thinking of themselves as "the shit" once they dared to venture out into the worldwide arena simply because of their personal experience with fighting games inside a small circle of acquaintances not reflecting the actual reality of these games. Just because you did it doesn't mean it is what actually happens on the metagame. How a game is played when you first get it or when you're 7 is quite a different animal to high level play.
I'm going to have to reiterate myself here in saying that Button Mashing will not let you win, period. The people you "proved" this with are not as good as they think they are, or you've been playing total noobs.Imat said:
Button mashing will NEVER beat a combo...ever, because a combo is a series of attacks that string together to form an unbreakable chain which the victim cannot escape until a) the combo ends, or b) the victim initiates some sort of combo breaker mechanic.
It doesn't even matter how random the button mashing is, it still falls flat against any half decent player. Even within the chaos that is mashing and random moves, there is predictability. It's simply a matter of exploiting the cool downs of attacks, holes in the general strategy, or just fucking throwing the opponent or zoning them to death.
AT BEST a button masher will get ONE lucky round, and anything after that wont work because the other player would have adapted by that point if they are even half decent. This nonsense that button mashing is a viable way to win is something that misinformed players need to stop thinking, because they'll never improve at the game and will just spread this bile and thus tarnishing the perception of the genre even further.
Super Smash Bros and Marvel vs Capcom are some of the most accessible fighting game series in the genre. They're party games, something you can play with friends and relax with. You can do reasonably well by button mashing, but the tourney fags who feel the need to divide everything in tiers can still get a sense of accomplishment AWAY from the people there just to have fun. Basically, they're games where pressing the "Random" character selection button is NOT the equivalent to a death sentence for a newb or a means of hardcore players to just show off.
people don't want to play mortal kombat because its totally shit..... barely counts as a fighting game at all, comparing it to street fighter is like comparing yeast to people, more or less made of the same stuff but ones clearly superior.
Fighting games are pretty much everything I dislike in a game:
1) Combos
2) Memorising tons of moves and their counters (why I dislike most RTS games in multiplayer)
3) Control Schemes that don't make sense to me (why do you need two different punches?)
4) Over the top particle explosions whenever the combatants make contact (MK doesn't do this, I admit)
I like the actual concept, I just don't like the "classic" style fighting games like MK, SF, MvC, etc. I'd play a 3D fighting game though, because you could make it really deep without needing to go into combo's and all that bollocks (Just look at Zeno Clash and Mount and Blade).
1) Combos
2) Memorising tons of moves and their counters (why I dislike most RTS games in multiplayer)
3) Control Schemes that don't make sense to me (why do you need two different punches?)
4) Over the top particle explosions whenever the combatants make contact (MK doesn't do this, I admit)
I like the actual concept, I just don't like the "classic" style fighting games like MK, SF, MvC, etc. I'd play a 3D fighting game though, because you could make it really deep without needing to go into combo's and all that bollocks (Just look at Zeno Clash and Mount and Blade).
Oh, but it is just so true. If you can button-mash, you can beat the combos. I've proven it myself. Sure you'll lose more often than not, but you'll win more than you should. It'd be like completely guessing on a multiple-choice test: You get an average of 1-in-4 correct (Assuming 4 possible answers to each question). Except you'd actually get more like 3-in-8 or 7-in-16 correct, because the odds aren't as against you. And I'm sure you can provide a video or 10 to show the superiority of combos, but how many people are going to post videos of their defeats at the hands of the mashers? I know for a fact it happens. And I don't like it.[/quote]Imat said:
If the person loses then that means they are NOT skilled. Sure, the player can do flashy combos or complex moves but if they can not properly apply these techniques then these skills are all for naught. At best a button masher will take a round from a player who really knows what their doing but not a full game.
Blazblue is awesome man, you just need to do the tutorials to get a basic idea, then do the challenge mode for some simple combos and then slowly but surely build your skill online.Azure-Supernova said:
Horny Ico said:
Well, Blazblue's story is like a Jrpg in scope and length, only more complex, the combat is varied enough and every character plays completely uniquely so as to give you a refreshed experience and tons of depth and ways of fighting you woudn't normally associate with fighting games (such as using the wind to alter trajectory of projectiles and attacks or using mirrors to reflect projectiles or controlling 2 fighters at the same time through a robot partner of one of the characters) and is not too repetitive and the pace of the battles is quick and with a lot of movement so you never feel restricted.