Anyone else think that the way we ask people out is incredibly messed up?

[Relish in Chaos]

To be honest, I always assumed that the best way of asking someone out is being friends with them first, maybe flirting with them a bit, seeing if their response is positive, and then asking them out when you think the time is right. If she rejects you, then oh well. "Soul mates" don't exist; that's just some bullshit naive idealists and American rom-coms cooked up. You meet someone, you like them, and you date them. Whether or not you stay together depends on your circumstances and how people can adapt and change, necessarily or unnecessarily, over time.

But, obviously, different methods work for different people. For example, my friend got with his girlfriend when they just drunkenly got off with each other at a party, and then they just decided to go out, although I think they did vaguely know each other from university or something. And, yeah, they've broken up now, but still.

 

[hooblabla6262]

The way I preceived it was the end result. If you two end up actually being together, they were dates. If not, you call them hang outs.

Personally, I call them all dates cause sex is usually involved. Makes me feel like less of a slut if I'm dating the girl, plus they seem to like it when I say we're dating. Even if it is casually.

Ah, post-hoc rationalization with an added dash of pretentiousness. No offense, I don't mean to call you any names, it's...well, I suppose it's human.

It just rubs me the wrong way; nothing personal.

It is certainly a silly system full of strange nuances and a serious lack of definition, but I don't understand where pretentiousness comes in to play.
And no offence taken. I'm not entirely sure how I could take offence.

Also, what exactly rubs you the wrong way? For my clarification.

 

[Vegosiux]

The way I preceived it was the end result. If you two end up actually being together, they were dates. If not, you call them hang outs.

Personally, I call them all dates cause sex is usually involved. Makes me feel like less of a slut if I'm dating the girl, plus they seem to like it when I say we're dating. Even if it is casually.

Ah, post-hoc rationalization with an added dash of pretentiousness. No offense, I don't mean to call you any names, it's...well, I suppose it's human.

It just rubs me the wrong way; nothing personal.

It is certainly a silly system full of strange nuances and a serious lack of definition, but I don't understand where pretentiousness comes in to play.
And no offence taken. I'm not entirely sure how I could take offence.

Also, what exactly rubs you the wrong way? For my clarification.

Well, I find soft-shoing around the fact that "I meet up with that person to have sex" with "We're on a date today" a bit pretentious. I mean, if you're man enough to have a booty call, why aren't you man enough to call it what it is? (Again, "you" as in "whoever happens to be reading", not you personally). For the same reason I despise the expression "friends with benefits" - the expression itself, not what it means. I'm all for casual sex with someone you enjoy it with, just, seriously, we're old enough to not be talking about birds and bees or using other kinds of euphemisms to make it sound not-sexual.

And seconds, this "casual" thing...I mean, I don't know, that just seems to me as if "dating" would come down to be nothing serious at all, so I'm even more baffled why it's made such a big deal one goes out of their way to make it a point.

Hooooo boy, look at me ramble. But bottom line is, I don't see anything wrong with people enjoying their encounters of any kind, but I get really exasperated when people rationalize it and I don't know...feel the need to justify them? One of my personality quirks I suppose.

 

[hooblabla6262]

Well, I find soft-shoing around the fact that "I meet up with that person to have sex" with "We're on a date today" a bit pretentious. I mean, if you're man enough to have a booty call, why aren't you man enough to call it what it is? (Again, "you" as in "whoever happens to be reading", not you personally). For the same reason I despise the expression "friends with benefits" - the expression itself, not what it means. I'm all for casual sex with someone you enjoy it with, just, seriously, we're old enough to not be talking about birds and bees or using other kinds of euphemisms to make it sound not-sexual.

And seconds, this "casual" thing...I mean, I don't know, that just seems to me as if "dating" would come down to be nothing serious at all, so I'm even more baffled why it's made such a big deal one goes out of their way to make it a point.

Hooooo boy, look at me ramble. But bottom line is, I don't see anything wrong with people enjoying their encounters of any kind, but I get really exasperated when people rationalize it and I don't know...feel the need to justify them? One of my personality quirks I suppose.

I can see where you are coming from, but I think the issue comes with intent. Especially when you have two parties who might have two different end goals.

My end goal on a date or a hang out or whatever you want to call it is not usually sex, but I do enjoy steering things in that direction. So am I dating or meeting up with someone for sex? We need definitions people!

And I think the friends with benefits is a good label. Nobody thinks it means anything other than friends who have sex, which is its purpose, so it works for me. But we could spend all day coming up with labels that are more direct. We could just start calling them "Fuck Buddies".

The casual dating is a whole other jar of pickles I probably shouldn't open. I think it has a bad rep, and it shouldn't. It's all about getting to know as many people as possible. Making an informed decision before you stop casual dating, and start exclusive dating.

 

[A.A.K]

The best relationship I've had in my life...was with a girl I just randomly felt like talking to.
She then dated me for 2.5 years and they were easily, by far, the greatest years of my life.

I just run off consequences.
Weigh up all of the potential consequences of the scenario, and if you can accept them - then go for it.

If she told me to fuck off because I was a creep, way back when, then the only consequence I would have had is being unable to talk to her. That's it. Nothing else.
I can talk to women rather easily on buses, coffee shops, whatever... The only reason I'm not in a serious relationship now is just...effort. I'm sick of finding women who I wouldn't allow shine my shoes. Conservative Republican characters, arrogant atheist dicks, extreme naturalists'/spiritualists'. "If you can't listen to metal as angry as mine than you're a pussy" and my personal favourite "If you don't have a black belt, how can you fight?"..."hehehe, come at me bro."

 

[TheRightToArmBears]

I think you might be misunderstanding what's going on. People (at least everyone I've ever met) don't go up and talk to strangers to start long term relationships usually, it's more about looking for a good night or a short fling. Being confident is attractive, being awkward and shy isn't. I cannot think of anyone I know who has ever been in a long term relationship from meeting a stranger in a bar or something, it just doesn't happen. You're right, you do need to get to know them first, but serious relationships aren't what people are after when they do that.

 

[tautologico]

Perhaps it is my own experiences colouring how I see the rest of the world, but I've always seen this as more of an American thing than a European one.

My thought exactly.

I always did find the concept of dating to be rather strange.
Silly Americans and their silly rituals.

Here in South America it's similar. We find the whole notion of "dating" we see in US movies and TV funny.

 

[Tycon]

Hmmm, there seams to be a pretty agreed consensus that the current system we use to preform this "ritual" of finding another mate is inherently flawed and obviously has many glaring problems. It seams to me from my personal point of view a perception problem, with many of these men and women replying to this post with different interpretations of what "dating" is or means and how one perceives to preform romantic advance. Its these complications which lead me to believe why such a common sought after experience hasn't really been quantified while unanimously accepted.

What puzzles me is why I find people seam to be reluctant to try to break down what makes "dating" a complex entity and look at it objectively .It seams people want this kind of event in their lives to be "special" or feel natural so planning and artificially creating systems to "hook up" with people seams to be frown upon and discouraged by the general consensus. An example of this is hooking up through technology based methods such as the internet, text or phone is frowned upon as well as the guides found on forums are often criticized and ignored by most people.

My main question is why is it looked down upon to question, oppose or objectify this ritual system and many risks / hoops to jump through to achieve a common goal among many humans? It's been stated prior in this thread that other animals don't seam to exhibit mating rituals this complicated or hard to read so why is it that we have lopped it this way? DO you think its for the overall best in the long run actually, if mating was so easy it wouldn't be as rewarding when you do find that special person, and over population which is a rising apparent problem would be much more prevalent. Perhaps although its very lonely for many people and not necessarily fair,it is a factor that is limiting explosive growth of the human population. Speaking about this system with a United States center of focus, places such as Japan are experiencing population net loss with a similar situation so perhaps a cultural difference is to blame?

Sorry for any ignorance that I may appear to show, this department of life is something I have little to almost no experience with and have simply to continue to have little experience with, dating doesn't come naturally to myself and I probably spend more time thinking how its done and what if than actually putting theory to practice, so take what I say with a grain of salt.

I appreciate the time you spent making this post and allowing it to be a thought provoking event in my life today as well as the many other people who've read this and/or replied. I appreciate all of your input, insight and time you've spent out of your day to attempt to help the OP and other readers such as myself. Sorry for the jumbled wall of text XD.

 

[thesilentman]

There are so many "dating guides" out there that tell you to just "be confident", saying that the mere acting of going up and talking to someone does most of the work for you. Yet that still fails for many guys because they're nervous about approaching complete strangers.

Here's the thing: THEY SHOULD BE. I've come to the conclusion lately that the standard advice given about asking people out assumes that the person of interest is someone you don't (or barely) know. And that's really stupid. I've met people of girls who I found attractive until the moment the opened their mouth, and I lost interest because of how much of an idiot they were. Even if they aren't a complete idiot right off the bat, that's no guarantee you will get along. Religious and political views can be a massive dealbreaker. Maybe they're busy with school or a difficult project and don't have time to date. Hell, even if you two do have a lot in common, there's plenty of little things that might mess things up.

I've heard dating advice of "find someone you're attracted to, then find out what they like and try to get involved". Isn't that the opposite of how it should be? Shouldn't you first find activities you like and use them to meet people you're more likely to get along with? The approach of "ask out a complete stranger in the hopes that you might be compatible no matter how low the odds are"? Not to mention, "Call Me Maybe" is a popular song that glorifies the stupidity of it. Grr.

Captcha: Who, what, where. How does it know?

I agree. I've seen many people who look nice, but I can tell that they're idiots the moment I ask them a few questions.

As a sophomore in high school, this is precisely the reason that I've never considered dating anyone at this period in time. My criteria for dating is "the person who I'm dating should be nice and knowledgeable". After those two criteria(on?) are filled, then I'll see if I can stay in a relationship with her.

But when you're surrounded by women who don't know a damn thing about anything, it's... kinda hard to find someone. I'm not saying that everyone's like that, more that I've seen this around my area than anything else. It just boils down to the fact that I haven't found the right person yet.

 

[Lieju]

The advice my mom always gave me: "Find someone you can be friends with first." is pretty good, I find.

Depends on what you're looking for, though. What I want is a partner for life, if you want to have a good marriage rather than a relationship, the way marriage used to be, you need someone with good social standing and wealth.

 

[suitepee7]

personally the act of going up to strangers is a bit weird anyway. personally i don't like strangers coming up to me, creeps me out and i'm pretty awkward. if it's general interaction anyway, and conversation just kinda happens, thats how it should be (2 people having a common interest and talking about it, progression from there, or talking to work colleagues and finding out you have similar interests etc). naturally occurring relationships are how i like it

 

[runic knight]

That was so wrong

But oh so amusing. Seems to be a 15 year olds guide to romance....

Vault said a little rapey.... I say it gets a lot rapey...just patiently rapey...

my favorite part is if she wont put out you eather A.need to preasure her more B.she's a fridgid ***** and not worth your time

seems legit!

I know. he even says, right at the start,

Firstly, this isn't a joke guide.

Think that is something only the most tested and trustworthy would preface their instruction guide with.

 

[RhombusHatesYou]

Strike up a conversation and chat away

This is the standard dating advice, but the problem is how the fuck do you do that?

"Nice shoes, let's fuck."

If you don't get slapped, kicked in the balls, set on fire or otherwise discouraged, you've got a shot.

 

[The Funslinger]

Possibly, but I have a solution to everybody's problems. Man, women, children!...Okay perhaps not children

Just simply read this guide, made by one hell of a 'playa'

http://www.textfiles.com/100/lay-girl.txt

Follow this guide and to quote the genius himself, you'll be on "the kings way", baby!

[sub] You should all thank KungFu_Teddybear (I think?) for finding this originally. I was in tears by the end of it XD [/sub]

I made it past 'King's Way', but lost it at the choice of words 'doing sex'. xD

 

[Andy Shandy]

Possibly, but I have a solution to everybody's problems. Man, women, children!...Okay perhaps not children

Just simply read this guide, made by one hell of a 'playa'

http://www.textfiles.com/100/lay-girl.txt

Follow this guide and to quote the genius himself, you'll be on "the kings way", baby!

[sub] You should all thank KungFu_Teddybear (I think?) for finding this originally. I was in tears by the end of it XD [/sub]

I made it past 'King's Way', but lost it at the choice of words 'doing sex'. xD

I think my absolute favourite part is "Another area you should quest is her ass"

After everything before it, I think I was in tears of laughter at that part for a full five minutes or so.

Basically like this.

 

[Bad Jim]

This is the standard dating advice, but the problem is how the fuck do you do that?

No, the problem is "How the fuck do you stop overanalyzing the situation and realize that the worst that can happen is things staying the way they are?"

worst thing that can happen is you do some tiny mistake in your approach and a girl you have been eyeing for 3 years (literally) and you lost her forever. i should know, been there done that.

That's not actually worse than eyeing a girl for 3 years(literally), saying nothing, then continuing to eye her for another 3 years until she hooks up with someone else. Remaining silent loses every girl forever.

And really, if she's known you for 3 years, she's already made her mind up whether she likes you or not. If she rejects you after a tiny mistake, she would have rejected you even if you had made no mistakes.

yes, it is worse. hope is a powerful thing.

Hope is exactly what you don't have if you never make a move.

 

[Mycroft Holmes]

There are so many "dating guides" out there that tell you to just "be confident"... ...Yet that still fails for many guys because they're nervous about approaching complete strangers.

If they are nervous then they aren't being confident, now are they? Confidence works, you just have to actually be it.

 

[WWmelb]

That was so wrong

But oh so amusing. Seems to be a 15 year olds guide to romance....

Vault said a little rapey.... I say it gets a lot rapey...just patiently rapey...

my favorite part is if she wont put out you eather A.need to preasure her more B.she's a fridgid ***** and not worth your time

seems legit!

What about the "If she resists don't worry she wants it"... good lord that thing was messed up.

Anyways , i suck at asking people out in person. I need to get to know someone a little bit first, and to be honest, the most luck i've had was while playing WoW. i can flirt in text like nothing else, but can't do it in reality.

Most people say that MMO's ruin your sex life, but mine in my wow days was fantastic. If there is one thing i learned, there is just a high a percentage of basement dwelling sex fiends of the female persuasion on line as there are males lol.

Its fantastic, but alas, i don't play anymore.

 

[Byzantinium]

I, and I assume the others in my position, have nothing to be confident about.

I don't talk much anyway, it took me six months before I started talking to my co-workers.