Are PCs still really less reliable than consoles?

[cuddly_tomato]

"In the early months after the console's launch, Microsoft stated that the Xbox 360's failure rate was within the consumer electronics industry's typical 3% to 5%.[7][8][9][10] Nevertheless, Microsoft has not released their official statistics on the failure rate of the various versions of the console; the company's press relations policy is to focus on the prompt resolution of any technical problems.[11]"

There goes reliability.

Yes, for Xbox 360 hardware. Have anything on the other's hardware or all three's software?

Don't even try talking to Eggo.

PCs have considerably more reliable hardware than Xbox360 consoles, which are cheap and nasty. PS3s do fail from time to time, and PC hardware keeps chugging away quite nicely. I don't really know about the Wii. The problem for console hardware is obvious - cramming so much high tech gear that generates so much heat into a small plastic box.

So I would say that yes, PCs themselves can be classed as considerably more robust than consoles as far as hardware is concerned.

The problem is PC games are broken, unfinished, buggy pieces of shit.

 

[ThorUK]

The original difference in reliability between consoles and PCs does come from the fact that consoles were built purely for gaming, with maximized user-friendliness (why they never introduced a mouse for the console shooter games, I'll never understand), while PC were general-purpose tools, and at the same time the raw materials for said tools - things were bound to break. It was like comparing a toy with no moving parts, built out of a solid lump of wood or metal to a swiss army knife with lots of fiddly parts that fold away, and let you do lots of interesting and sometimes fun stuff, except it's made out of pastic, so you probably shouldn't use the saw too much!

These days, consoles and PCs have a lot more in common, although if a game was released with major bugs on the consoles, it'd still be an instant fail, whereas for the PC, it's a fairly common occurance (STALKER, Bloodlines, etc.). The fact is, with a PC it's easy to fix - just release a patch. The overwhelming majority of PC gamers have access to the internet in one form or another, so getting the fix will never pose a problem. Consoles, are generally harder to fix things on, both hardware- and software-side: if you've had any debugging experience with your PC, and solved it, you probably know the ins and outs of your system pretty well - console users, however, dont get the opportunity, since the console is sealed shut, and opening it up voids your warranty, not that there are a lot of places to get replacement parts, anyway. Similarly, the software for consoles isn't as easily altered/fixed... Anyway, I'm going off-topic here...

Are consoles more reliable, on average?

Most likely.

Can you fix the PC problems if you're an experienced PC user?

Most likely.

Can you do the same for a console?

No

The fact of the matter is that although PCs crash and break more often, it's easier to fix them - consoles, although less likely to fail tend to fail in ways the user can't fix.

What this means for me, in effect, is that a PC is more reliable - if you're a console gamer, or aren't comfortable bedugging computer software or hardware, the console will prbbably be more reliable for you.

 

[Liverandbacon]

The problem is PC games are broken, unfinished, buggy pieces of shit.

And as consoles become more and more like normal PCs (online capability + hard drives = patches), the devs and publishers will start to cut corners on bugfixing there too. The people who are willing to release an unfinished product in order to make a bit more cash are the real problem.

Currently though:
Reliable Hardware - PC
Reliable Software - Consoles (though this is changing)

And also, if you're happy with console level graphics in PC gaming, you really don't need to upgrade that much. Also, no one's mentioned this, but a monitor is a lot cheaper than an HDTV (in general) that runs at the same resolution. If one has an HDTV already, ok, but if they don't, console gaming (that still looks half decent) is very expensive.

 

[Ace of Spades]

I don't like playing on the PC. I actually have to know what I'm doing when I install a game because something is not going to work, or some file isn't going to exist, or it's going to hit a fatal error. It is very seldom that a console game doesn't work, but I have at least one problem every time I install a PC game. Consoles are far more reliable.

 

[cuddly_tomato]

And as consoles become more and more like normal PCs (online capability + hard drives = patches), the devs and publishers will start to cut corners on bugfixing there too. The people who are willing to release an unfinished product in order to make a bit more cash are the real problem.

Absolutely agree.

Currently though:
Reliable Hardware - PC
Reliable Software - Consoles (though this is changing)

Once again I agree, but not changing rapidly though, nor are console games anything like as poor as their console variants in terms of quality. I posted that Fallout 3 pic earlier but maybe that was a bad example (Bethesda are well known for releasing things half-assed and half-finished). Look instead to GTA4 and the plethora of problems that the PC version suffers next to its console variants.

Not only that but PC games are laden with DRM, which is about the dumbest business practice I have seen in my entire life. There is no limit to how many times I can remove and replace my Saints Row 2 disk in my Xbox360 - it will always work. Spore lets me do it three times. And then tells me to go buy the thing again.

 

[Liverandbacon]

I don't like playing on the PC. I actually have to know what I'm doing when I install a game because something is not going to work, or some file isn't going to exist, or it's going to hit a fatal error.

I really don't feel this is the case. I installed my first PC game when I was about 6, without help. The only knowledge it really took was the ability to read the buttons that said "next" "back" and "exit". I've never had an error in the install process once in the years since then. Maybe everyone who's posted in this thread is just way more unlucky than me or something.

Not only that but PC games are laden with DRM, which is about the dumbest business practice I have seen in my entire life. There is no limit to how many times I can remove and replace my Saints Row 2 disk in my Xbox360 - it will always work. Spore lets me do it three times. And then tells me to go buy the thing again.

Ugh, don't get me on about DRM. It is clearly not effective at stopping piracy (they know as well as we do it doesn't). What it has succeeded at (and probably its true purpose for existance) is killing the used PC games business. And considering the way people are whining about the console used games business, as soon as the suits figure out a way to kill that too, they will.

Anyway, back on the topic of reliability. Yeah, I don't think the console market will start getting the same level unpolished stuff we do on PC quickly, however that's mainly because the next generation of consoles aren't coming for a while. I think that buggy "patch-it-later" games won't become too commmon this gen, but they will be very widespread when the next generation of consoles come out. Really, the people who want to make a bit of extra money out of unfinished products are responsible for both forms of unreliability. It's their fault PC games are unfinished, and also their fault that many consoles aren't designed intellgiently (hardware reliability-wise) the first time round. If only they'd just release a finished PC game or a finished console.

 

[cuddly_tomato]

Anyway, back on the topic of reliability. Yeah, I don't think the console market will start getting the same level unpolished stuff we do on PC quickly, however that's mainly because the next generation of consoles aren't coming for a while. I think that buggy "patch-it-later" games won't become too commmon this gen, but they will be very widespread when the next generation of consoles come out. Really, the people who want to make a bit of extra money out of unfinished products are responsible for both forms of unreliability. It's their fault PC games are unfinished, and also their fault that many consoles aren't designed intellgiently (hardware reliability-wise) the first time round. If only they'd just release a finished PC game or a finished console.

I don't think the console market will ever suffer the amount buggy crap the PC market suffers. To be a PC gamer requires a certain level of expertise in dealing with such matters. To be a console gamer requires nothing more than plugging the console into the wall, thus bugged games will end up getting returned to the store and in the bargain basket during the first week of sale.

Having said that, Fable 2 was a heap of bugs with bugs within those bugs. But that is the only example I can think of (besides Oblivion), every other game I have ever bought for a console has worked great without the need for patching.

They won't release finished PC games for the exact reason they won't release finished consoles - fanboy morons will still go out and buy them, then swear blind there isn't a problem.

 

[Liverandbacon]

Anyway, back on the topic of reliability. Yeah, I don't think the console market will start getting the same level unpolished stuff we do on PC quickly, however that's mainly because the next generation of consoles aren't coming for a while. I think that buggy "patch-it-later" games won't become too commmon this gen, but they will be very widespread when the next generation of consoles come out. Really, the people who want to make a bit of extra money out of unfinished products are responsible for both forms of unreliability. It's their fault PC games are unfinished, and also their fault that many consoles aren't designed intellgiently (hardware reliability-wise) the first time round. If only they'd just release a finished PC game or a finished console.

I don't think the console market will ever suffer the amount buggy crap the PC market suffers. To be a PC gamer requires a certain level of expertise in dealing with such matters. To be a console gamer requires nothing more than plugging the console into the wall, thus bugged games will end up getting returned to the store and in the bargain basket during the first week of sale.

Having said that, Fable 2 was a heap of bugs with bugs within those bugs. But that is the only example I can think of (besides Oblivion), every other game I have ever bought for a console has worked great without the need for patching.

They won't release finished PC games for the exact reason they won't release finished consoles - fanboy morons will still go out and buy them, then swear blind there isn't a problem.

True. I guess since console gamers are so used to game with very few bugs on launch, they won't be as likely to tolerate a half-finished game as PC gamers who are sadly used to it. This is similar to what happens when someone attempts to charge PC gamers for multiplayer. If someone's been used to having something good for a long time, they aren't going to let it go away quietly.

So the causes of reliability issues thus far determined are:
1. Money-grubbing companies
2. Blind fanboys

Sounds fair.

 

[L McD]

No, you have passed the minimum required specs, not the recommended. If you have passed then you obviously don't have a 8800GTS 328MB, because SRlabs will fail every single one of those games on recommended required specs due to the 328MB of video RAM.

Just to clear this up, I see the misunderstanding. Because my system shares Memory with the graphics card it recognised me as having a 1 GB of VRAM rather than 320MB.

Back on topic, the problem with bugs on the PC, and now on consoles is of course patches. Lazy devs would release the game first, then worry about patching the bugs later. Before a consoles lack of online capability meant the devs had to get it right first time, any mistakes, bugs or glitches were permament. Now with consoles becoming more online focused, that train of thought is creeping into the console devs minds aswell.

And I find it hard to believe that something as simple as installing a game can be difficult, or that it will always fail. I've probably installed at least 50 games on my own computer and have never had any problems understanding what to do, and I have never had an installation fail. And its not like I'm a computer genius or anthing. If an installation did go wrong I probably wouldn't have the slightest clue how to fix it, luckliy i'd bet that a 10 second google search would find a simple, helpful solution.

 

[Ace of Spades]

I don't like playing on the PC. I actually have to know what I'm doing when I install a game because something is not going to work, or some file isn't going to exist, or it's going to hit a fatal error.

I really don't feel this is the case. I installed my first PC game when I was about 6, without help. The only knowledge it really took was the ability to read the buttons that said "next" "back" and "exit". I've never had an error in the install process once in the years since then. Maybe everyone who's posted in this thread is just way more unlucky than me or something.

Well, I am unlucky, I guess. I bought 4 games for PC in the last couple of months: FarCry 2, Fallout 3, Dead Space, and GTA 4. There was a major problem that took more than a week to fix for every single one of them. I had to diagnose, and then fix the problem, which was always annoying. That happens very rarely, if ever for consoles, and even then, it's usually that the disc has too many scratches on it.

 

[Gormers1]

There goes reliability.

Well consoles have more hardware issues, but PCs have much more driver and software issues obviously.

And you cant just say that just because the 360 and pc release the same amount of patches, the software issues are equally high in both consoles. The amount of game releases on the pc that run like shit and have bugs is just rising and rising. Look at GTA 4, Fallout 3, the Stalker series, or just about every game that is ported from the 360 or other consoles. The patches that is released for consoles fixes often very minor problem that noone notices. Mostly to prevent people from exploiting a gamefault and cheating.

 

[luckshot]

haven't had any problems with my rig, built about 1 1/2 yrs ago

 

[Rooster Cogburn]

I'm not on a high horse, you seemed to be very sarcastic by how it was written, so no, i don't think you were polite. I am perfectly calm, it takes more than a mere disagreement on the interwibble to rile me.

Also, see Eggos post, it's not my fault you have a twisted definition of reliable. You don't do into a car dealership after failing to maintain your car properly and demand they repair it for free when it breaks? Or when you drive it in to a tree?

Same rules apply.

It wasn't my intention to be sarcastic, but I can see why it sounded that way. I meant quite literally that those with knowledge don't have issues, which is something I wouldn't know about, but concede. On the other hand, those without knowledge do have issues. And I don't think Eggo's post contradicted my point in any way. He just provided a better word for what I trying to express (and thanks).

I don't think I have a twisted definition of reliable: I think your definition has become increasingly narrow to suit your position. To follow your analogy, I certainly wouldn't complain to the dealer after my car failed because I didn't maintain it or I crashed into a tree. Instead, I would upgrade to the more reliable car- which operates even when poorly maintained or after crashed into a tree.

Fault tolerance (nods at Eggo) is a factor which is always considered in comparing reliability. This is true when dealing with cars, guns, appliances, and everything I can think of. In any case, our discussion seems to have devolved into debate over definitions, but I think mine is the more appropriate one.

 

[Baneat]

A console has NEVER failed me. PC's fail often in comparison.

 

[742]

PCs involve more complex and varied tasks for both the user and the machine. more chances to fuck up. especially for the users. i think we can all agree that consoles are the only choice if your a complete fucking moron. if it breaks the only user troubleshooting is "blow on the cartridge slot" anything that isnt fixed by that... its very simple, you send it in for repairs, or you dont get it fixed. you never have a half assed mcguiver-console held together with tomato paste and ramen noodles(damn that sounds like a tasty computer-thats another win for us PC supremicists, desktops taste better than consoles with the exception of the NES and the GBA), using an old come as a heat spreader because you didnt have the parts to fix it properly, essentially, consoles either work, or they dont, PCs have varying degrees of function. but if your smart, youve got choices.

 

[Zer_]

But if you play the game and realize the scope of what's going on in terms of processing, it's completely understandable to observe 3 out of 4 cores being maxed and so much VRAM being used.

It really is a game which is ahead of its time...It's this generation's Crysis.

What the hell is Crysis then?

Last generation's Crysis

Yeah but Crysis looks way better then GTA4. They don't even compare graphically. Rockstar is Notorious for bad PC Ports. San Andreas ran like ass on 3ghz P4s back in the day, and that's a PS2 game.

Rockstar failed to produce a solid port, there's nothing else to be said.

 

[Iron Mal]

Consoles are more reliable than PC's.

My 360 at present has only had the red ring of death once, which was fixed for free and rather quickly (I didn't even have to do anything other than unplug it and find a box to put it in).
My main gaming PC on the other hand does not actually work and I have no idea how to fix it (and I'm not going to pay to have it repaired/upgraded/reduced to a cube in exchange for cash).
The PC I am using to write on this forum can only run Unreal Tournament (the original), Starcraft and AVP, unless anyone on here is going is up the ante on my PC for free then don't reply by saying that that's my own fault for being a console playing simpleton.