Belief - When does it stop being your parents' and become your own?

[DuctTapeJedi]

Dude, I've just got to say, as someone who works at a Christian summer camp:
These people are crazy.

For those of you who have never seen one in real life, please don't this is common. At the camp I work at, we follow guidelines set for a large number of Bible camps across the country. It's standard operating procedure to let the kids question all they want, have group discussions where the kids work out these questions for themselves, and generally not brainwash people.

Just to reiterate: This camp is an outlier on the Bell Curve. We are not like that, as a majority.

 

[Beliyal]

I think it depends on the child. Some people become "aware" earlier, while some are pretty late. For example, my opinions became my own when I was around 10-11 years old. I don't remember being particularly interested in having opinions about difficult topics prior to that. But I did have them around that time. But still, most of my opinions were reflections of my upbringing, until some time near the end of high school. Another example; I was a complete atheist all the way until very recently, because my parents were atheists and taught me to be one too. They weren't really pushing it or anything, but it was clear from their opinions about religion in general. I of course followed that, but throughout high school, I started discovering the other side of the medal and decided not to declare myself as an atheist anymore. I don't declare myself as anything really and while I'm not really religious per se, atheism is not my thing either. This is a difficult question because it involves a lot of factors and in the end, you must judge everyone personally, not as a part of a larger group. As some general indicators, I would say that the amount of education a person got plays a major part, along with the amount of interest the person holds for such topics. Some people may follow a religious path set by their parents, not because they are "brainwashed", but because they simply don't care and just want to go with the flow.

 

[Blaster395]

Dude, I've just got to say, as someone who works at a Christian summer camp:
These people are crazy.

For those of you who have never seen one in real life, please don't this is common. At the camp I work at, we follow guidelines set for a large number of Bible camps across the country. It's standard operating procedure to let the kids question all they want, have group discussions where the kids work out these questions for themselves, and generally not brainwash people.

Just to reiterate: This camp is an outlier on the Bell Curve. We are not like that, as a majority.

But ultimately isn't even a very light system, even if it is not full indoctrination, still going to cause people to lean to something they otherwise would not?

The best solution is to not mix any kind of religion in with the summer camp.

 

[Gamblerjoe]

Interesting philosophical/semantical question. while the answer doesnt really mean much, its very thought provoking. Unfortunately, the cycle almost always continues. its the same way with child abuse, and other forms of violence.

the way i see it, those beliefs never really become their own. if someone is not allowed to think for themselves throughout their entire adolescence, odds are, they will be a thrall for the rest of their lives. the sheer number of lifeless husks that inhabits our planet is one of the many reasons i have such disdain for humanity.

funny story that last comment reminded me of...

I was a cook at a restaurant. There was a waitress that was just so so dumb. One of those people who, when you talk to them they just have that vacant stare; like cattle gazing off into the horizon. Someone at one of her tables ordered mozzarella sticks, and one of them lost all of its cheese in the fryer. No one noticed, so it got served. When she came back to get a replacement she looked at me and said "this one's empty inside." The other cook and I both looked at each other and started laughing our asses off.

 

[teqrevisited]

Whenever they decide for themselves.

I did about halfway through primary school. I remember being called out to go and speak to the headmaster about not singing the hymns during assemblies. He asked me why and I told him "I don't believe in God." and that was that.

 

[dkyros]

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

I believe that anyone who follows the bible literally and orthodoxy can be very dangerous. The aforementioned quote from the bible was used to justify slavery for some time. There are also many other passages that are memorized that allow fiercely religious groups to carry out gruesome acts without remorse.

BTW the Documentary is on Netflix for those interested.

OT: Its hard to say. I would say that the whole system is pitiful and breeds stagnation. How can new ideas possibly emerge in such a system. It reminds me of the Golden Age of Islam, when science was starting to uncover the 'secrets' of the world. Being able to predict events was seen as 'taking' power away from Alah. This caused the abandonment of much of the scientific research and bread stagnation throughout much of the Islamic community.

 

[Jamboxdotcom]

But ultimately isn't even a very light system, even if it is not full indoctrination, still going to cause people to lean to something they otherwise would not?

unfortunately, that same reasoning is often used by people trying to enact censorship. "Children are too young to think for themselves" is a bad viewpoint, no matter how well intentioned.

 

[dkyros]

But ultimately isn't even a very light system, even if it is not full indoctrination, still going to cause people to lean to something they otherwise would not?

unfortunately, that same reasoning is often used by people trying to enact censorship. "Children are too young to think for themselves" is a bad viewpoint, no matter how well intentioned.

Children are impressionable, like little sponges. I was raised catholic and even though I am no longer practicing I will say that the damage is done. I have made a choice, but I have already been ingrained with a set of morals even if I only loosely follow them now. And this isn't just passively being fed to them where they have a choice, this is being fed to them by parents, friends, religious figure heads, the cartoons they watch, books they read. So, I don't see how the argument for censorship applies to this case.

 

[Togs]

[sub]Wrong forum, it may be pedantic but the things there for a reason...[/sub]

Someones already said it- not until you've considered the alternatives does whatever system of belief you have become yours instead of something you've been brought upto to believe in.

Perhaps on the of the biggest problems I have with religion is it seems to be demonize this concept, and for that matter it seems to demonize the very concept of indepedant thought.

 

[dagens24]

[sub]Wrong forum, it may be pedantic but the things there for a reason...[/sub]

Someones already said it- not until you've considered the alternatives does whatever system of belief you have become yours instead of something you've been brought upto to believe in.

Perhaps on the of the biggest problems I have with religion is it seems to be demonize this concept, and for that matter it seems to demonize the very concept of indepedant thought.

Sorry, but how is this the wrong forum?

 

[C95J]

Children that young are VERY easy to convince, and with that kind of pressure all around them, no wonder people think they are being brainwashed.

I was lucky, and my parents left me to decide for myself, and I am very thankful for that. I made all my own choices, so they are truly MY beliefs, not just ideas that other people stuck into my head when I was younger.

 

[Chrono212]

When the child starts to construct their own arguments in defence of that belief system.

 

[KiKiweaky]

Ohh nice topic I must say.

I dunno, in one way you could go on feeling sympathy for them for ever. Remember watching a thing on American Nazi's or something like that (there are a few documentaries out there) and some old pilloc coverred in tatoo's was going on about his 'organisation'. He can, if he wants to 'send out a lone wolf to take out somebody doing something we don't agree with' Which I think is bollox but anyway during the chat it switched to him playing with his kids in a park. I remember just groaning internally, those kids dont stand a chance, they are never going to get to make their minds up.

Their minds have been made for them hate all racial minorities without exception. People who have parents with beliefs as strong as those, I seriously doubt they are ever going to change. Home is where you learn most things some of us get good teachers some get bad teachers. If your parents are white supremists you are more than likely going to grow up one aswell.

 

[funguy2121]

snip

OP, I think you may have it a little backwards. The child generally accepts as "gospel" everything that they hear from their parents, be it "Jesus is lord" or "don't trust the darkies." Their beliefs ARE their parents' beliefs until/unless they reach a point in adulthood where they look inward and say, "Y'know what? That's really all bullshit."

I said until/unless because it's only a minority who looks at their selves with skepticism and asks why they believe what they believe. Most people lack the stones to do this. Many pretend to do it while rebelling, but this is just to establish a sense of identity, of self, and really does nothing to establish a true identity/self apart from the beliefs forced upon them by those that raised them.

I love the Ghandi quote on that youtube page: "I like your Christ, he is good, but I do not like your Christians. They are nothing like your Christ."

 

[Nannernade]

Wow I suppose I should be glad my ma isn't a crazy christian like these parents (No offense intended), when she sent me to christian school it was ironic that it was the thing that made me an atheist. But I do believe children shouldn't be subjegated to this, if they want to believe in god and jesus let them come about it at their own pace don't force them into it.

 

[Jamboxdotcom]

[sub]Wrong forum, it may be pedantic but the things there for a reason...[/sub]

Someones already said it- not until you've considered the alternatives does whatever system of belief you have become yours instead of something you've been brought upto to believe in.

Perhaps on the of the biggest problems I have with religion is it seems to be demonize this concept, and for that matter it seems to demonize the very concept of indepedant thought.

Sorry, but how is this the wrong forum?

should be in the Religion and Politics forum, not Off-topic. i didn't even notice that at first, or i would have mentioned it

 

[Katana314]

Funny enough, the OP hit on a deeper issue; you should really NEVER be "angry" at anyone for their beliefs, because they always come from a reason within their life. People who hate cops do so because they feel they have been a victim of injustice. Adolf Hitler probably didn't know very many nice Jewish people during his life.

I'd feel a need to do something to react to people being "excessively" Christian, but it wouldn't be fueled by any hatred. I'd just like to show them how misguided they are, possibly by having them talk to some nicer Christians.