Bethesda combat

[Ando85]

I really enjoyed Elders Scrolls IV and simply cannot wait for Skyrim. But, the problem I've always had with Bethesda titles is I really don't like the combat all that much which includes Fallout 3. I love exploring the vast worlds and think the games are incredible despite it. How do you feel about the combat in these games?

 

[LordRoyal]

I never particularly enjoyed Oblivion's combat, it got annoyingly repetitive quite quickly.

Fallout 3 had guns but until I downloaded an ironsights mod and several hundred realism mods then the game finally felt more like STALKER, which was a very good thing.

So Bethesda games are very flawed in this regard.

 

[Katana314]

I think it's been mostly about the RPG system, not the nitty-gritty. It's all decided by how good your leveled-up skills are, and the quality of your weapon. I really think they could do something to make slashing a bit more interesting, even if they want to keep the aforementioned RPG-numbers stuff.

 

[bob1052]

My enjoyment of Oblivion was sullied by the melee combat (obviously not too much considering I'm in the process of reinstalling it and mods in preperation for Skyrim). It wasn't that bad in Fallout 3 because it was mostly gun based (not particularly amazing gunplay but far, far better than the melee). It really felt like you were swinging with no weight back and forth across the screen and hitting enemies or missing and swinging through the air felt the exact same.

From what we have seen in Skyrim, it would seem that the newest engine doesn't have such painfully bad melee.

 

[LordRoyal]

I think it's been mostly about the RPG system, not the nitty-gritty. It's all decided by how good your leveled-up skills are, and the quality of your weapon. I really think they could do something to make slashing a bit more interesting, even if they want to keep the aforementioned RPG-numbers stuff.

There are better games that perform the "stat based first person shooter" combat significantly better then Fallout. There are also better games that pull off the "Stat based first person combat" significantly better.

For the former, I can think of a game like Deus Ex or Vampire the masquerade bloodlines, for the latter. Ultima Underworld or Arx Fatalis

 

[Voodoomancer]

I like extreme ranges in fallout, picking them off in single shots from cover up on a cliff is awesome.

This has nothing to do with the fact that my game lags when other characters are near me :/

 

[Neuromaster]

I'm not a fan of Bethesda's implementation of melee combat so far. An improvement would be welcome.

 

[N3vans]

I really enjoyed oblivion, but I felt the combat was a bit 'clunky' and not visceral enough. I mean if you were facing a fairly tough enemy you could be hacking at them for ages and they'd have no visible wounds on them or anything like that. I mean you are carrying a damn sword at the end of the day, it should make a mess! (Although not really over the top like in that new Space Marine game where they've gone mental with the blood effect, something more like Game of Thrones maybe).

They seem to have rectified this in Skyrim though, there was one bit of gameplay where it looked like you'll be able to do cool finishing moves.

 

[chromewarriorXIII]

I didn't mind the combat in Oblivion until I got the Deadly Reflex mod, which makes everything so much better. You feel like your swinging your sword, you interact more with your enemies. Overall, it just improves every aspect of it.

Fallout 3 I never really had a problem with. Iron sights were a welcome addition to New Vegas but it didn't bother me that 3 didn't have them.

 

[Etteparg]

I still think Oblivion was one of the best rpgs in a long time, but the repative combat brought it down a little.

 

[infohippie]

Ranged combat seems fine to me in Bethesda games. In Fallout 3, the level of inaccuracy made sense, since your shot placement was determined partly by your aim and partly by your character's skill and the weapon's condition. It was a good way to mix player skill and the RPG elements. I think a few members of the serious FPS crowd were probably disappointed that it didn't rely solely on the player's aim, but I don't think they really get RPGs anyway.
Using a bow in Oblivion was great - it felt like the bow was flinging arrows with quite some force, and the ragdoll physics meant a kill with the bow felt solid, like it had a serious impact. And the arrows remaining stuck in your target until you retrieved the few that didn't break was a very nice touch.
Melee, however, is generally pretty sucky. Bethesda just don't seem to have figured out a way for melee to feel right - it feels as if you're just waving a sword-shaped piece of cardboard in the air. Even when you hit your target it feels like you're just waving it around in the air. After watching the Skyrim gameplay video it looks like Bethesda still haven't worked out that one. It's one of the main reasons I never play a melee class in Bethesda games. Maybe they should've borrowed from The Witcher 2. Swordplay in that, while hard, felt visceral and was a big improvement on most melee combat I've seen in games over the years.

 

[ultrachicken]

Bethesda's previous games have been rather subpar on the combat front unless you were using stealth. The sneaky approach, to me, is very satisfying, except in Oblivion, where nothing dies in one hit.

 

[DustyDrB]

Yeah...Bethesda isn't so good at combat. Or story.

But they can build an impressive world.

 

[TheYellowCellPhone]

I like gun play in Fallout 3, in the fact your weapon's accuracy is based on multiple factors -- the weapon's condition, whether or not you're aiming, your movement speed, and your skill with the weapon.

But melee was always horrible in the fact that A. it's not as good as using ranged combat and B. it was way too boring and repetitive. Just spam the attack button while moving backwards, and hope some of your blind swings your enemy.

 

[Ordinaryundone]

Its....serviceable. I personally found combat in Morrowind and Oblivion to be rather boring. Fallout's is better, but the shooting feels kinda sloppy and VATS feels overpowered. But it gets the job done, and combat isn't really the focus of the game and can be, mostly, downplayed.

 

[Tibs]

From what I have seen the combat in Skyrim looks better than in the other games so I do not feel it will be THAT bad.

 

[octafish]

I think it's been mostly about the RPG system, not the nitty-gritty. It's all decided by how good your leveled-up skills are, and the quality of your weapon. I really think they could do something to make slashing a bit more interesting, even if they want to keep the aforementioned RPG-numbers stuff.

There are better games that perform the "stat based first person shooter" combat significantly better then Fallout. There are also better games that pull off the "Stat based first person combat" significantly better.

For the former, I can think of a game like Deus Ex or Vampire the masquerade bloodlines, for the latter. Ultima Underworld or Arx Fatalis

It always surprises me that anyone played Bloodlines as a shooter and in first person. I played through every clan and never used guns. I also never used the first person.

I played maybe an hour of Oblivion before giving up in disgust after getting close to things (ugly) accidently stealing a horse when trying to ask for directions (clunky) and most of all the horrible combat. I had no problems with Fallout 3, it felt like System Shock with less weapon degredation, and VATS was a welcome addition for someone who hates having to do anything that means my limitations affect my character in an RPG.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Haha, Bethesada combat was one of the reasons I, paradoxically, liked Morrowind more than Oblivion. Why? Because even if Morrowind had terrible melee combat, the spell system was abusable enough that a mage could basically insta-kill or bypass anything in the game by like level 4. So I could skip the combat and just explore

(So, in other words, fingers crossed that Skyrim has good magic/ranged/melee combat or, failing that, an OP magic system.)

 

[LordRoyal]

I think it's been mostly about the RPG system, not the nitty-gritty. It's all decided by how good your leveled-up skills are, and the quality of your weapon. I really think they could do something to make slashing a bit more interesting, even if they want to keep the aforementioned RPG-numbers stuff.

There are better games that perform the "stat based first person shooter" combat significantly better then Fallout. There are also better games that pull off the "Stat based first person combat" significantly better.

For the former, I can think of a game like Deus Ex or Vampire the masquerade bloodlines, for the latter. Ultima Underworld or Arx Fatalis

It always surprises me that anyone played Bloodlines as a shooter and in first person. I played through every clan and never used guns. I also never used the first person.

I will agree that the first person combat was clunky, but I enjoyed the gunplay in Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines even though it was inferior to Melee combat.

Regardless I would prefer Vampire the Masquerade Bloodlines's gunplay to Fallout 3 vanilla's. Fallout 3's I kept wondering why Raiders could take 10 headshots to the face and why my guns reacted like they were airsoft.