I couldn't play Bioshock, the controls were abysmal. I have a free copy of Bioshock 2 I got from PS+ and I can't play it because it's just not fun.
Infinite is on sale for $14 on PSN.
This is a digital copy I can't return if I don't like.
Is it worth the risk? Don't just say yes because you liked it and you like the first 2. Does it stand on its own, is the gameplay solid? I hear the story is exceptional but so was the story from the first one and I couldn't get over the gameplay.
I really loved the world in the first couple of Bioshocks but I also found the gameplay very lacking and horrendously paced and fractured. Was a real grind to finish the first and didn't complete 2.
Good news, Bioshock Infinite features fantastic gameplay compared to it's two previous outings, so I'd say go right ahead and get it as it sounds like you were/are in the same boat as me.
Yeah the gameplay is pretty polarizing, it's best if you just play it and decide for yourself. I personally found it to be a downgrade from the previous games, I'm not just talking about the shooting either, but you have people here who loved it. For $14 I'd say it's worth the 'risk.'
I would say maybe buy a physical copy, I would expect to be able to find Infinite for $15-20 on Cyber Monday. If you don't like it, you can sell it and only lose a few bucks (if any). Infinite is my favorite game of the year by far. The game is so much fun when you decide not to play it like a shooter and play it more like a Borderlands when you stack a bunch of bonuses together and combine vigors to do some really nasty damage. I had the framerate really struggling at points due to all the shit I would have going off at once.
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Evonisia said:
Infinite is a lot easier than BioShock 1 and 2, which adds to the tedium.
How is Infinite easier when the wrench from the 1st game is probably the most powerful weapon in the whole series?
RJ 17 said:
Mr.K. said:
Well I don't know what it's like on consoles but Infinite on PC plays almost 1 for 1 like any modern military shooter, now if that is your kind of game then go for it.
You are not supposed to be using guns like the pistol, machine gun, carbine, etc. You are supposed to be using power weapons the whole game. Infinite plays so different than your standard modern military shooter, it's all about using powers and power weapons. I used the sniper rifle and shotgun probably 90% of my playthrough on 1999 mode while getting the Scavenger trophy.
The story makes perfect sense if you pay attention to every little thing about the ending. The only questionable stuff is what happens during that whole sequence when you're trying to get guns for the Vox Populi. Even then, there's an explanation that makes that work as well.
2. a unifying or dominant idea, motif, etc., as in a work of art.
Pretty sure Racism in BS: Infinite would fall under Definition 2 of being a "theme". You calling it an "environmental flourish" is pretty cute, however. :3
Key word here being "unifying". A theme is the central concept of a narrative. You can have multiple themes, but they're all at the heart of the story. If it is your contention that Bioshock Infinite was, at its heart, a meditation on racism, I'd have to ask you what game you were playing and/or are you out of your mind. It's no more centrally concerned with racism than, say, Dragon Age Origins was. At best you could argue it's a minor/secondary theme. Yet every time someone wants to ***** about the narrative in Infinite I hear this LOL RACISM business, as though it were a game primarily concerned with exploring racism.
What did you think the theme in the first game was? Submersibles? Drug use?
RJ 17 said:
Yeah, forgive me, but when I play a shooter I do prefer that my target dies after being shot oh, say, at least 5 times in the frickin' face.
Odd. I had absolutely no trouble single-shotting regular mooks with head shots. What difficulty were you playing on? What gun did you use?
I could go on all day about issues with the minute to minute game play in Infinite. I don't think "bullet sponging" would even be in the top 100 points though.
I agree with you on many things, but I am curious, what do you think Bioshock Infinite is about? Because, I for one, really don't know. It's never happened to me before. I've always been able to identify key themes on narratives, but for some reason, Bioshock Infinite escapes my grasp.
You look like you aren't talking out of your ass, and seem actually quite clever, so I ask you, what is the damned game about? How the decision of one can influence many? That you shouldn't dwell on the past? That an individual is only as good as the experiences he had in life?
Because even with the wrench you're still going to be two/three shotted by pretty much every enemy in the game, most of whom don't die in one hit and are present in groups. BioShock was an easy game, but it was still unforgiving.
Compared to Infinite where the tactic is hide behind cover MMS style and shoot at the sponges until they die. You can also soak up damage like a champ and as Elizabeth gives you perma-ammo, health and money buffs you will never ever be a position of vulnerability.
I liked Bioshock 1 and Infinite but never bothered to play Bioshock 2. For me I found Bioshock 1 the better game it just had much better atmosphere and art direction for me and seemed to gel better overall. Infinite was fine but I found myself getting bored in parts and there seemed to be much more emphasis put on combat which wasnt good as just like in the first Bioshock gameplay isnt its strong point.
If you hated Bioshock 1 and 2 dont get Infinite you wont enjoy it if you liked them do it basically that simple apart from the story they are pretty much identical in how they play and handle.
I found the first game to be much more interesting in theory than in practice. I liked the world design and it had some interesting and heady ideas but it was just boring to play. I love Infinite though and found the gameplay to be a massive improvement over the enemy corridors of the original Bioshock. I think the open environments and the introduction of skylines make the gunplay a lot more interesting and exciting. I know I'm a minority here, but I found Infinite to be a better game in virtually every way (and that includes factors like atmosphere and story).
Infinite is just BioShock again but shit, gameplay wise. Enemies all just dudes who absorb damage without feeling any pain, and their tactics just involve surrounding you and blasting away. Infinite is a lot easier than BioShock 1 and 2, which adds to the tedium.
It's story isn't much to think about unless you have a thing for characters who angst more than they do entertain or try to engage the player.
Basically, BioShock Infinite is a Modern Military Shooter with fuck loads of bloom, a bit of colour and a story which you may or may not care about.
Pretty much this. It's a boring shooting gallery with enemies that just soak up damage. The story tries to be deep and meaningful but just falls flat to me.
Because even with the wrench you're still going to be two/three shotted by pretty much every enemy in the game, most of whom don't die in one hit and are present in groups. BioShock was an easy game, but it was still unforgiving.
Compared to Infinite where the tactic is hide behind cover MMS style and shoot at the sponges until they die. You can also soak up damage like a champ and as Elizabeth gives you perma-ammo, health and money buffs you will never ever be a position of vulnerability.
Why can't you hide in cover MMS style in Bioshock as well? I don't even know why anyone even compares Bioshock to MMSs, they are nothing alike. Plus, you can hide literally anywhere in Bioshock due to the Natural Camouflage tonic. The only kinda hard sections of Bioshock were the initial levels when you have to face a Big Daddy with just about nothing. Big Daddies become a joke after killing only a couple. The freezing plasmid in Bioshock makes all splicers so easy to kill. At the end, I was just running around with the wrench for fun, the game was that easy.
Elizabeth will only give you a medkit and more ammo once per fight. You'll get 2-3 shotted in Infinite as well.
Both games are about stacking a bunch of stuff together to make you really powerful. The 1st Bioshock was easier to stack stuff due to having all those tonic slots whereas Infinite only has 4 gear slots.
ShinyCharizard said:
It's a boring shooting gallery with enemies that just soak up damage.
God the more I see about Infinite the less I like it. I replayed Bioshock 1 somewhat recently, full of blind nostalgia and ye GODS are the controls a pile of wank. It takes a special kind of incompetance to make me feel nothing put utter mundane boredom when blowing a splicer across the room with a shotgun. The consistent interesting themes were honestly the only things keeping me going, something that Infinite eventually drops once it gets bored.
I liked 2 the most and Infinite was alright to start with then dies horribly once they start introducing Hypertime. Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
[sub][sub]A fucking ghost? Really?[/sub][/sub]
To give a half spoiler, it is established that if one of your hundreds of Hypertime selves dies while the others are alive, they all go into some kind of painful mental trance state because they're missing part of their collective. So the several deaths Booker has had over the course of the game have been swept under the rug quietly, among several other obvious contradictions.
To answer the question, if you didn't like other Bioshock games do not bother with Infinite. It's like the other Bioshocks but worse.
Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
If you pay attention to every little detail at the end, it all makes sense and it is 100% coherent. Elizabeth asking Booker "are you sure?" before she opens the door at the end is one of the many little details that makes the plot coherent. Many people don't get why she did that and then claim there's a massive plothole there. And, the 1st Bioshock is even less coherent than Infinite.
I liked 2 the most and Infinite was alright to start with then dies horribly once they start introducing Hypertime. Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
Because even with the wrench you're still going to be two/three shotted by pretty much every enemy in the game, most of whom don't die in one hit and are present in groups. BioShock was an easy game, but it was still unforgiving.
Compared to Infinite where the tactic is hide behind cover MMS style and shoot at the sponges until they die. You can also soak up damage like a champ and as Elizabeth gives you perma-ammo, health and money buffs you will never ever be a position of vulnerability.
Why can't you hide in cover MMS style in Bioshock as well? I don't even know why anyone even compares Bioshock to MMSs, they are nothing alike. Plus, you can hide literally anywhere in Bioshock due to the Natural Camouflage tonic. The only kinda hard sections of Bioshock were the initial levels when you have to face a Big Daddy with just about nothing. Big Daddies become a joke after killing only a couple. The freezing plasmid in Bioshock makes all splicers so easy to kill. At the end, I was just running around with the wrench for fun, the game was that easy.
Elizabeth will only give you a medkit and more ammo once per fight. You'll get 2-3 shotted in Infinite as well.
Both games are about stacking a bunch of stuff together to make you really powerful. The 1st Bioshock was easier to stack stuff due to having all those tonic slots whereas Infinite only has 4 gear slots.
ShinyCharizard said:
It's a boring shooting gallery with enemies that just soak up damage.
You look like you aren't talking out of your ass, and seem actually quite clever, so I ask you, what is the damned game about? How the decision of one can influence many? That you shouldn't dwell on the past? That an individual is only as good as the experiences he had in life?
The degree to which any one person is "talking out of their ass" tends to depend on how much one agrees with them.
Infinite is DeWitt's story. It's about a cycle of violence and despair born of one man's moral shortcomings, and the opportunity he is given...via his daughter...to break it. Primarily it a story of redemption, but you could also view it as a story of how violence/hatred/xenophobia perpetuates itself (seen most fundamentally through Comstock/Elizabeth, but also through the slow and inexorable transformation of the Vox Populi from a plucky resistance to an Orwellian 2nd oppressor). There are a lot of echoes of Planescape Torment's story in Infinite, to the point where I suspect the latter was hugely influenced by the former.
It's no more "about racism" or "about quantum physics" than The Last of Us is a story about urban decay or To The Moon is a story about advanced medical science.
Bioshock: Infinite is aesthetically a marvel. It has a fantastic sense of place and some interesting, well-drawn characters. I'm personally of the opinion that the story is a messy jumble of applied phlebotinum and patched threads, but others think it's wonderful; I'll admit there's something intriguing there, but I think it's more a result of those interesting characters than the messy storyline.
But if you disliked the interface of Bioshock and Bioshock 2, well... B:I is arguably the weaker for the two-weapon limit and the breadth of powers without compelling reasons to make use of more than a couple. And while the sky-hook is sort of neat as a visual flourish and a work of imagination, in some ways it's used enough to be distracting and not enough to be integral.
Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
If you pay attention to every little detail at the end, it all makes sense and it is 100% coherent. Elizabeth asking Booker "are you sure?" before she opens the door at the end is one of the many little details that makes the plot coherent. Many people don't get why she did that and then claim there's a massive plothole there. And, the 1st Bioshock is even less coherent than Infinite.
My problem isn't specifically with the ending, although that is a factor. Everything in the game is just sort of all over the place. They open up so many themes then kick the vast majority out the window to go for fucking Hypertime, redemption and baptism. In addition to my problem with self deaths I already mentioned:
The themes they start with aren't explored anywhere near thoroughly enough, it ends up being cheap window dressing with no solid detail or reason. Why are the Plasmi-sorry, Vigours even a thing? Answer: because they were in Bioshock 1 and 2 so we had to shoehorn them in somewhere. Barely anyone uses them aside from you, especially compared to Bioshock where everyone was a drugged up manic out for blood. I would assume that a very religious population would be extremely opposed to the idea of messing with God's creations, nevermind giving yourself lightning powers. Nope they're fine with it.
Elizabeth is surprisingly ok with Booker doing some REALLY horrible things to something that used to be someone's face, she only objects to it once.
Booker also acts like an idiot for the first bits of gameplay, he sees that the big AD on his hand is the sign of Public Enemy #1. Better not cover it up with something huh? Don't pick #77 in the raffle? Don't mind if I do!
You know screaming at your main character to use common sense is not really a great way to build player agency.
How come Songbird wasn't a boss fight? That must have been in the design documents at some point in development.
Also Hypertime as a concept makes the ending far less impactful. You know how it's about Booker erasing Comstock (and by extension Columbia itself) and in doing so erases himself and Elisabeth from existence and he does this by letting Lizzy drown him? The rule of Hypertime dictates that in some dimensions he will reject Lizzy from doing so leaving some versions of Comstock and Booker alive. Thereby the drowning scene changes little in the grand scheme of things, rather than being the end of all Columbias ever as the game would like to tell you.
It's defeated itself really, the whole infinite thing. Where there's a yes there is always a no to the same question elsewhere.
Sorry for the wall of text, I really could go on. I don't often dislike something so much but when I do, this happens XD
[sub][sub]A fucking GHOST![/sub][/sub]
Nouw said:
The Wykydtron said:
I liked 2 the most and Infinite was alright to start with then dies horribly once they start introducing Hypertime. Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
Any game that lets me shout Gurren Lagann lines 24/7 is GOTY by default. We upgrade drill. We mash drill tonics. We unlock the charge.
"PIERCE THE HEAVENS WITH YOUR DRILL DELTA!"
I really liked the ending too. The stuff with Lamb was interesting, I like villains who have nothing better to do than taunt you over the radio every five minutes and walking around on the ocean floor was a fun little gimmick.
Like the pistol, carbine, machine gun, and Vox Populi equivalents.
The Wykydtron said:
Phoenixmgs said:
The Wykydtron said:
Look, I don't like alternate dimension and time travel stuff in general so shoving the two together is already taking points off your score but for the love of god could you at least make it coherent and y'know, good? They try to make it look all deep and meaningful but if you take time to piece it all together it has a load of plotholes and is just plain nonsense sometimes.
If you pay attention to every little detail at the end, it all makes sense and it is 100% coherent. Elizabeth asking Booker "are you sure?" before she opens the door at the end is one of the many little details that makes the plot coherent. Many people don't get why she did that and then claim there's a massive plothole there. And, the 1st Bioshock is even less coherent than Infinite.
My problem isn't specifically with the ending, although that is a factor. Everything in the game is just sort of all over the place. They open up so many themes then kick the vast majority out the window to go for fucking Hypertime, redemption and baptism. In addition to my problem with self deaths I already mentioned:
The themes they start with aren't explored anywhere near thoroughly enough, it ends up being cheap window dressing with no solid detail or reason. Why are the Plasmi-sorry, Vigours even a thing? Answer: because they were in Bioshock 1 and 2 so we had to shoehorn them in somewhere. Barely anyone uses them aside from you, especially compared to Bioshock where everyone was a drugged up manic out for blood. I would assume that a very religious population would be extremely opposed to the idea of messing with God's creations, nevermind giving yourself lightning powers. Nope they're fine with it.
Elizabeth is surprisingly ok with Booker doing some REALLY horrible things to something that used to be someone's face, she only objects to it once.
Booker also acts like an idiot for the first bits of gameplay, he sees that the big AD on his hand is the sign of Public Enemy #1. Better not cover it up with something huh? Don't pick #77 in the raffle? Don't mind if I do!
You know screaming at your main character to use common sense is not really a great way to build player agency.
How come Songbird wasn't a boss fight? That must have been in the design documents at some point in development.
Also Hypertime as a concept makes the ending far less impactful. You know how it's about Booker erasing Comstock (and by extension Columbia itself) and in doing so erases himself and Elisabeth from existence and he does this by letting Lizzy drown him? The rule of Hypertime dictates that in some dimensions he will reject Lizzy from doing so leaving some versions of Comstock and Booker alive. Thereby the drowning scene changes little in the grand scheme of things, rather than being the end of all Columbias ever as the game would like to tell you.
It's defeated itself really, the whole infinite thing. Where there's a yes there is always a no to the same question elsewhere.
A game/movie/book/etc. based in that time will need to at least comment on stuff like racism. It's just apart of Columbia's world, nothing else. Not mentioning it would be much more jarring. Infinite never was trying to do anything with racism, it was just there.
It's pretty easy to bring in plasmids from Bioshock with the multiverses in play. It's no different than "Fortunate Son" being in the game unless you think stuff like that was shoehorned in as well. Barely anyone was using vigors because they are new to the world. And, it very well could be that everyone isn't using vigors because they are indeed not fine with them. They are giving away vigors for free in the beginning of the game, another sign that they were new or not accepted or both. Lastly, one of the main points of Infinite was to link all the Bioshock worlds together.
The #77 thing was a constant, it has to happen.
Why would Songbird have to be a boss fight? I wasn't disappointed at all that Songbird wasn't a boss fight because it would probably be a shitty boss fight anyways. Look at the end boss fight in the 1st Bioshock.
There's literally no Comstocks or Columbias left at the end of the game. That's why Elizabeth asks Booker "are you sure?" BEFORE he opens the last door so that decision is made in Limbo and not in an actual universe so there is no new universe that forms from the opposite decision being made. Like I said, if you pay attention, everything makes sense. Also, your Elizabeth lived as she didn't go with you through the last door, even Booker notices it's not the same person. She stayed in Limbo and did not die.
I couldn't play Bioshock, the controls were abysmal. I have a free copy of Bioshock 2 I got from PS+ and I can't play it because it's just not fun.
Infinite is on sale for $14 on PSN.
This is a digital copy I can't return if I don't like.
Is it worth the risk? Don't just say yes because you liked it and you like the first 2. Does it stand on its own, is the gameplay solid? I hear the story is exceptional but so was the story from the first one and I couldn't get over the gameplay.
If you didn't like the first 2, you're probably not going to like Infinite. There's some differences, but the overall pacing and gameplay mechanics are the same.
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