Born gay, Chose to be gay, Can't it be both?

[Eri]

I see a lot of people on both sides arguing if people were born gay or chose to be gay themselves. What I don't see is anyone saying both camps are just as valid as the other. Rarely, other animals beside human have exhibited gay behavior before, clearly showing it can be a rare natural occurrence. But we humans also have free will, meaning you can, indeed, choose to be gay. I'm sure both types of gays exist, they're equally valid. So why does it need to be one or the other?

 

[nunqual]

Not really. You can't just choose to like penises (or vaginas if you're a gal). At least, you can't choose it and be happy. You'd be a fake gay, in my opinion. Also, why would you choose that life for yourself? Being rediculed and shunned for your way of life.

 

[TeeBs]

Thats like saying I can one day wake up and be a woman or I can wake up one day and be black or I can wake up one day being tall or I can wake up one day and be someone else, and that would also be like saying someone who is gay can wake up and be straight. It just doesn't work that way, because I know a lot of gay guys who would just love to be straight.

 

[SharPhoe]

But we humans also have free will, meaning you can, indeed, choose to be gay.

I'm fully aware that such a thing is possible (mostly in the case of girls who "decide" to be bisexual/lesbians for the attention they know it'll garner), but in a nutshell, just because you want to believe with all of your being that you've made the decision to just change your sexuality and be that way forever doesn't make it true. In essence, it just means that you're voluntarily choosing to live a lie. It's no different than if a gay person "decides" to go straight, either of their own volition or thanks to one of those... camps.

 

[D Moness]

Rarely, other animals beside human have exhibited gay behavior before, clearly showing it can be a rare natural occurrence.

I have sene this reply before and many many people posted lots of links that proves gay animals is more normal then people think.

 

[EonEire]

Because if its taken as a choice in any way then legislation for it is trivialised and is not seen as a needed implementation due to its basic non-existence as a part of a person.

Why make new marriage laws? You can just chose to be straight and get married. I am gay and I know I do not chose to be this way. I can't just find women attractive sexually.

 

[Mookie_Magnus]

Bullshit. You don't choose what sex you're attracted to. That'd be like saying you chose to like the taste of salmon or lamb or coffee. Yes, I realize a food metaphor doesn't work because you can train yourself to like foods, but work with me here.

Straight people can never understand what it means or feels like to not be straight. So don't bother trying to empathize or rationalize... you just don't get it.

 

[Kingsman]

Thats like saying I can one day wake up and be a woman or I can wake up one day and be black or I can wake up one day being tall or I can wake up one day and be someone else, and that would also be like saying someone who is gay can wake up and be straight. It just doesn't work that way, because I know a lot of gay guys who would just love to be straight.

In a nutshell.

If a man is born gay, it simply wasn't his choice and he shouldn't be ridiculed for the matter.

If a man chose to be gay, then he has a deep psychological problem that society is letting him use to empower himself as a minority figure by classifying him as "gay."

 

[Palademon]

Because you don't choose your sexuality, the same way you don't choose your beliefs. If you believe something or are something, you just are naturally, there is no choice.

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

I see a lot of people on both sides arguing if people were born gay or chose to be gay themselves. What I don't see is anyone saying both camps are just as valid as the other. Rarely, other animals beside human have exhibited gay behavior before, clearly showing it can be a rare natural occurrence. But we humans also have free will, meaning you can, indeed, choose to be gay. I'm sure both types of gays exist, they're equally valid. So why does it need to be one or the other?

Actually, it's really common in animals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals

 

[Alex Ford]

Not really. You can't just choose to like penises (or vaginas if you're a gal). At least, you can't choose it and be happy. You'd be a fake gay, in my opinion. Also, why would you choose that life for yourself? Being rediculed and shunned for your way of life.

exactly.
Free will means you can choose to do gay acts, but you can't chose to be gay. At least I'm pretty sure it dosen't work that way...

 

[Drakmeire]

I've seen tons of girls go "Trendsbian" (only acting bisexual because they think guys will like them if they do) so I figure some people can choose what they like,
one girl I knew liked guys but one day she tried sex with a girl, said it was the best sex she ever had and went full lesbian after, so you can decide if you really want to.

 

[mr_rubino]

Not every debate has two sides. Sometimes people are just wrong.
Compromising between truth and fiction to make people's feelings less hurty seems... a little too politically-correct.

Y'know, like how intelligent design could be right, but the ID scien...ticians don't seem too pre-occupied with proving it. You know how it goes.

 

[CoverYourHead]

Well I'm bisexual, so I guess I can choose... But still, you don't choose who you're attracted to. I know a lot of people who would rather be one or the other or bi, but they can't, because they're simply not attracted to one sex or the other.

 

[Ironic Pirate]

Let's say you like red-heads. It's your biggest fetish.

One day, because your bored, you decide to only like women with hot pink liberty spikes. Now, you wouldn't even date a red-head.

Is that possible? No? Then you can't choose to be gay.

 

[EonEire]

Free will means you can choose to do gay acts, but you can't chose to be gay.

This pretty much sums it up.

 

[Nautical Honors Society]

I see a lot of people on both sides arguing if people were born gay or chose to be gay themselves. What I don't see is anyone saying both camps are just as valid as the other. Rarely, other animals beside human have exhibited gay behavior before, clearly showing it can be a rare natural occurrence. But we humans also have free will, meaning you can, indeed, choose to be gay. I'm sure both types of gays exist, they're equally valid. So why does it need to be one or the other?

First of all in the entire scope of humanity the majority of people are heterosexual so your argument about other animals is a bit invalid. Also there is such a thing as animal homosexuality.

And no, you cannot chose to be gay. You cannot chose to find a man or a women sexually attractive you are born with the inclination.

But, man does have the free will to perform whatever acts he wishes

Free will means you can choose to do gay acts, but you can't chose to be gay.

 

[mr_rubino]

Can we agree as a forum to put a moratorium on the "Choosing to put your X on a Y = Choosing to want to put your X on a Y" argument? It completely conflates feelings and actions, smacks of knowing misdirection, and is pretty insulting to people's intelligences when they're trying to have a serious discussion. Of course, the fact that this is still debated is in itself an insult to the intelligence of a supposedly advanced nation (and let's be honest, only one "advanced nation" debates this still), but that's another story.
(Again: Evolution vs. ID. You don't have to believe one, but don't pretend that automatically makes the other one right or even a logically-defensible position.)

EDIT: Holy piss, I swear I hadn't seen the post above me when I wrote this. I was kinda hoping to keep the thread from falling into that mire to begin with.