Call of Duty: Women at War

[A random person]

Snipped for space.

I thank you, good sir, for dealing with his gender traditionalism (not saying anti-feminist since as you pointed out, he doesn't understand feminism) more comprehensibly than my little post earlier.

Instead of wasting a precious minute of my life reading your stupid opinions i choose to ignore you and stop derailing the thread. Go back to your little hole of a brainwashed mind.

So you call him out for not comprehending your post and calling it stupid out of his ignorance, and then you go right ahead and ignore his elaborating post while calling his opinion stupid? God I love irony...

Also, for the benefit of Mr. Kiefer and I, how does a belief in gender equality indicate a "little hole of a brainwashed mind?"

 

[Lonan]

Because woman should not go to war, just like they didn't for most of history before all this "feminist" , "sexist" and "no free speech" crap. Though there are some women in the army nowadays, people prefer having testosterone high video games.

Biologically, women cant handle war as well men can, men will always be stronger and more able, while women will be more feminine as they should. Whats wrong with women being delicate, beautiful and caring, why do women of the 21st century need to be Construction workers and Mechanics to show how they are better than men. You wont see us guys running around telling women we are better at what they do, though homosexuals are filling up female places in industry, like fashion and hair dressing.

Biologically? BULLSHIT!
If a boy and girl were trained exactly the same from birth to be killing machines, I bet 9 out of 10, the chick would kick the guy's ass. Society conditions females to be the 'pussies' that they are. Forcing girls to play with barbies and ponies and scolding them for doing anything remotely masculine is what makes women suck at combat in general. Not any biological or emotional handicap.

In general, a trained female combatant could handle almost any wartime situation as good or better than a man. I'd say it's 90% training and practice and 10% genes, not because of any biological difference. Genetically, a female may be more prone to certain actions or emotions that will effect her negatively in combat. But with the right training, that can be negated. And any female with the right training can beat any male in physical combat.

And by training, I obviously include a small dose of subliminal messaging/brainwashing as that is what armies do to make their soldiers the death dealing machines that they are.

If they were incredibly young the girl might be stronger, but as people get older, males become inherently more muscular, it's part of genetics. There is no basis for a woman being stronger than a man. I'm not saying it's impossible, but to suggest that HUMAN females are generally physically stronger than male HUMANS is biologically inaccurate. You seem to just be defensive. There are obviously many woman who are very capable of frontline work, and I doubt physical strength has much to do with modern trigger pulling combat. Well, I'm sure it does, but not so much that a woman would be obviously inferior to a man. Of course, I'm not in the army, but if we aren't comparing physical strength of men to woman then I don't think woman would be inferior in modern combat.

 

[ToastyTheCommie]

Well, at least going by general consensus, about 99% of games are marketed at Americans, and in the American military women are actively kept away from the frontlines at every given opportunity, besides if women were constantly put in games it wouldn't be too long before they would evolve into one of two things; either a) a skimpy dressed harlot with tits big enough to have an orbit, or b) a complete carpet-munching, penis-severing *****.

 

[A random person]

Instead of wasting a precious minute of my life reading your stupid opinions i choose to ignore you and stop derailing the thread. Go back to your little hole of a brainwashed mind.

So you call him out for not comprehending your post and calling it stupid out of his ignorance, and then you go right ahead and ignore his elaborating post while calling his opinion stupid? God I love irony...

Drop it, we talked about it through private messages and found that we miss understood each other. I tend to think the worse of people until proven otherwise, since ive had experience with a lot of stupid people on the internet. I initially ignored to read his post since to me he appeared closed minded and hostile, and you can't have a discussion with people who wont change their opinion and are stubborn till death. So don't act all high and mighty when you don't know the whole story.

Hey, I can't just magically know you and him had a PM conversation, nothing in your or his posts had the slightest indication that there was anything else to it.

But I'll drop it, since apparently there was a part of the debate I'm fundamentally unable to see. And disregard my comment about the irony, you had a genuine reason to ignore his post.

Also, aimed at you, i can't take you seriously since while you talk of gender equality and you obviously enjoy anime (cartoons of women severely degraded and put in next to no clothing for the amusement of its fans, mostly male. There's no anime where women don't have huge breasts and no clothes).

I've actually seen intelligent discussion about misogyny in anime (mostly from BonsaiK), but your comment about there being no anime where women don't have huge breasts and no clothes shows you probably haven't seen much. BonsaiK would also say that sexism in anime doesn't come from the skimpy clothing (he has no problem with fanservice, and I'd say anime's pretty willing to get men half-naked too), but from subtle things explored in gender theory.

I can let the other things go, but actually know about anime outside the 90% dictated by sturgeons law.

 

[A random person]

Instead of wasting a precious minute of my life reading your stupid opinions i choose to ignore you and stop derailing the thread. Go back to your little hole of a brainwashed mind.

So you call him out for not comprehending your post and calling it stupid out of his ignorance, and then you go right ahead and ignore his elaborating post while calling his opinion stupid? God I love irony...

Drop it, we talked about it through private messages and found that we miss understood each other. I tend to think the worse of people until proven otherwise, since ive had experience with a lot of stupid people on the internet. I initially ignored to read his post since to me he appeared closed minded and hostile, and you can't have a discussion with people who wont change their opinion and are stubborn till death. So don't act all high and mighty when you don't know the whole story.

Hey, I can't just magically know you and him had a PM conversation, nothing in your or his posts had the slightest indication that there was anything else to it.

But I'll drop it, since apparently there was a part of the debate I'm fundamentally unable to see. And disregard my comment about the irony, you had a genuine reason to ignore his post.

Yeah i came across as a bit harsh to you, of course you cant know we had a conversation, but i didn't like how you jumped in spreading accusations and assaulting my integrity.

Well, to maintain my integrity since you seem to think feminism and anime are incompatible, look at my post edit. That part I'm pissed about.

And again, to my knowledge you were just being sexist, of course I was going to jump you or most anyone for that (and don't bring up the "you watch anime, therefore you're not a feminist" thing).

 

[Danny Ocean]

Because woman should not go to war, just like they didn't for most of history before all this "feminist" , "sexist" and "no free speech" crap. Though there are some women in the army nowadays, people prefer having testosterone high video games.

Biologically, women cant handle war as well men can, men will always be stronger and more able, while women will be more feminine as they should. Whats wrong with women being delicate, beautiful and caring, why do women of the 21st century need to be Construction workers and Mechanics to show how they are better than men. You wont see us guys running around telling women we are better at what they do, though homosexuals are filling up female places in industry, like fashion and hair dressing.

Biologically? BULLSHIT!
If a boy and girl were trained exactly the same from birth to be killing machines, I bet 9 out of 10, the chick would kick the guy's ass. Society conditions females to be the 'pussies' that they are. Forcing girls to play with barbies and ponies and scolding them for doing anything remotely masculine is what makes women suck at combat in general. Not any biological or emotional handicap.

In general, a trained female combatant could handle almost any wartime situation as good or better than a man. I'd say it's 90% training and practice and 10% genes, not because of any biological difference. Genetically, a female may be more prone to certain actions or emotions that will effect her negatively in combat. But with the right training, that can be negated. And any female with the right training can beat any male in physical combat.

As much as I might agree with you, you're effectively saying "Women are better than men.". Isn't that the kind of sexism you're trying to avoid?

Check this shit out: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7460617.stm

No no, he's right. There are no women pulling triggers unless those triggers are behind the frontlines. She was in the intelligence corps. The other soldiers were probably assigned to protect her. Stating facts isn't sexism, and all I'm stating is that there are no women in frontline roles. It even says so on the British Army Website. They can do everything else, but a number of reasons stop them from being allowed to parachute in with the men.

 

[Tom13ombadil]

1 word:
sammich

 

[TheScarecrow]

The Gear's wear helmets. One could presume some were female, especially considering that setting-wise they needed everyone they could get.

 

[A random person]

Snippage

Nah man i aint sexist, i just think men and women excel at different professions and have different skills sets, and as such shouldn't try to overly impose on each others territory. Women did great to keep the economy and industry running during WW 2 and that worked great! I love and respect women, but i don't like how many of them don't respect themselves and act like sluts, and that's what feminists should fix. I do however think anime are very sexist. They would be much better if women were not put in such outfits and treated like sex objects rather than characters, and i found it hard to enjoy a female character in anime with the look they are usually given. So yeah i do think anime and feminism are incompatible, but i don't think it cant be fixed. Im glad we understand each other.

Again, BonsaiK would say that sexism in anime doesn't come from fanservice, but from more subtle things that are seen with gender theory. He's all for fanservice, and you should talk to him about sexism in anime. Of course, I'd have to add that my feminism is directed less towards slutty women (as yours is) and more towards rights and all that jazz (i.e the Middle East, I think I've said enough). I'd also add that a woman can dress revealingly without being slutty or lacking self respect.

I tend to agree with BonsaiK that fanservice isn't really sexist (and I'd argue that it's pretty exploitative of men too; ever notice how Goku constantly loses his shirt?), and women dressed like sluts is hardly just anime's problem (see: popular music, especially rap, many lower quality Hollywood films and a good bit of high quality ones, many western video games, superhero comics, advertising). I would agree with you when they're just sex objects, however, though keep in mind I mean fundamentally personality-less "objects" and not sexually appealing characters; if they were sex objects, just about everything ever period is sexist. Of course, I have to point out that you probably just saw some bad-to-mediocre anime (aka 90%, like with everything), since many of the anime I watch aren't quite as bad as you seem to be saying (yes, Nanoha has some pretty damn noticeable female forms, but Fate's an interesting character). And for proof that anime fans can be feminists, I point to NeutralDrow.
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On the topic that started this conversation, I apologize again for being rather arrogant; again, as far as anyone save the guy you PM'd could tell, you seemed rather chauvinist (to be polite), but even then you're sexist-seeming self was hardly the worst I've seen here (remember a guy named bagodix? Hoo boy he was bad...). As for the anime sexism thing, talk to BonsaiK about fanservice and whatnot, and talk to NeutralDrow too. I won't say much more since I've already spent an absurdly long amount of time writing this, but glad we're reconciled and not flaming each other on both points.

 

[hittite]

The Gear's wear helmets. One could presume some were female, especially considering that setting-wise they needed everyone they could get.

That reminded me. On the first mission in the hollow in Gears 2 when you go to help out Alpha Squad, there's a wounded gear back behind the fighting when you first go in. If you wade into the melee chainsaw first, you'll miss that there is a short scrap of dialog from the medic. Even thought there is no visible difference, the medic has a woman's voice.

 

[TheScarecrow]

The Gear's wear helmets. One could presume some were female, especially considering that setting-wise they needed everyone they could get.

That reminded me. On the first mission in the hollow in Gears 2 when you go to help out Alpha Squad, there's a wounded gear back behind the fighting when you first go in. If you wade into the melee chainsaw first, you'll miss that there is a short scrap of dialog from the medic. Even thought there is no visible difference, the medic has a woman's voice.

Really? Interesting.

There's female marines in Halo 2 and 3 as well.

 

[Pegghead]

There was a mission in Call of Duty 3 (The only game in the franchise I own) where you parachute off course into this captured French town where a group of French resistance members help you escape. One of the leaders was a woman and she had the most dialogue and barked the most orders.

 

[akmarksman]

OT: I can only think of the chick in COD 2 in the soviet campaign, the female resistance member that dies in COD 3 and the female chopper pilot in COD 4...

That pissed me off..basically walking through hell and back to get a Cobra pilot rescued and then



NUKE.

 

[sauerkraus]

*Fairly* sure that women aren't found on the frontlines, even in real life.

They are.
A great deal of U.S. Military women complain that people think like you.
"Oh, she was probably only on base"
When in reality they usually apply for the heavy combat missions.
Due to generalizations of a female's combat abilities, you end up pissing off a woman who did as much work as the next guy.
So it is realistic to find women on the front-lines today and it is somewhat realistic to have found them back then. I remember a Russian sniping squadron comprised only of women, and they got the highest amount of sniping kills.

I'm fairly sure that you pulled that out of your ass, the U.S. Army at least, doesn't let females get into close combat infantry MOS. It's because: 1 the female body is (generally) less suited for carrying the huge amount of gear and body armor that our modern soldiers wear and 2 Men would notice that they are females. The men would react more adversely to seeing a woman get shot, possibly compromising a mission. And... women in the Army are pretty much constantly pregnant and that is a get out of deployment free card.

And I am fairly sure that you did not do the research and are just spouting things to make a point.

You don't believe me when I tell you that the military utilizes females for combat roles?
Israeli's do this, and hell, even the U.K. does this as well.
Check this shit out: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7460617.stm
Oh, and that stuff about women soldiers getting pregnant all the time?
That has only happen three times for the U.S. military in the last 10 years.
And it was recently thought of to be able to court-martial those who were.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8422989.stm

And women are just as able to do just as much as men.
Not more.
Not less.
But the same.
Next time you act like an incompetent sexist, do it right, and look up the research.

You know what, I'll just post more examples to prove to you that females are participating just as equally, albeit with more media attention.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/3973281.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/kent/4525552.stm

You are a fucking jackass. Seriously. The guy I quoted said specifically that "A great deal of U.S. Military women.....apply for the heavy combat missions." My response was specifically about the U.S. military, in which I know that women are not allowed to be frontline grunts.

I am fairly sure you should read into details because different countries have different policies.

Also, female bodies ARE different from male bodies. It's science. No matter how idealistic you like to believe, women are physically less capable than men. It's not their fault, it's just how it works. I know two women who are stronger than me, out of over a thousand in my school. If you want to argue that women's bodies are exactly the same as men's, shoot them up with some testosterone. That's what we have that they don't.

 

[Naughty MrPeeps]

O god, let me go change my pants.