Can the Japanese make a bad dub?

[IvoryTowerGamer]

While I don't disagree that I'm not the target of the dubs and I shouldn't be watching them in the first place (as I am not), you need to realize that I am affected by the existence of dubs just the same.


When people regard something I care for, I am affected by their views on it. When people who know nothing dare to speak about what fits Goku and what doesn't, speak as though they know what they're talking about when in fact they have no clue, I am utterly annoyed by it so I complain. Is that so hard to understand?

Yeah, it's a bit elitist, but it is easy to understand. I have a aneurysm and throw a fit every time someone says "Warhammer totally ripped off Blizzard!"

Well, I guess that's what differentiates an enthusiast from an elitist. Assuming the other person isn't being confrontational like in the Warhammer example, why do you need to bite their head off over it?

 

[Okysho]

Yes... Soul Eater has a really bad Japanese Dub, Specifically Maka

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

While I don't disagree that I'm not the target of the dubs and I shouldn't be watching them in the first place (as I am not), you need to realize that I am affected by the existence of dubs just the same.


When people regard something I care for, I am affected by their views on it. When people who know nothing dare to speak about what fits Goku and what doesn't, speak as though they know what they're talking about when in fact they have no clue, I am utterly annoyed by it so I complain. Is that so hard to understand?

Yeah, it's a bit elitist, but it is easy to understand. I have a aneurysm and throw a fit every time someone says "Warhammer totally ripped off Blizzard!"

Well, I guess that's what differentiates an enthusiast from an elitist. Assuming the other person isn't being confrontational like in the Warhammer example, why do you need to bite their head off over it?

Ignorance bugs me but I never go "ha, I know this so I'm better than you!", I never care about myself in any of this, I just care for the item of my fascination and how it is being represented, perceived and described, that's what all this is about.

 

[DrOswald]

When people regard something I care for, I am affected by their views on it. When people who know nothing dare to speak about what fits Goku and what doesn't, speak as though they know what they're talking about when in fact they have no clue, I am utterly annoyed by it so I complain. Is that so hard to understand?

Yeah, it's a bit elitist, but it is easy to understand. I have a aneurysm and throw a fit every time someone says "Warhammer totally ripped off Blizzard!"

Like I said a few posts up, I know it may sound a bit elitist and I don't care.

I'm into a sub-culture you need to learn a new non-roman language to fully appreciate for crying out loud, it doesn't exactly shout approachability and low devotion thresholds now, does it?

I understand. but you have to remember that it is not the elite that pays for localization, it is revenue from casual anime viewers. Why else would they bother with the far more expensive process of dubbing when they could only sub for a fraction of the price? Better to have the casual viewer and the anime than just the elite and nothing at all.

(and warhammer totally ripped off WoW......teehee~)

I know its a joke, but it still makes me kind of angry. Here, my revenge:

Anime is so lame! Its only for little kids!

 

[Just_A_Glitch]

I prefer dubs because I don't want to have to read what I'm watching. I'd read a book if that were the case.

In the case of Goku's voice, I don't like his high pitched one. It just seems off.

 

[Julianking93]

I prefer the dub of DBZ simply because that's what I grew up watching.
I haven't heard the original Japanese voice work until just now, actually and found that to be possibly the most annoying thing ever. >.>
However, given the context, I understand it but that doesn't make it any less annoying.

But both can be quite ridiculous sounding. I prefer English dubs for action and the original Japanese for comedy or romance simply because I've never seen a comedic or cutesy anime with a good English dub. The Japanese voices just sound cuter to me :3

However...

some fantastic dubs (Cowboy Bebop, FLCL).

I get Bebop but... why FLCL? Maybe it's just me but I found the English dub to be quite irritating. That could be because I watched the subbed version first but I only watched it for the first time about a month ago >.>

 

[New Frontiersman]

I don't know for sure since I've never been there, but I'm sure they can.

In a related note they seem to think so:
http://kotaku.com/#!5415904/gamers-not-happy-with-japanese-modern-warfare-2
http://tfwiki.net/wiki/Beast_Wars_%28cartoon%29#Japan

I love how the question "can the Japanese make a bad dub" managed to spiral into the "subbing vs dubbing" debate. way to stay on topic guys.

 

[Dreiko_v1legacy]

When people regard something I care for, I am affected by their views on it. When people who know nothing dare to speak about what fits Goku and what doesn't, speak as though they know what they're talking about when in fact they have no clue, I am utterly annoyed by it so I complain. Is that so hard to understand?

Yeah, it's a bit elitist, but it is easy to understand. I have a aneurysm and throw a fit every time someone says "Warhammer totally ripped off Blizzard!"

Like I said a few posts up, I know it may sound a bit elitist and I don't care.

I'm into a sub-culture you need to learn a new non-roman language to fully appreciate for crying out loud, it doesn't exactly shout approachability and low devotion thresholds now, does it?

I understand. but you have to remember that it is not the elite that pays for localization, it is revenue from casual anime viewers. Why else would they bother with the far more expensive process of dubbing when they could only sub for a fraction of the price? Better to have the casual viewer and the anime than just the elite and nothing at all.

I don't buy this "casual anime dub noobs pay for your anime you jerk!" type of reasoning. There's tons of epic stuff that never leaves Japan, much much better than the stuff that does, if it depended on them such amazing series would have never been made. One piece, the single best selling manga series of all time (with it holding like the top 5 records btw) majorly flopped here for one, due to the dub being a pathetic excuse for children's entertainment or a joke if you're being nice.


They dub stuff cause it's cheaper than making their own American animation and even if they did chances are it would still be better to show a violated version of a good anime than whatever it is they made lol.

Anime is so lame! Its only for little kids!

If you've only watched dubs I can't fault your point my friend.

 

[Xpwn3ntial]

Oh boy, can they.

A surprising amount, in fact.

.//hack in general and Makoto Shinkai's movies come to mind.

 

[Kakujin]

What usually bugs me about a dubbed version is the lack of ability to pronounce words left from the original version properly, as well as a tangible lack of effort from the voice actors in many cases. By this I mostly mean names and such, especially in cases where they are using more or less actual Japanese names or words, because it sounds horrible.

Apart from that, and perhaps a bit out of the focus for the thread, the dubbed version tends to be cut "to better suit the standards of censorship and age appropriate material", which I think is just plain wrong. What is deemed fine for people in one country can't possibly actually harm people in another country.

I have always tried my best to watch or take part of something in the language it was written, to get as close to the authors intentions as possible. Of course, this is far from always possible. But when it comes to anime, is it really that much harder to read and watch at the same time, and thereby avoid shoddy voice work, needless censorship, changed music and other nuisances associated with dubbed anime?

Edit: Point I forgot to make: I think the dub/sub might very well be a cultural thing as well. Being Swedish I am used to having almost everything I watch on TV subtitled (all shows, movies etc. that are in English at least). This way reading while watching something comes very naturally, and doesn't interfere with the experience. Thus I think it is only natural to have something that is in a language that is not my own, whether I understand it or not, subtitled.

 

[Yopaz]

Oh Dragonball Z...

"My god, he's so powerful!"

"No...just really, really constipated."

And hairy, don't forget hairy!
And blond.

And don't forget incapable of doing anything related to a plot, in under 3 episodes

Fun fact, the farther you get in the manga, the longer time does it take for anyone to do anything plot related. The first 2 books had them travel across the world to get 7 dragonballs, when he was going to battle Cell later in the series he needed at least a whole book on one fight. That's why I don't watch the anime... I can see the pictures faster than what the animation is capable of showing.

OP: of course Japanese dubs can be horrible, all dubs can. Because languages are different dubs wont always fit in with the words they're actually saying. Sometimes looking at subs make me think the Japanese are able to say a full sentence by saying "Hoooooooh" or something like it, sometimes what seems to take ages to say turn out as a few words. Might be due to some bad subs though.

 

[JokerCrowe]

Unless someone actually understands Japanese, and all the inflections used in the language, they are completely talking out of their arse if they jump on the whole

"omg! The original Japanese is so much betterah!"

Those people tend to be weeaboos.

I think I'll gob into this river...
Of course, I don't know japanese and is therefore unable to tell whether a dub is good or not. That being said, you can tell if the voice actor is putting emotion into what they do, and some examples of English dubbing just doesn't hold up to the Japanese standard.
Love Hina is my favorite example of this, I can bearly listen to the english dub because the voice acting is so atrocios. Then there are other examples like Azumanga Daioh and Chobits, that have pretty excellent English voice acting.
I don't think anyone who isn't Japanese(/speaks Japanese) can tell if a japanese dub is bad, but you can tell if the English dub is bad by looking at the charcters and seeing whether the voice seems to fit the Action. Bad voice acting is always easy to detect, it's just that we know it's bad when it's in English.

EDIT: While I have no idea if this is factual or not, I get the impression that Anime is much larger in Japan than it is in America, (where I assume most English dubs come from) and I think the Japanese Anime makers might hire some pretty well known and talanted actors to play the characters. My point is that I think you can safely assume that Japan puts a lot more effort and time and money into making good dubs. In America I get the impression that they don't assume the show will be that popular so either they hire some guy of the street, or they get some c-level Tv-movie actor to come and phone it in.

 

[Escapefromwhatever]

Goku isn't really a good example. The dub made a good choice in changing his voice- his Japanese voice is a joke that works there but doesn't translate well. In this case, both dubs are excellent.

A better example is Big O, wherein the English version is far superior to the Japanese one. Just listen to the acting- the English one has so much more emotion.

 

[Ghengis John]

Lastly, the JP version is no dub, it's the original, dubs are what is done to the original in order to make it into another language.

You can I hope at least admit that just because something is the original article does not guarantee that it is the best. The original can be improved upon. Rather infamously for instance even the Japanese prefer the Dub of The Big O to the original.

Personally, in reference to the topic at hand: I try to respect the initial vision for a piece of art but that doesn't mean when we're dealing with actors, who are human beings, that a performance is beyond a different interpretation. That is after all an element at the heart of theater. William Shakespeare might have picked the original actor to play MacBeth but that didn't close the role off forever. To say the first one you ever saw is the best without keeping an open mind is silly. And sometimes it simply comes down to personal judgment and taste. That's how I look at it anyhow, on a case by case basis. I thought the Japanese voice actress for Holo from Spice and Wolf for instance was not bad but she sounded too young (The English actress had the appropriate air of experience and haughtiness) meanwhile I thought both Berserk casts were pretty fantastic. I prefer the American Goku but the Japanese Ichigo. I have a hard time understanding people who are so rigid one way or the other.

 

[Mike Laserbeam]

Sure Goku's voice in Japanese is ridiculous (I've actually never heard it that way before, having only ever watched DBZ on Cartoon Network), but are you saying the voices in the English are better? Goku's probably is, marginally, but the rest are just ridiculous.

 

[DrOswald]

When people regard something I care for, I am affected by their views on it. When people who know nothing dare to speak about what fits Goku and what doesn't, speak as though they know what they're talking about when in fact they have no clue, I am utterly annoyed by it so I complain. Is that so hard to understand?

Yeah, it's a bit elitist, but it is easy to understand. I have a aneurysm and throw a fit every time someone says "Warhammer totally ripped off Blizzard!"

Like I said a few posts up, I know it may sound a bit elitist and I don't care.

I'm into a sub-culture you need to learn a new non-roman language to fully appreciate for crying out loud, it doesn't exactly shout approachability and low devotion thresholds now, does it?

I understand. but you have to remember that it is not the elite that pays for localization, it is revenue from casual anime viewers. Why else would they bother with the far more expensive process of dubbing when they could only sub for a fraction of the price? Better to have the casual viewer and the anime than just the elite and nothing at all.

I don't buy this "casual anime dub noobs pay for your anime you jerk!" type of reasoning. There's tons of epic stuff that never leaves Japan, much much better than the stuff that does, if it depended on them such amazing series would have never been made. One piece, the single best selling manga series of all time (with it holding like the top 5 records btw) majorly flopped here for one, due to the dub being a pathetic excuse for children's entertainment or a joke if you're being nice.


They dub stuff cause it's cheaper than making their own American animation and even if they did chances are it would still be better to show a violated version of a good anime than whatever it is they made lol.

Anime is so lame! Its only for little kids!

If you've only watched dubs I can't fault your point my friend.

1. I said that localization depends on the causal market, not primary production. Hence the need for a dub.

2. I agree that the one piece dub was crap, but I think that whole series is kind of fail. It has some fun characters and humor, but most of it is just boring filler. (I watched up to episode 50 or so in the subbed version and read through chapter 90 in the manga, I think.)

3. I watch anime in both sub and dub. By my judgment, sometimes sub is better, sometimes dub is better.

4. Just so everyone is crystal clear, I do not think that anime is only for kids, nor is it lame. Also, good jab Dreiko. Your kung fu is greater.

 

[RichardThompson]

I genuinely don't care, because for all the awful dubs there may be, all I can remember from the DBZ series is one of the movies where Hitler comes back to life and Goten and Trunks kick he and his army to the curb, whereupon he says "Blonde hair, blue eyes? I should be recruiting them!"

 

[lord.jeff]

I happen to prefer dubs, the subs make it hard to follow action sequences plus it's a constant reminder that I'm watching a movie.