Can we take a step back here?

[Ilyak1986]

Is there "more" to this story? Probably. Do I give a damn? Absolutely not. Why? Because I came *to* this site for EC, and so, I will leave with them.

When "the man" sics lawyers on the little guy, that's enough to say "we don't give a damn what your facts are. You whipped out the lawyers over a money-grab, you're fucking sleazeballs, and I hope everyone googles adblock and never buys your worthless pubclub membership to pay for something they can get for free. Sleazeballs."

So yeah. I have an intense hatred for lawyering. The Escapist played the lawyer card first. Therefore, they lose the game.

The end, GG.

I... ok, forget about who's right in the dispute. You're wrong on principle.

There's this assumption that if somebody is operating from a company, then they're "the man". I mean, I don't know how much money James makes, but I'm sure he *makes* money (clearly The Escapist doesn't), and when somebody starts a company out of charity money I have a ton of questions right off the bat, regardless of who's suing who. Damn right there will be lawyers involved in that. It doesn't need to get personal, it's just the sort of thing you expect to have to go through the legal system in one way or another.

Assumption? Take a fucking LOOK at the site. You think this is just some sort of little indie outfit? Are you joking?! Just because their business, analytics, and monetization end is absolutely and completely INEPT doesn't make them any less of "the man" in my eyes.

As for James running a company out of charity money, the entire purpose of that company is to help other indie game publishers, such as xdanondx, who published RPG Shooter: Starwish, try to make more and better games in the future, in the form of a non-profit, to create a virtuous cycle. I applaud this venture.

 

[Imp_Emissary]

Just wanted to say I'm liking that I'm not alone on this one. On at least some level I was expecting to be told to STFU in the first five posts.

It's given my optimism a healthy boost. Maybe Extra Credits and the Escapist will be able to come to some sort of agreement?

I was blind sided by this "event". At first confusion, then shock, then disbelief, then sadness, then Anger, and now pretty much depression.

I don't think this can end very well. Either I'll lose my Extra Credits, or my faith in the Escapist.
I originally was brought here by Yahtzee, and because I had a bit of a "falling out" with the last place I got my game news.
Now I just feel real down. The worst thing is that the whole fund-raising thing EC did just made me so happy to be a gamer, and on the Escapist.
Now.....I have nothing but sadness.

But....at least Alison got her arm fixed, and maybe we can all just hug it out. We can always hope.

 

[similar.squirrel]

I'm still of the opinion that commentary of the Extra Credits calibre is worth a thousand juvenile lolfests like Unskippable. And as much as I like Moviebob, The Big Picture is only getting more obscure and increasingly irrelevant.
I mean, of all the shows, they really chose the wrong one to let go.

 

[Cheezeypoofs]

Based on each of the stories available right now, both are at least partially wrong. It's even enough for me that I'm effectively neutral in lieu of further claims. The Escapist should pay their contributors, and I'm frankly concerned where in God's name all that ad revenue is not to mention the PubClub, and EC should pay for the t-shirt etc the Escapist provided. A little compromise between the two could likely allow for an indie fund (albeit smaller) and the funding necessary to hire more artists while Allison is recooperating.

Essentially, I'm agreeing with you. Just going to sit here and ride this thing out. It'd be nice to get Dan and Allison's comments on this as well.

 

[The Cheezy One]

I think there's been some [HEADING=2]SERIOUS[/HEADING] miscommunication here.

Which itself is kinda retarded in our day and age. Or maybe it isn't. Maybe it's Twitter's fault somehow. Fucking 140 characters.

Regardless, I don't yet think anyone is at fault par se. If they just calm down and discuss this properly, I'm sure they can resolve the situation amicably. Fingers crossed.

When you can only write half a sentence, you need to get your point down fast. So a heartfelt and deep story becomes cold and mechanical, whereas a calm and considered point of view suddenly becomes an aggressive shout.

But....at least Alison got her arm fixed, and maybe we can all just hug it out. We can always hope.

Hugs. Fix. EVERYTHING! Hug?

I think that these people are mature, and with conversation, someone will eventually say "You said this? I thought you meant that! Oh, it all makes sense now!", But I'm naive like that.

But yeah, chill, don't abondon the big E over this, wait until all the facts are out and Penny Arcade has done a webcomic on it. I also noticed most of the people leaving a 2 monthers and 70-odd posters. I know that isn't everything, but it's all I have to judge these people on.

And as with when a lot of people leave, they want me to care. Nah.

 

[Nouw]

A thread with some sense about this ordeal?

WHAT IS THIS?
[sub]I expected to see this thread with 17 pages, not the one where people shamelessly blame the Escapist.[/sub]

It's a lot easier to point blame than to admit you don't know what is going on.

Then I guess I'm disgusted! People need to swallow their pride and set aside their damn ego.[sub]I kid about the first sentence.[/sub]

 

[GeorgW]

I'm definitely with you, I want the whole story before I take sides!

 

[Taham]

Right behind you.

 

[oppp7]

Not sure who's wrong here, as I haven't researched it that much. However I do hope this gets settled soon. And what is it with this site and controversy?

Also, what was the issue people brought up with ZP and PAX?

 

[BroJing]

I agree, seems like alot of craziness on both sides. To be honest EC was never my favourite show on the escapist anyway so I'm not overly fussed.

 

[Larmo]

I think that both sides had hired some sort of legal representative and both being good at there job tried to get the best option for there client.

But until the dust settles we don't have any real idea so i choose to post on the thread seemingly populated by cooler heads until its all said and done and we know what actually happened.

 

[Traipse]

I think I'm going to paraphrase my response from the other thread here in a hopefully more positive light.

Both sides have valid points. I'm not going to rage against one side or the other because it's a misunderstanding over money that ultimately I have not much influence in anyway. No need to get my hackles up just over that.

I just come here for the nifty stuff. As long as there is nifty stuff on the Escapist, I'll continue coming here. Hopefully they find some good way out of the money problems... but I admit I don't see it. I do hope they get it resolved though; I don't want the Escapist to crumble.

If Extra Credits leaves, it will probably live on in some form. I'll just have to go somewhere else to view it, and I'm okay with that. After all, Dan was "Talking About These" and presenting stuff written by James long before the current title of the show. They can probably make it work.

It's not that I don't care what happens here. I just don't see how a blood frenzy helps.

 

[Whateveralot]

I'll gladly jump the bandwagon. I hate situations like these, and they never resolve in a way that satisfies "the customers" (i.o.w: us).

It's sad to see that The Escapist is in such a position where money is so scarce these debts can even excist. That being said, I believe that when The Escapist dies (if it ever happens) ZP will live on and so will Extra Credits, which are the main reasons for us to go to The Escapist (other then the amazing community which quite frankly, no other gaming website can match in my humble opinion).

 

[Avistew]

While I think hiring people and not paying them is a bad business model, I realise the Escapist is struggling with money partially due to providing it all for free. So, it's not like they're evil or anything, they're trying to do the right thing and having trouble making ends meet.
Sadly they're losing many good contributors, which would only make things worse.
I'll follow EC wherever they go next for their videos, but I'm not leaving the escapist either. They still have stuff I care about too.
So count me in the "no boycott" group.

 

[XHolySmokesX]

My opinion on the matter is leaning towards james, but without a bitter taste comming from the other side.

It seems both sides have done wrong and there have been some missunderstandings between them. However the escapist are the higher authority here, they own most of the rights to extra credits, and the fact they have been going through a tough spell means they haven't been able to stick to their plans and pay exc like they wanted to.

Becasue of this unrest exc seem to have descided that they don't ant to be finantially involved with a company that cannot finantially support them which is fair enough, and becasue of this they descided to move on.

The escapist then realised if they lost extra credits, which is one of their most popular shows (i guess that's what their place as second on the chart represents) they would lsoe a lot of followers to their site, and then lose a lot of buisness and it would be even harder for them to keep their site up and running.

It seems as if this was not made clear to exc as it appears the escapist then tried to make themselves out to be the victims and ready themselves for legal battles to keep exc on their page to help keep their page running better.

So to conclude it appears to me like everything was going a bit tits up with both sides, so extra credits descided to leave and the escapist used legality to stop them from going.

 

[Latinidiot]

I guess I'll wait and see.

 

[IndianaJonny]

Ah, a small abode of rationality amongst the furore of the raging white noise outside - count me in. Such a shame to see such organisations at logger-heads with one another.



(Unbelievable, this thread has made me realise how pleasantly quiet the internet can be from time to time)

 

[IKWerewolf]

Salute this guy... if I'd known about this I wouln't have written my post. But maybe this may not be a bad thing.

There are now probably about six or seven different posts all saying the same thing and IMPORTANTLY, nothing we are doing is wrong because we are giving our own opinions and it shows that everyone beleives the same thing.

I'm not suggesting everyone floods the Forums by starting a new topic saying "Escapist and Credits needs to get back to the table" but now is the best time to give a message to two people who have let their hearts rule their heads and handled it badly.

Also sending them messages with links to these topics probably would help.