Child directs air traffic at JFK airport

[Calgetorix]

Because there are pressurised metal tubes full of people, thousands of feet in the air.

You don't fuck with the system, simple really.

This.

A few years ago there was an Aeroflot air crash which was caused when the pilot got his son up to have a go at the controls. The pilot put the autopilot on before his son took the controls, but didn't realise that when his son turned the yoke it would disengage the autopilot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_593

75 people died. You can't play lose with the rules and regulations were aviation safety is concerned. Nothing happened in this instance, but if it did a lot of the folks saying "this is just the FFA complaining" would be screaming for blood.

Ah, I can't believe you ninja'd me on that one. I was thinking about that incident when I read about this.

I am a pilot and I gotta say I think this is being blown out of proportion. I mean it was clear that the kid was being told exactly what to say beforehand. When the planes are getting ready to take off both the pilot and air traffic controller know exactly what will be said. They just tell them at a certain time so everything goes smoothly and nobody dies. It would definitely have been different had something unexpected happen and then at that point the dad would have taken over and directed the planes. This was a simple exchange that really did not effect anything.

But if something happened, I would guess it would require the father's full attention. If he would have gotten too distracted, it could end with disaster. Sure the chances of something happening is small and sure the father could probably still do his job properly if something happened but elimating any risk is important.

EDIT: Also, it seems like a slippery slope. Sure the father watched the boy very closely but where do you draw the line? When and how can you judge if the father watched him closely enough? It's easier (and safer) to say no kids should be allowed to speak in the mic.

 

[khaimera]

It sounds like they want to punish him for what could have happened rather than what did happen, whcih was nothing. Had it caused a catastrophe though, it would be another story. It just seems risky to me.

You just KILLED THE THREAD.

Mod Edit: Please do not post low content/short replies. Please read the Posting Guidelines.

Thanks, I do my best. I got in on an early reply on this one and put on my trusty logic cap. I didn't even try and make a stupid joke like I usually do.

 

[Tharwen]

Well would you want your plane directed by a small child?

 

[ma55ter_fett]

It sounds like they want to punish him for what could have happened rather than what did happen, whcih was nothing. Had it caused a catastrophe though, it would be another story. It just seems risky to me.

I suppose that this is there arguement against such behavior.

 

[Paksenarrion]

The FAA mistook the innocent voice of a child as a publicity stunt for Dante's Inferno, and moved quickly to condemn it.

 

[Slayer_2]

Because there are pressurised metal tubes full of people, thousands of feet in the air.

You don't fuck with the system, simple really.

Tubes of metal that are the safest method of transportation we currently have. The kid only said what he was told to, and the father was there at all times. Honestly, there was no real chance of an incident occurring.

 

[MrSnugglesworth]

I think if the kid said ANYTHING wrong the Dad would have stepped in, and fixed it, then not let his child do it anymore.


I think it was a little unprofessional, but the man has to sit up there for a long time (I'm assuming, they probably have breaks though) its no reason to press charges on him.

 

[The Heik]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8547875.stm

So apparantly the lil' Yankie tykes got a week off recently, and in doing so, one child went to work with his dad, who was the traffic tower announcer at JFK airport, the busiest airport in America

The Dad told the kid what to say, and the kid said it with clarity, and the pilots responded in good humour and everyone was having a fun time (Pilots were telling the kid 'awesome job' and responding to his 'adios amigos' in kind)

Problem is, the Federal Aviation Administration has launched a probe into the incident, citing a lack of professionalism and all manner of bleak-sounding, miserable charges. They talk about it like the Dad brought some hookers up there and began having a drug-induced orgy, or somethign equally neglectful and irresponsible.

Noone was hurt, the pilots (the guys who would have been affected if anything DID happen) found it funny, the airport ran smoothly and everyone was okay

WHY? Why would you push forward with condemning this fun little escapade?

Why is America insisting on ruining every bit of enjoyment in air travel? I mean Christ, the kid said exactly what was needed for the planes to get on/off the runway and such, so why are they treating it like the dad was giving away intel to terrorists? Heck, that kid could have been a future ATC, but now the FAA has scared him away. As to why the FAA is being so harsh, it all is because of 9/11.

Ever since it happened, everyone has been afraid of the smallest things happening. The security has become unnecessarily long and arduous, despite the fact that all these precautions that they're taking do absolutely NOTHING to keep us safe (see the link below)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11863165/

Also, I think that terrorists have probably stopped considering those locations as legitimate targets, considering the reaction that America had to 9/11 with the huge Strike Force they sent to Iraq (I know that it had underlying reasons too, but the extremists probably saw it as a retaliation). Considering the link above, if the extremists really wanted to blow up more planes, they would have done it already.

.......I miss being able to go to the cockpits while in mid-flight. That was the highlight of a whole flight in my childhood

 

[Asturiel]

Because there are pressurised metal tubes full of people, thousands of feet in the air.

You don't fuck with the system, simple really.

The child sounds like he was being closely monitored, not left to do his thing. If anything was to happen the Dad would have very likely taken control of the situation. However I do see your point in human lives being put on the line, he should have "stern action" taken against him with a wink and "Just don't do it again ok Bill?" Proceeded by staring at him seriously "No, seriously don't fucking do it again".

Very true, but I abhor blaming people for hypothetical situations that never come about. I may as well scream at my brother whenever he puts away the dishes because he 'might' have dropped one of those dishes.

Difference being you may be able to not take it to such low situations, but when peoples lives are on the line if a fuck up happens, maybe they might get angry.

OT: As I said before, good job on the Dad for not fucking this up, good bit of humour for us, nice to see some lightening up in the American airways. However they should "crack down" on him to deter future incidents of this.

 

[dancinginfernal]

Because there are pressurised metal tubes full of people, thousands of feet in the air.

You don't fuck with the system, simple really.

This.

A few years ago there was an Aeroflot air crash which was caused when the pilot got his son up to have a go at the controls. The pilot put the autopilot on before his son took the controls, but didn't realise that when his son turned the yoke it would disengage the autopilot.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeroflot_Flight_593

75 people died. You can't play lose with the rules and regulations were aviation safety is concerned. Nothing happened in this instance, but if it did a lot of the folks saying "this is just the FFA complaining" would be screaming for blood.

I should say, there's a difference between piloting a plane and giving directions.

 

[Dr. wonderful]

It was cute...so damn cute.

"Adios amigo!"

 

[SonicKoala]

It definitely was unprofessional, but I don't think he should receive any significant punishment. Clearly, he was closely monitoring his son's actions and was in control of the situation.

 

[Fangface74]

Kid should have ran wild with it and started quoting the Koran

 

[Insanum]

In this situation, the father was wrong from the start because he let the child give the pilots directions. You're not supposed to do that. So while nothing did go wrong, you still have to recognize the danger in it. When you let stuff like this slide it can easily come back to bite you in the ass later. Because when one of these dangerous hypothetical situations does occur, your company ends up looking incompetent for failing to enforce the rules.Nobody wants to end up in a situation like that, so it's a necessary precaution from a business standpoint.

I have to agree, somewhat, but I also have to disagree. It may not have been the most responsible thing to do, but it also wasn't as potentially dangerous as everyone seems to be portraying it as. The article does not say, but it seems that the father did not leave the room, and would have been able to correct anything immediately that the child had said wrong. Also, as far as we know, the boy was only directing take-offs, not any landings, so the chance of any immediate danger was minimal and easily fixed before the pilots actually lifted off of the ground.

American Airlines flight 191 crashed 50 seconds after take off, killing 258 passengers, 13 crew, and two people in a caravan park. It was the worst aviation disaster in Americas history until 9/11, and remains the worst aviation accident in American history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Airlines_Flight_191

In 1992 Air Florida Flight 90 crashed into a bridge and then went down into the Patomoc river (which was frozen), killing 78 people. This aircraft was airborne for only 30 seconds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Florida_Flight_90

Take offs are dangerous.

I also love reading about air crashes.

I love reading air crashes too, But i feel your kinda missing the point. Those crashes weren't caused by ATC. I have the mental image that the child was sat on his dad's knee, With another set of headphones on. If for any reason the child said anything[/I] his dad didnt want him to say, he'dve jumped in. Anyone in the air wouldve obviously dealt with the father, and whilst i dont condone every ATC bringing in children, i just think that this time should be a "that was cute, dont do it again" moment. No-one was hurt, And its not like the kid was left alone.

 

[cuddly_tomato]

In this situation, the father was wrong from the start because he let the child give the pilots directions. You're not supposed to do that. So while nothing did go wrong, you still have to recognize the danger in it. When you let stuff like this slide it can easily come back to bite you in the ass later. Because when one of these dangerous hypothetical situations does occur, your company ends up looking incompetent for failing to enforce the rules.Nobody wants to end up in a situation like that, so it's a necessary precaution from a business standpoint.

I have to agree, somewhat, but I also have to disagree. It may not have been the most responsible thing to do, but it also wasn't as potentially dangerous as everyone seems to be portraying it as. The article does not say, but it seems that the father did not leave the room, and would have been able to correct anything immediately that the child had said wrong. Also, as far as we know, the boy was only directing take-offs, not any landings, so the chance of any immediate danger was minimal and easily fixed before the pilots actually lifted off of the ground.

American Airlines flight 191 crashed 50 seconds after take off, killing 258 passengers, 13 crew, and two people in a caravan park. It was the worst aviation disaster in Americas history until 9/11, and remains the worst aviation accident in American history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Airlines_Flight_191

In 1992 Air Florida Flight 90 crashed into a bridge and then went down into the Patomoc river (which was frozen), killing 78 people. This aircraft was airborne for only 30 seconds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Florida_Flight_90

Take offs are dangerous.

I also love reading about air crashes.

I love reading air crashes too, But i feel your kinda missing the point. Those crashes weren't caused by ATC. I have the mental image that the child was sat on his dad's knee, With another set of headphones on. If for any reason the child said anything[/I] his dad didnt want him to say, he'dve jumped in. Anyone in the air wouldve obviously dealt with the father, and whilst i dont condone every ATC bringing in children, i just think that this time should be a "that was cute, dont do it again" moment. No-one was hurt, And its not like the kid was left alone.

The point is that when aircraft are taking off they are very close to the ground. If anything happens there are seconds to act, and the if AT controller getting the kid of his knee and taking over the com even took just a few seconds those seconds could be vital.

 

[JupiterBase]

Because there are pressurised metal tubes full of people, thousands of feet in the air.

You don't fuck with the system, simple really.

Tubes of metal that are the safest method of transportation we currently have. The kid only said what he was told to, and the father was there at all times. Honestly, there was no real chance of an incident occurring.

These aircraft are the safest form of travel because of the procedures in place to keep it safe. The mechanics who maintain, repair and look over the aircraft before and after a flight. The ATC makes it so these pilots and dont run into each other and i know that planes have Anti Collision Sensors or whatever but what if it fails? What if there passing through a cloud? What if they dont see Uncle Buck in his Cesna sightseeing? This where the ATC comes in. They also keep these pilots informed of what other pilots are doing as well as any other necessary information all so the pilot can make the best decision. Having your kid there with you when your have to watch 50 planes coming and going is a big distraction especially at JFK.

There is no room for mistakes.

 

[ottenni]

Well if the pilots didn't have a problem with it then it makes me wonder if its really that bad at all. But then again there were allot of lives at stake. But seeing as i'm neither a air traffic controller or a pilot what the hell do i know.

 

[KiKiweaky]

Just a bit of harmless fun, but I can see why he gona get in trouble for it. Bottom line he shouldn't have done it.