"Civil War" Vs "Dawn of Justice" - Which will do it better?

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Honestly, Dawn of Justice isn't going to fail because they don't have the lead up movies that Civil War/Avengers has.

Shit, I could have walked into the both Avengers movies without seeing a lick of any of the other movies and still enjoyed it. The problem is just that DC doesn't understand how to make a good movie regardless.

A bit to harsh saying that DC's upcoming movies will be bad basing soley on the one Man of Steel movie which really I still think people exaggerate how bad this movie is.

Considerin that there are worse Superman things than Man of Steel.

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

Marvel. They took their time to build up the events. DC is trying to cram 5 or 6 years worth of nuance in to a 2 hour movie.

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Marvel. They took their time to build up the events. DC is trying to cram 5 or 6 years worth of nuance in to a 2 hour movie.

Well at least I don't have to wait years before a Justice League movies. Besides aren't they going to do individual Superhero movies anyways? They confirm a Wonder Woman solo movie and their own DCCU Green Lantern movie. And I heard good things about Green Arrow and Flash tv shows.

And as if the early Marvel movie movies were masterpieces?

Iron Man 1 is so dated Tony Stark made a reference to MySpace and I feel it has too much of a last minute villain.

Tim Roth Hulk could have been better and this is coming from someone who likes Hulk as a character.

Iron Man 2 imo is fleas on the camel's balls.

Never watched Thor because I think Thor is a rather lame Hero I mean really he's the litiral Thor? At least Wonder Woman is not a known Greek Demigod or anything.

Captain America the First Avenger is probably the only good one of the first generation Marvel movies before Avengers 1.

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Honestly, Dawn of Justice isn't going to fail because they don't have the lead up movies that Civil War/Avengers has.

Shit, I could have walked into the both Avengers movies without seeing a lick of any of the other movies and still enjoyed it. The problem is just that DC doesn't understand how to make a good movie regardless.

A bit to harsh saying that DC's upcoming movies will be bad basing soley on the one Man of Steel movie which really I still think people exaggerate how bad this movie is.

Considerin that there are worse Superman things than Man of Steel.

You're right. There have been worse Superman movies. But even at their worst they still knew who Superman was, and who he wasn't. And as much as Man of Steel wants to be an origin story, the broody grey silent judgey "alien" Superman is the character they want to portray. Just like the broody grey silent Batman. And the broody grey silent Wonderwoman. And the broody grey silent Aquaman.

At this point, Dawn of Justice is looking to be a myopic swamp of despair. When I go to a movie to see people in colorful pajamas punch the shit out of eachother, I want to be entertained. Not feel like I just accidentally stepped into a Hot Topic after the local middle school let out.

Yeah Superman At Earth's End certainly captured the essence of who Superman is

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WpE1MScgT8

And seriously have you forgotten the whole Jesus imagry they shoehorned into Superman?

And you are merely basing this on the color palette of the movie. We don't know how Wonder Woman and Aquaman is going to be portrayed in this movie.

 

[shintakie10]

As we get farther and farther into the MCU I've gotten more and more dissatisfied with them.

They're all really fun movies, but...thats it. You get a gem every once in a while (Winter Soldier), but for the most part they're just fun movies with loud explosions and witty banter. The villains are 100% inconsequential. You could just label the villains of the Iron Man movies as Tony Stark and you'd be far more correct than putting the actual villains they cast as the bad guys. Cap's villains are Nazis, just...Nazis doing Nazi things.

They're super fun movies, but I'm sick of the lack of substance. Civil War looks like it might actually have some for once. The idea that Cap is the straight up bad guy and making really bad decisions intrigues me. It doesn't seem to mesh well with the original Civil War storyline of everyone having valid points, but everyone being stupid about it, however I can deal with it if it actually makes for a movie that isn't just fun. However I can't shake the feeling that I'm just getting jerked around like I did with Age of Ultron. I was sold on a terrifying AI robot thing, created due to the hubris of Tony Stark, that just wrecks havoc on the world. Instead I got one very momentary glimpse of that (which we saw in every trailer btw), then James Spader being funny as Ultron and losing, constantly losing over and over.

Dawn of Justice looks like they're going all in with it not just being a big dumb action movie and I need superhero movies to be more than just big dumb action movies.

All told, I'm far more excited for Dawn of Justice than I am for Civil War, which is a huge shame because I actually enjoy the Captain America movies.

 

[Zetatrain]

Well I guess Civil War if only because Marvel has taken the time to build up to this moment whereas Dawn of Justice only has Man of Steel.

Now I don't actually think Dawn of Justice will suck but I will be surprised if DC's lack of build up for the movie doesn't end up overloading the film and hurting it in a significant way.

 

[KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime]

Never watched Thor because I think Thor is a rather lame Hero I mean really he's the litiral Thor? At least Wonder Woman is not a known Greek Demigod or anything.

Thor is literally supposed to be the Norse god of thunder. As characters go, he's pretty meh, but it's the way he interacts with mortals and such that make him fun. He's literally a stranger in a strange land.

Anyways OT:

Captain America: Civil War versus Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, are we seriously asking this question?

There is absolutely no way that Dawn of Justice is going to be anywhere near as good for a lot of reasons.
[ol]
[li]WB owns DC, Disney owns Marvel, the former has become known for bland over market tested crap, the latter is known for quality.[/li]
[li]Dawn of Justice is banking on a new Batman that we haven't met yet and a Superman the fans hate already.[/li]
[li]They botched Green Lantern so badly that they're going to have to reboot him.[/li]
[li]WB is more focused on making money by beating the corpse of DC, than they are with making quality content.[/li]
[li]WB has consistently failed to hit the mark since they lost Christian Bale as Batman and Christopher Nolan as the director.[/li]
[li]The lack of quality has seeped in to DC games with the last two Arkham games.[/li]
[li]The single biggest indictment though is the fact that WB has proven that they have absolutely no respect for the source material.[/li]
[li]Even people who don't like Marvel agree that the MCU has been doing a fantastic job and that they keep nailing the characters perfectly.[/li]
[/ol]

So the only conclusion I can get from this is: Captain America: Civil War is going to have to drop the ball epically and screw the pooch totally inside out to come out worse than Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. There's no two ways about this. WB has doubled down on the alienation they've already put fans through, they're don't care for quality so long as they get some money. Really the only hope that Dawn of Justice has, is that it might be an alright, maybe even good movie, but looking at the current trend from WB/DC, that's a tiny sliver of forlorn hope.

 

[JimB]

The single biggest indictment though is the fact that WB has proven that they have absolutely no respect for the source material.

Thank you for writing this line, because it gives me the perspective I need to finally articulate an idea I couldn't before:

DC is the Konami of comic books.

 

[CommanderL]

Marvel will win
they have shown love and respect for the charcters


man of steel was horrible


dc is doing super well on tv the flash is a kickass fun show

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

The single biggest indictment though is the fact that WB has proven that they have absolutely no respect for the source material.

Thank you for writing this line, because it gives me the perspective I need to finally articulate an idea I couldn't before:

DC is the Konami of comic books.

Wow that is the stupidist sentence I have ever seen in my life.

Warner Bros. is not going as far as stop making movies/TV shows etc. in favor of making solely Superman themed Slot Machines or anything

 

[Fox12]

Civil War will try and succeed to be mediocre. DC will try and fail to be genius.

I suppose it's really up to you, but I'll take DC's failures over Marvel's success any day. I give more credit to someone that tried and failed then someone that never even tried at all.

 

[Samtemdo8_v1legacy]

Never watched Thor because I think Thor is a rather lame Hero I mean really he's the litiral Thor? At least Wonder Woman is not a known Greek Demigod or anything.

Thor is literally supposed to be the Norse god of thunder. As characters go, he's pretty meh, but it's the way he interacts with mortals and such that make him fun. He's literally a stranger in a strange land.

Anyways OT:

Captain America: Civil War versus Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, are we seriously asking this question?

There is absolutely no way that Dawn of Justice is going to be anywhere near as good for a lot of reasons.
[ol]
[li]WB owns DC, Disney owns Marvel, the former has become known for bland over market tested crap, the latter is known for quality.[/li]
[li]Dawn of Justice is banking on a new Batman that we haven't met yet and a Superman the fans hate already.[/li]
[li]They botched Green Lantern so badly that they're going to have to reboot him.[/li]
[li]WB is more focused on making money by beating the corpse of DC, than they are with making quality content.[/li]
[li]WB has consistently failed to hit the mark since they lost Christian Bale as Batman and Christopher Nolan as the director.[/li]
[li]The lack of quality has seeped in to DC games with the last two Arkham games.[/li]
[li]The single biggest indictment though is the fact that WB has proven that they have absolutely no respect for the source material.[/li]
[li]Even people who don't like Marvel agree that the MCU has been doing a fantastic job and that they keep nailing the characters perfectly.[/li]
[/ol]

So the only conclusion I can get from this is: Captain America: Civil War is going to have to drop the ball epically and screw the pooch totally inside out to come out worse than Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice. There's no two ways about this. WB has doubled down on the alienation they've already put fans through, they're don't care for quality so long as they get some money. Really the only hope that Dawn of Justice has, is that it might be an alright, maybe even good movie, but looking at the current trend from WB/DC, that's a tiny sliver of forlorn hope.

Yeah WB clearly treats the DC source material with no respect, its as if the DCAU that was done by WARNER BROS. ANIMATION clearly neven cared about the:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXph0arElKs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUcKJflBG8Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQVC2zCC5qA

You clearly fail at history. Warner Bros. and DC have been married with each other for DECADES now. And DC comic books gave us the best comics in the 80s.

 

[Loonyyy]

Neither of them will handle any issues well. The Marvel films don't really do anything interesting about themes. They're just light and noise, and a lot of fun with fun characters. Daredevil and Jessica Jones do some interesting things, but the mainstream Marvel films are just really good entertainment. The closest thing to a theme worth exploring in there were a couple of throwaway lines by Banner in "The Avengers". The Winter Soldier didn't even begin to tackle any of the themes inherent in it's premise either. They're really enjoyable (Except the Winter Soldier, but I'm in the minority there), but they're not exactly asking you to think.

And after Man of Steel (Which I didn't think was that bad), I don't think we're going to see any sort of tackling of themes. Hell, even the trailer for the new one looks like we're getting some stupid misunderstanding or clash of egos to give us our inevitable Batman v Superman fight. I hope they don't try to tackle any themes to be honest. The Jesus analogues and talking about the impact Superman would have on Earth in the first film just dragged. And they're going to have to fit in introductions for Wonder Woman and Aquaman anyway. I don't think that the claims that Dawn of Justice looks to crowded hold up. The Avengers was more crowded, and not everyone saw all the introduction films. And Ultron was far more crowded, to the point where they cut material that actually was important to the film (Look up the stuff about Thor from AoU), and their future continuity. All so that we can have such wonderful heroes as "The Vision" (Who sucked), and Scarlett Witch and Quicksilver, who looked interesting, but don't actually do much (Especially the latter). Oh, and apparently the choice was between cutting Thor's stuff or the Farmhouse. You chose wrong Whedon. We didn't need Hawkeye's family, another nagging wife cliche, and it totally makes him look like a douche when looking back at The Avengers in hindsight.

I reckon Civil War will be more enjoyable, and I'm going to enjoy watching Iron Man punch Caps face all the way in, but I'd like to see what they've got Jesse Eisenberg doing in Dawn of Justice.

I don't see why we need to line them up against each other and treat it as some sort of competition though. They're both massive blockbusters, with massive advertising, aiming for massive viewership. Playing the teams is just playing right into that. This is just "Team Edward/Team Jacob" for kids who liked mashing action figures together. Derail all hype trains.

 

[Something Amyss]

Eh, I'm hoping the CGI is nice and the one-liners aren't too bad. I don't think we should expect too much from superhero movies.

I expect pretty much what I've got, really. The Marvel movies have ranged from watchable to fun. Which is why I think Civil War will do it better. Most of the DCU's movies have been outright bad or just joyless. At least I can expect to have some fun with Captain America.

DC is the Konami of comic books.

I don't know. Like, seriously, I'm not even a big fan of most DC characters, but they've done a pretty solid job with their animated series/movies. As a general rule, I'll take the DC animateds over the Marvel any day. I don't think Konami could manage that.

 

[Something Amyss]

Honestly, Dawn of Justice isn't going to fail because they don't have the lead up movies that Civil War/Avengers has.

Shit, I could have walked into the both Avengers movies without seeing a lick of any of the other movies and still enjoyed it. The problem is just that DC doesn't understand how to make a good movie regardless.

TBH, I'd kind of like to see them just do a Justice League movie without any build. Or I would, if I had faith in them. Which I don't.

(Cinematic Universe only, people, I just defended the AU)

I don't see why we need to line them up against each other and treat it as some sort of competition though. They're both massive blockbusters, with massive advertising, aiming for massive viewership. Playing the teams is just playing right into that. This is just "Team Edward/Team Jacob" for kids who liked mashing action figures together. Derail all hype trains.

Derailing trains? That sounds like supervillain talk! Who are you, really?

 

[runic knight]

Civil war, hands down. Civil war is following a lineage of successful and enjoyable actiony super hero films with great characterizations and even the worse films being better than anything involving superman on the big screen for decades. At worst, it will be a half-decent action popcorn flick with enjoyable known characters. At best, it will be a return to form for an avenger style movie after the semi-letdown of Age of Ultron.


Dc has been shaky as hell in terms of movies for years. Even the best received, the first two of the nolan batman series, are not that great in terms of being actiony super hero films, and they are jumping ship from what is even a mildly decent start point in order to go with an unknown batman. Superman's movies have been pretty shitty in getting the character right for far too long as well. Hopefully we wont end up with another Pa Kent situation, but I don't put it past the studios there. The result there will likely be characters known about, but not really grasped, defined, or even as consistent as they need to in the movie universe, trying to capture an overall theme while having to put up with more bloat and studio bullshit than spiderman 3 did by the sounds of it all. At that point it isn't even a competition between civil war and the DC film, it is "will the DC film even be half decent?". Honestly, I have no intent to see it in cinema as it is.

Comparing the two just based on what we know now is brutally unfair. Maybe DC will pull a miracle out of their hat and pull it all together, but judging from my experiences with both the company and super hero movies in general, I see "crash and burn" the far more likely possibility, followed by "mediocre attempt". "successful franchise start" is highly unlikely to me.

 

[Kameburger]

tl;dr Marvel is comfortable with their characters, their source material, and their tone. DC seems afraid and uncomfortable in all those areas. I'm gonna watch both, but I'm giddy about Civil War, and I'm going to see the other cause, it looks fun if nothing else.

I feel like for myself it's Civil War all the way. They have characters which they've fleshed out, they have great source material to draw from and nothing to prove with respect to beginning a franchise. I think this Batman v Superman film has a lot riding on it, and I worry that it's not going to be able to cover everything and it's all going to feel rough. I feel like Marvel so far has done a lot to make their tone work in many different situations, and I'm looking forward to see what they do here. DC/Warner Brothers I feel has an ok understanding of action, and I think even the movies they make are good, but I feel like when it comes to movies, they're really afraid of their source material (when it's not batman). Colorless isn't a word I'm super fond of but they're taking a bright and vibrant world and trying to grey out everything. Meanwhile the CW is managing to build an interesting TV universe without that much effort, just a love of the source material, and self awareness.

 

[KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime]

Yeah WB clearly treats the DC source material with no respect, its as if the DCAU that was done by WARNER BROS. ANIMATION clearly neven cared about the:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXph0arElKs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUcKJflBG8Q

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQVC2zCC5qA

You clearly fail at history. Warner Bros. and DC have been married with each other for DECADES now. And DC comic books gave us the best comics in the 80s.

I'm not going to argue against the quality of the Animated stuff up to even Young Justice, nor am I going to argue against the quality of DC comics in the 1980's. Heck I'll one up you. Batman Begins, The Dark Knight, The Dark Knight Rises along with most of the DC superhero movies made up into the 1990's were largely the gold standard of comic book superhero movies.

There's a problem there: All of this is in the past. Even if the comic books are still great, even if the animated stuff was still amazing... Which the latest runs in comic books has been pretty meh, and animation has devolved to Teen Titans Go!... Still, that's pretty niche, along with the fact that superhero cartoons and comic books are seen largely as kid stuff anyways.

What we're talking about here isn't really the vast sea of DC content, we're talking about the current DCCU, and it's crap. Total crap. Using the the supporting material that is really only followed by the hardcore fanbase is a fan-boy/girl argument. We're talking current DCCU versus current MCU, which if we're being honest, the current MCU absolutely obliterates the current DCCU. Man of Steel set the tone for the current DCCU especially the Justice League movies. That is not promising, considering that DC is coming late to the party, especially considering that the way they're doing it is a hollow attempt to cash in on Marvel's success.

 

[Zontar]

Civil War will try and succeed to be mediocre. DC will try and fail to be genius.

I suppose it's really up to you, but I'll take DC's failures over Marvel's success any day. I give more credit to someone that tried and failed then someone that never even tried at all.

But DC isn't trying, if they where neither Snyder, Goyer or Affleck would be taking part in the project, not with Affleck being an acting role. Don't mix up pretension with an attempt at being genius, or making a story based on one of the largest and loudest complains people had for the previous instalment as anything more the responding to what audiences want.

It'll be a very stylish movie, that's for sure (Snyder is taking part after all, style is his hallmark) but it most certainly will not be a substance filled movie, nor was there any hope it could have been a work of genius.

With the Russo brothers directing the movie, I'd say there's a good chance Civil War will actually be the one more likely end up as the work of genius we've been waiting for in the post-Dark Knight era of comic book movie adaptations.