Corporal Punishment: Have we let othe kid's down on discipline?
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First post, and not good with advice (and also not a parent, merely a 3,000-mile distant uncle.)
I figure since I'm not good at telling people what they should do, I instead should share a little anecdote.
I always felt proud of my elders mainly because me and my siblings grew up with 7 of them, and almost all of them taught by example. The oldest, least often parented by, but still most respected, was my great grandmother. She taught us all that niceness and doing what's proper and right are not just worth the world, but will win almost any battle you have; she also taught us that when those wouldn't do, being as stubborn as her would.
Next, Grandpa, was the cool elder. He hadn't just been a fighter pilot, he still is a pilot, and he had also been a police officer, a security guard, the head of his own security firm, and an instructor that now teaches people how to calmly keep flying and not crash when they can't see their wingtips, and occasionally just talks with CEOs and movie stars. Oddly enough, he taught us two lessons: humility, by him always being more proud of his family or friends' achievements than his own; second, again by his own example, that pictures can solve a lot more than bombs and guns.
Next, Nana, my Quebecois grandmother. Apart from teaching us the values of travel and learning at least one extra language, not to mention greetings and the like in at least 6, she taught us the sweet taste of both helping others, and rewards for doing well (mostly in the form of cookies and crepes.)
Number 4, Gramma was while we were growing up the nurse, farmer, and master chef. She taught us all the value of a hard-day's work, the importance of not just eating healthy but eating well, and has an almost encyclopedic knowledge both of cooking, and of treating various sicknesses, injuries and ailments. She also was more than happy to teach us if we helped, or help us when we got hurt or sick. More recently, she has taught us how to always be positive, even when we have trouble doing the things we love.
Grandad, her deep, deep South Georgian husband, was a great deal of things. He was, just to name a few things, a farmer's boy, an MP, a quartermaster, a fisherman, an amazing father, and an even better grandfather. He easily taught us never to give up, always to work hard; that sometimes the easy thing to do is run away, the right thing to do is step in, and the best thing to do is escape and then come back, and that these are different for different situations; that even if everyone is not equal now, they deserve to be treated equally, that as far as treating human beings like human beings, there is no rich, poor, black, white, Catholic, Baptist, Jewish, Muslim, nationality or language barrier; and that even when no one will listen to being told what to do, they will happily listen to a good story that will teach them that.
Next, Mom, was always the teacher. She taught us that sometimes you just have to suck it up. She taught us that sometimes you have to know to be quiet, sometimes you have to know to speak up, and sometimes you have to learn. She taught us that one of the most important things to do was keep learning, from all sides. She taught us that its best to use wit and humor because people will listen to that a lot better than criticism. She taught us to exercise our minds because they would outlast our bodies, and to exercise our bodies so they last longer. Well, she was a good mom, so she taught us a lot of things.
Last, there was Dad. We remembered him as the strong man, both in stature and character. Mainly because our fondest memories would include him carrying sometimes all 4 of us around the house at once. He taught us how to be comfortable no matter where we were. He taught us that the world around us deserves respect, even things as simple as plants we use for food (incidentally, he also taught us a lot of plants and animals we could use as food). He taught us how to smile when the storm is all around you. He taught us that laughter is the best medicine, and a kind word the second best. He taught us to stand up for others and for what's right even when we knew it would get ourselves hurt, and that standing up for ourselves sometimes means sitting down. He had studied martial arts, especially Judo, for a long time, and taught us how to fight, to know when to fight, not to use fighting words, to not respond to fighting words, to finish fights when we have to, but most of all, to feel ashamed of ourselves for not preventing fights. I know there are a million other things they taught us, but I'm sure I'm boring you with just the important ones for me.
Now, I realize anyone who put up with that wall of text enough to read this far will notice I didn't once mention whether any of them hit us while we were being raised, or used corporal punishment of any kind. I have a different question for you. Does that really matter?
I figure since I'm not good at telling people what they should do, I instead should share a little anecdote.
I always felt proud of my elders mainly because me and my siblings grew up with 7 of them, and almost all of them taught by example. The oldest, least often parented by, but still most respected, was my great grandmother. She taught us all that niceness and doing what's proper and right are not just worth the world, but will win almost any battle you have; she also taught us that when those wouldn't do, being as stubborn as her would.
Next, Grandpa, was the cool elder. He hadn't just been a fighter pilot, he still is a pilot, and he had also been a police officer, a security guard, the head of his own security firm, and an instructor that now teaches people how to calmly keep flying and not crash when they can't see their wingtips, and occasionally just talks with CEOs and movie stars. Oddly enough, he taught us two lessons: humility, by him always being more proud of his family or friends' achievements than his own; second, again by his own example, that pictures can solve a lot more than bombs and guns.
Next, Nana, my Quebecois grandmother. Apart from teaching us the values of travel and learning at least one extra language, not to mention greetings and the like in at least 6, she taught us the sweet taste of both helping others, and rewards for doing well (mostly in the form of cookies and crepes.)
Number 4, Gramma was while we were growing up the nurse, farmer, and master chef. She taught us all the value of a hard-day's work, the importance of not just eating healthy but eating well, and has an almost encyclopedic knowledge both of cooking, and of treating various sicknesses, injuries and ailments. She also was more than happy to teach us if we helped, or help us when we got hurt or sick. More recently, she has taught us how to always be positive, even when we have trouble doing the things we love.
Grandad, her deep, deep South Georgian husband, was a great deal of things. He was, just to name a few things, a farmer's boy, an MP, a quartermaster, a fisherman, an amazing father, and an even better grandfather. He easily taught us never to give up, always to work hard; that sometimes the easy thing to do is run away, the right thing to do is step in, and the best thing to do is escape and then come back, and that these are different for different situations; that even if everyone is not equal now, they deserve to be treated equally, that as far as treating human beings like human beings, there is no rich, poor, black, white, Catholic, Baptist, Jewish, Muslim, nationality or language barrier; and that even when no one will listen to being told what to do, they will happily listen to a good story that will teach them that.
Next, Mom, was always the teacher. She taught us that sometimes you just have to suck it up. She taught us that sometimes you have to know to be quiet, sometimes you have to know to speak up, and sometimes you have to learn. She taught us that one of the most important things to do was keep learning, from all sides. She taught us that its best to use wit and humor because people will listen to that a lot better than criticism. She taught us to exercise our minds because they would outlast our bodies, and to exercise our bodies so they last longer. Well, she was a good mom, so she taught us a lot of things.
Last, there was Dad. We remembered him as the strong man, both in stature and character. Mainly because our fondest memories would include him carrying sometimes all 4 of us around the house at once. He taught us how to be comfortable no matter where we were. He taught us that the world around us deserves respect, even things as simple as plants we use for food (incidentally, he also taught us a lot of plants and animals we could use as food). He taught us how to smile when the storm is all around you. He taught us that laughter is the best medicine, and a kind word the second best. He taught us to stand up for others and for what's right even when we knew it would get ourselves hurt, and that standing up for ourselves sometimes means sitting down. He had studied martial arts, especially Judo, for a long time, and taught us how to fight, to know when to fight, not to use fighting words, to not respond to fighting words, to finish fights when we have to, but most of all, to feel ashamed of ourselves for not preventing fights. I know there are a million other things they taught us, but I'm sure I'm boring you with just the important ones for me.
Now, I realize anyone who put up with that wall of text enough to read this far will notice I didn't once mention whether any of them hit us while we were being raised, or used corporal punishment of any kind. I have a different question for you. Does that really matter?
Yet you continue to ignore the fact that in many cases, especially gravity, the only evidence presented by the scientific method is observations or, anecdotal evidence. Yeah, you don't think it's anecdotal cuz it's made by scientists, funny thing is, scientists are people too. Let's just agree to disagree on this one.Blitzwing said:
How are kids "out of control"?
Is it because you see them acting up more often now? Well guess what, when you were a kid, you were the one acting up, you or your friends. And of course, you might say "Oh, I was a saint!". Almost every kid thinks that. Kids are absolutely wonderful at justifying things, and then forgetting about them.
Is it because you see them acting up more often now? Well guess what, when you were a kid, you were the one acting up, you or your friends. And of course, you might say "Oh, I was a saint!". Almost every kid thinks that. Kids are absolutely wonderful at justifying things, and then forgetting about them.
However, the thing you are most disregarding here is: That anecdotal evidence? Yeah, in science? It's an experience usually experienced by more than one individual observing at the same time that the phenomenon occurs. Not just the mere voice of one person, but several persons with intimate knowledge of the topic in which to debate and verify between personal observations of the phenomenon and come to a relatively working conclusion until further experimentation.spartan231490 said:
OT: Lot's of rose-tinted glasses in this thread, apparently. Violence against children does not make your children more obedient in a good way, it tends to make them fear you in a negative manner and begin to view your love as something that fleets and returns with every strike. In which case, many children whom experience this tend to be in abusive relationships themselves where they will strike their significant other if they say something they don't agree with, attempting to assert obedience like their parents taught them through their own actions to resort to.
Children are a far varied sort, and not one sort of punishment is ever an end-all of bad behavior from them.
Go play a round of any online game and tell me parents are doing the right thing, you'll never be able to honestly say it. My kids are going to learn what respect and discipline are before they'll ever be able to go online. I'll NEVER allow my kids to act as ridiculous as the people online today. First sign of troll/flame I get their net is going off for a week, and that's if I didn't hear them raging over a mic. ESRB isn't going to rule my parenting, neither is the government.