Crossbow's......... Really that effective ?

[Carlan]

I just want to point out that I have a hard time seeing a medieval army that used "green" soldiers. More or less every respectable army during the middle ages uppholded a tradition of long training, even for crossbow-archers, which for the record were supperior in defending possitions like towers and fortresses.

Just a note on medieval armies: pretty much all of Europe that practiced feudal law had no standing, professional armies. Most "soldiers" were conscripts brought on by lower nobles obligated to provide them. Only mercenaries and nobles were truly professional soldiers, generally speaking.

The fact of the matter is that crossbows require less training then a longbow and packed a heftier punch*. Longbows were capable of greater range and faster firing rate but required many years of training**. And on the Pope banning crossbows, that only applied to their use against Christians. Crossbows became a common weapon for infantry during the crusades because Papal law dictated that they were permissible for use against Muslims.

*Any game (primarily tabletop RPGs) which allows use of poisoned crossbow bolts is ridiculous; the projectile doesn't remain in the body by-and-large thus negating the effects of the poison.

**English peasants, as has been mentioned, were required by law to train with the longbow. In fact, balls were outlawed as their recreational use was seen to detract from longbow training.

 

[UltraParanoia]

I have a random question, fallout 3*, a shooting game that included swords. No Bows.

Did the people of post apocalyptic retro DC not hunt with bows? Seriously, I want a bow in games like that so I can go Ted Nugent on the world when I've run through stuff to do and am trying to amuse myself.

As far as crossbows go, I could care less, I'll stick with a recurve and a rifle for all my killing needs.


*It should also be included in the list of games that include one, the dart gun was kind of a crossbow.

 

[Spiner909]

Only if you aren't using the horrible BioShock crossbow.

 

[Eclectic Dreck]

The crossbow was fantastically effective during the period. In terms of difficulty of manufacture, they are more complex than a recurve bow since most crossbows require the use of at least some complex machines in order to function. A quick list of pro's and cons (with respect to the period weapons)

Pro:
Highest potential force applied to the projectle of any man-portable projectile weapon
Easiest ranged weapon system to use
Able to defeat armor within certain ranges assuming proper ammunition is used

Con:
Less accurate than other systems thanks to a shorter projectile
Higher cost of manufacture
Lower rate of fire

On the whole it balances out. Any recurve bow takes a fair amount of practice in order to be combat effective with, while a crossbow can be used effectively after a few days practice at best. This more or less cancles out the cost of manufacture since training a soldier is often the more expensive part of sending them into battle. The rate of fire is a notable issue certainly, but the relative ease with which a proper bolt can pierce the armor of the day generally makes up for the problem. The force the weapon applies is all thanks to the clockwork mechanism that allows a user to gradually store energy in the weapon thanks to the use of a crank (at the most complex) or the ability to use both arms and legs in the drawing of the weapon (rather than simply the arms for a recurve bow). Unfortunately, the force applied to the weapon, when combined with the nature of the crossbows of the period simply meant that the projectile generally wouldn't leave the weapon in a fully predictable fashion meaning all but the best crafted weapons featured questionable accuracy.

 

[Altorin]

It takes skill to use making it only useful for the person who has extreme training in it.

I thought one of the big pros to the crossbow was the fact that it could be given to people with little to no training and have them point it and pull the trigger thus killing whoever is directly in front of them. Sure you're not gonna be an expert marksman with it without experience and practice, but that goes for pretty much any weapon, even guns.

Regardless though, I don't know where you get this idea that crossbows are overhyped, most games and movies I've seen treat them as they are, a projectile weapon with often more force than a normal bow, but with a slower firing rate.

Well in my experiance and knowledgde, the crossbow takes skill because when I used it I found nyslef time after time missing the target, but don't judge me as a ametuer I saw a expert bowman use the crossbow and he himself found it hard to get a decent hit to where he aimed.

the point of the crossbows ease of use is that it's not tiring to use and it's actually easier to aim then an arrow. the longbows of the time took an incredibly strong arm to wield, whereas a crossbow could be given to some old man when you conscript him into your army.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

So why does the Crossbow still get alot of hype and love ?

It's one of the few weapons that can be carried easily and still put a bolt through (and I mean THROUGH) someone's ribcage. The Longbow has a greater range and penetration, but: like the shotgun (which has similar disadvatages) anything you can shout at, you can kill.

I advise not sawing off the end though.

 

[Beastialman]

personally I like crossbows, while I know they aren't as effective as a gun, they have more class and style.

 

[NeutralDrow]

Depends. Historical context? Hell yes, they were really that effective. They required minimal training, weren't too awkward to use, and at the right range could punch through armor. I'm pretty sure the Vatican considered outlawing them once.

Then they were eventually outclassed by guns.

 

[Sneaklemming]

It works better than a regular bow.

And it's "bolts" not "arrows"

Dont be silly.

The Longbowman was the machine gun of the Dark Ages. Seriously. Nothing came close to the damage a longbow could deal, and the speed of this firing, until, well, a machine gun.

 

[Zersy]

I would like to say thanks for all of your explanations.

Life has made a lil more sense now.

 

[Player 2]

It works better than a regular bow.

And it's "bolts" not "arrows"

Dont be silly.

The Longbowman was the machine gun of the Dark Ages. Seriously. Nothing came close to the damage a longbow could deal, and the speed of this firing, until, well, a machine gun.

You don't need to go as far as a machine gun, I'm pretty sure that even a bolt action would be much faster than a long bow. The point of getting rid of traditional bows wasn't that the crossbows had better range or speed, it was just that the training time you had to give soldiers was so drastically reduced and its armour piercing abilities made it a better weapon. Longbows also took a lot of muscle to draw where crossbows didn't.

 

[Sneaklemming]

It works better than a regular bow.

And it's "bolts" not "arrows"

Dont be silly.

The Longbowman was the machine gun of the Dark Ages. Seriously. Nothing came close to the damage a longbow could deal, and the speed of this firing, until, well, a machine gun.

You don't need to go as far as a machine gun, I'm pretty sure that even a bolt action would be much faster than a long bow. The point of getting rid of traditional bows wasn't that the crossbows had better range or speed, it was just that the training time you had to give soldiers was so drastically reduced and its armour piercing abilities made it a better weapon. Longbows also took a lot of muscle to draw where crossbows didn't.

You are right on the money. Cept Longbow men could keep actually fire faster then a bolt action rifle. Remember reload times and all. Also it took muscle to reload a crossbow. (I think)

 

[TheNamlessGuy]

DELETED

 

[Sneaklemming]

Dont be silly.

The Longbowman was the machine gun of the Dark Ages. Seriously. Nothing came close to the damage a longbow could deal, and the speed of this firing, until, well, a machine gun.

I said regular bow, not longbow

but I was talking about longbows....?

 

[TheNamlessGuy]

DELETED

 

[Sneaklemming]

but I was talking about longbows....?

But I wasn't, so I wasn't being "silly"

I can still talk about longbows right? I mean they were real. Honest.

 

[TheNamlessGuy]

DELETED

 

[Sneaklemming]

I can still talk about longbows right? I mean they were real. Honest.

Yes, but without trying to prove me wrong with the wrong subject.

Thank you

I um... apologise for calling you 'silly'.

Theres really no need to be so sensitive.

 

[TheNamlessGuy]

DELETED