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[PunkyMcGee]

i took some audio production classes a while back and found the class really boring. so my question is after you understand the basics of how the chorus knob works and the like, does it become more fun?
and a follow up: what does the job market look like? would i be able to find work if i got the degree?

 

[Ham_authority95]

The only way you can start up for less than $1500 would be to burn onto CD-R, or just deal exclusively through the Internet.

How much would you reccomend doing either of those things?

If you're only doing very tiny quantities, CD-Rs are great. Get a stack of CD-Rs, a colour printer and you theoretically don't need pressing plants at all. Where this doesn't work so well is when you start dealing in larger quantities, creating triple-digits of CDs isn't viable by CD-R simply because of cost. Via the improvised production line method stated earlier it's sill possible, but there's no point actually doing it because it works out more expensive than just getting a pressing plant to do the work once you get into those sort of quantities.

Internet's fine, after all it's the way young people buy (and not buy) music now. Also there's no manufacture cost which is great, and there's no point worrying about piracy here as opposed to CD-R because it'll get pirated straight away no matter what the format. However lack of physical product still puts off some buyers, mainly older ones who see MP3s as another step in the wrong direction after CDs replaced vinyl as the format of choice. I use Internet as an option for my customers but I make sure there's a physical product too. Some people even buy both...

So how would I get in contact with a printing plant?

 

[BonsaiK]

So how would I get in contact with a printing plant?

The same way you get in contact with any business. Give them a call or an email, tell them you've got some product you want to press, ask for a quote, a turnaround time and what their format requirements are.

 

[Ham_authority95]

So how would I get in contact with a printing plant?

The same way you get in contact with any business. Give them a call or an email, tell them you've got some product you want to press, ask for a quote, a turnaround time and what their format requirements are.

Got it. I'll ask any more questions I have about this when they come to me...

 

[BonsaiK]

i took some audio production classes a while back and found the class really boring. so my question is after you understand the basics of how the chorus knob works and the like, does it become more fun?
and a follow up: what does the job market look like? would i be able to find work if i got the degree?

I assume you're talking about the chorus DSP effect. Chorus is actually a really short delay effect. When you say "chorus knob", most chorus units have more than one knob so I'm not sure what you mean. If you're only talking about one solitary knob on an amplifier then it probably controls the volume level of the delayed signal.

Chorus isn't really much of a "fun" effect, the effect of chorus is meant to be reasonably subtle, it's like a slight "thickening" of the sound. The most fun you can have with chorus is to buy a stereo chorus pedal (which sends the original signal through one output and the delayed signal through the other) and use it to split your signal into two different amplfiers with different settings, that can be cool. It's a fairly mundane effect apart from that.

Audio production in general, I can do it for days straight, and it's fun to get a good result, and that good result then makes you feel good, but the process itself is generally not fun times. Getting what's in my head and translating it into an audio product is often quite arduous and unenjoyable. I like the creative aspect of it but I don't really like the technical aspect of it, I understand it because I have to, to get the results that I want, not because the technicalities fascinate me. I do know people who enjoy the technical part of it, but those people are freaks, they're like the audio industry equivalent of the kind of people who enjoy installing Linux.

The music industry's been on a downturn that started about a decade before the GFC kicked into gear, and isn't showing any signs of recovery yet. Also, like any "glamour" industry there are a lot more people who want to work in it than there are places to work in it.

 

[MisterGobbles]

Going off of the whole label thing, how much of the profits would you want your label to take?

All of it until expenses in manufacture are repaid (which isn't that many sales tbh), then I'll split 50/50 with the artist. That's very generous, and that's because the label I work for is small. Larger labels don't have a profit-share anything even remotely that good, the artist would be extremely fortunate to get 10%.

That is rather generous...I expected that independent labels would give slightly more than the major labels. How many sales does it normally take to make back the manufacture cost?

 

[BonsaiK]

Going off of the whole label thing, how much of the profits would you want your label to take?

All of it until expenses in manufacture are repaid (which isn't that many sales tbh), then I'll split 50/50 with the artist. That's very generous, and that's because the label I work for is small. Larger labels don't have a profit-share anything even remotely that good, the artist would be extremely fortunate to get 10%.

That is rather generous...I expected that independent labels would give slightly more than the major labels. How many sales does it normally take to make back the manufacture cost?

Depends how many you made and how much you're selling it for. Say we made 1000 CDs that cost us $1 each (just to keep the math simple for this example), so we spent $1000, and we're pricing them at $20, then that means you only need to sell 50 to break even, the rest is profit. However, the retailer/distributor takes a cut, so you might actually have to sell 70 or whatever. It's a fairly simple meths equation, it's the same as selling anything else.

 

[PunkyMcGee]

i took some audio production classes a while back and found the class really boring. so my question is after you understand the basics of how the chorus knob works and the like, does it become more fun?
and a follow up: what does the job market look like? would i be able to find work if i got the degree?

I assume you're talking about the chorus DSP effect. Chorus is actually a really short delay effect. When you say "chorus knob", most chorus units have more than one knob so I'm not sure what you mean. If you're only talking about one solitary knob on an amplifier then it probably controls the volume level of the delayed signal.
*sniped*

what i was trying to say was, that the class was about trying to make the effects from scratch (take the sound, Chanel it through this delay, convert it through such and such distortion, before completing the circuit. ugh) rather than simply using the tools in Garage Band.

as for pat 2 your trying to say yes lean it for myself but a degree from a community college is as about as worthless as the paper its written on, (i know that's a cynical way to put it, but i think its funny) its more about what you know, and who you know. Right?

 

[BonsaiK]

i took some audio production classes a while back and found the class really boring. so my question is after you understand the basics of how the chorus knob works and the like, does it become more fun?
and a follow up: what does the job market look like? would i be able to find work if i got the degree?

I assume you're talking about the chorus DSP effect. Chorus is actually a really short delay effect. When you say "chorus knob", most chorus units have more than one knob so I'm not sure what you mean. If you're only talking about one solitary knob on an amplifier then it probably controls the volume level of the delayed signal.
*sniped*

what i was trying to say was, that the class was about trying to make the effects from scratch (take the sound, Chanel it through this delay, convert it through such and such distortion, before completing the circuit. ugh) rather than simply using the tools in Garage Band.

as for pat 2 your trying to say yes lean it for myself but a degree from a community college is as about as worthless as the paper its written on, (i know that's a cynical way to put it, but i think its funny) its more about what you know, and who you know. Right?

Well, it helps to have an understanding of the physics of sound before you actually try to make sound work. Knowing why something works is important, because then when it doesn't work the way you anticipated, you can usually improvise a solution. Garage Band and plug-in DSP for ProTools etc is a no-brainer when it works, it's when things don't go as planned that you need the technical knowledge.

It does sound like your audio course is boring though. I hope at the very least they let you play with a real recording studio.

Yes the degree is worthless, but that's missing the point. At the college you're meeting a whole bunch of people who are into the same shit you are and taking an audio course. What a great place to meet new people who have cool, creative ideas. The qualification isn't worth a damn but I still met people who changed my life and advanced my career in spades through the audio course that I did 15 years ago, and because of that I have no regrets and I think it's absolutely worth doing. If nothing else, studying beats working!

 

[Ham_authority95]

If I'm recording an electric guitar, should I mic the amp or record directly into a computer?

Excellant thread. As an aspiring professional, I have many questions about the music industry.

Unlike a lot of other instruments, guitars are designed to be heard with the distinctive colouration that amplification provides. The only time I wouldn't mic an amplifier is if I wanted a 100% completely clean sound AND the amp I was using sounded like rubbish, but even a small amp can get a good sound if you place your mic correctly. Especially if the amp has valves in it, you MUST mic it. There's no golden rule for micing that works in every situation, but as a general rule you want a dynamic mic (I recommend the Shure SM57 to mic guitars) as close to the speaker as you can get it, but not pointing dead at the middle of the speaker, off to the side of the cone a little, or on an angle, is usually a much nicer sound. Experiment with placement and find out what sounds best. And don't be fooled into thinking that small amp=small sound, no way. You'd be amazed at some of the classic metal albums which were recorded using amps smaller than the screen you are reading this on.

Feel free to ask more questions if you want, that's what this thread is for. Read back through it first though, as many questions have probably been answered.

Oh balls, my band and I recorded the guitars for our demo D.I.(not the bass, just the guitars) because we were too lazy and wanted to watch shitty movies while we did it.

Should we bother to re-record it or leave it as it is(since its a demo and sound quality isn't the biggest thing)?

 

[Ham_authority95]

If I'm recording an electric guitar, should I mic the amp or record directly into a computer?

Excellant thread. As an aspiring professional, I have many questions about the music industry.

Unlike a lot of other instruments, guitars are designed to be heard with the distinctive colouration that amplification provides. The only time I wouldn't mic an amplifier is if I wanted a 100% completely clean sound AND the amp I was using sounded like rubbish, but even a small amp can get a good sound if you place your mic correctly. Especially if the amp has valves in it, you MUST mic it. There's no golden rule for micing that works in every situation, but as a general rule you want a dynamic mic (I recommend the Shure SM57 to mic guitars) as close to the speaker as you can get it, but not pointing dead at the middle of the speaker, off to the side of the cone a little, or on an angle, is usually a much nicer sound. Experiment with placement and find out what sounds best. And don't be fooled into thinking that small amp=small sound, no way. You'd be amazed at some of the classic metal albums which were recorded using amps smaller than the screen you are reading this on.

Feel free to ask more questions if you want, that's what this thread is for. Read back through it first though, as many questions have probably been answered.

I think we also did another thing wrong, as well(if your post way back in the thread about recording is to be believed)

Instead of getting the 8-track recorder like I said we would, we got a mixing board and plugged it straight into the computer. Is this a "bad" thing?

 

[BonsaiK]

If I'm recording an electric guitar, should I mic the amp or record directly into a computer?

Excellant thread. As an aspiring professional, I have many questions about the music industry.

Unlike a lot of other instruments, guitars are designed to be heard with the distinctive colouration that amplification provides. The only time I wouldn't mic an amplifier is if I wanted a 100% completely clean sound AND the amp I was using sounded like rubbish, but even a small amp can get a good sound if you place your mic correctly. Especially if the amp has valves in it, you MUST mic it. There's no golden rule for micing that works in every situation, but as a general rule you want a dynamic mic (I recommend the Shure SM57 to mic guitars) as close to the speaker as you can get it, but not pointing dead at the middle of the speaker, off to the side of the cone a little, or on an angle, is usually a much nicer sound. Experiment with placement and find out what sounds best. And don't be fooled into thinking that small amp=small sound, no way. You'd be amazed at some of the classic metal albums which were recorded using amps smaller than the screen you are reading this on.

Feel free to ask more questions if you want, that's what this thread is for. Read back through it first though, as many questions have probably been answered.

Oh balls, my band and I recorded the guitars for our demo D.I.(not the bass, just the guitars) because we were too lazy and wanted to watch shitty movies while we did it.

Should we bother to re-record it or leave it as it is(since its a demo and sound quality isn't the biggest thing)?

Yeah you could leave it if you wanted and it sounds good enough. Recording DI guitar is generally not a good idea but it CAN work, it's just a lot harder to make it sound good. Depending on what the demo is for it may not matter, if it's just to get gigs and so forth I'd leave it as is as long as it's a reasonable representation of your live sound.

(On the other hand DIed bass usually sounds fantastic)

 

[BonsaiK]

Instead of getting the 8-track recorder like I said we would, we got a mixing board and plugged it straight into the computer. Is this a "bad" thing?

No, that's fine. In fact that's the more common way it's done these days, as most computers can record multiple tracks without the need for a dedicated "multitrack machine".

 

[Ham_authority95]

If I'm recording an electric guitar, should I mic the amp or record directly into a computer?

Excellant thread. As an aspiring professional, I have many questions about the music industry.

Unlike a lot of other instruments, guitars are designed to be heard with the distinctive colouration that amplification provides. The only time I wouldn't mic an amplifier is if I wanted a 100% completely clean sound AND the amp I was using sounded like rubbish, but even a small amp can get a good sound if you place your mic correctly. Especially if the amp has valves in it, you MUST mic it. There's no golden rule for micing that works in every situation, but as a general rule you want a dynamic mic (I recommend the Shure SM57 to mic guitars) as close to the speaker as you can get it, but not pointing dead at the middle of the speaker, off to the side of the cone a little, or on an angle, is usually a much nicer sound. Experiment with placement and find out what sounds best. And don't be fooled into thinking that small amp=small sound, no way. You'd be amazed at some of the classic metal albums which were recorded using amps smaller than the screen you are reading this on.

Feel free to ask more questions if you want, that's what this thread is for. Read back through it first though, as many questions have probably been answered.

Oh balls, my band and I recorded the guitars for our demo D.I.(not the bass, just the guitars) because we were too lazy and wanted to watch shitty movies while we did it.

Should we bother to re-record it or leave it as it is(since its a demo and sound quality isn't the biggest thing)?

Yeah you could leave it if you wanted and it sounds good enough. Recording DI guitar is generally not a good idea but it CAN work, it's just a lot harder to make it sound good. Depending on what the demo is for it may not matter, if it's just to get gigs and so forth I'd leave it as is as long as it's a reasonable representation of your live sound.

(On the other hand DIed bass usually sounds fantastic)

Okay, thanks.

 

[silentrob77]

I just started a small time (ish) industry job last year here in Toronto, Canada.
I know everyone has to pay their dues in this industry, and I'm still young so thats fine by me.
I was just wondering what you started out doing to "pay your dues" and if you ever felt like you would never get out of the entry level hole no matter how hard you worked, or how many people you met.

Cheers!

 

[BonsaiK]

I just started a small time (ish) industry job last year here in Toronto, Canada.
I know everyone has to pay their dues in this industry, and I'm still young so thats fine by me.
I was just wondering what you started out doing to "pay your dues" and if you ever felt like you would never get out of the entry level hole no matter how hard you worked, or how many people you met.

Cheers!

To me this is a weird question. I think the concept of "paying your dues" is actually a bunch of nonsense, and it's something I've never even thought about. I also don't really distinguish between "entry level" or any other type of job, I only really look at my job(s) this way:

* Am I enjoying what I'm doing?
* Am I good at it?
* Am I making enough money to live?

If those criteria aren't being satisfied, then I have to change something. If they are, then I don't have to change anything. That's really all there is. I take what I do extremely seriously - what other people think about what I do, I don't take that seriously at all.

Also a lot of people I know who have been in the industry for years and "paid their dues" I have absolutely no respect for because I know that they're con artists or doing shady things or whatever. So the whole concept of "time spent doing this shit = respect" is quite frankly a joke to me. I'd rather judge someone on their actual merits, not some silly "I've been around the traps" perception.

 

[Ham_authority95]

How often have you put ads in the newspaper stating: "Guitarist looking for a band"? Have you ever had to?

 

[Anarchemitis]

On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being Michael Jackson dying, how scandalous would it be if an Opera singer was discovered to have been using Autotune?

 

[BonsaiK]

How often have you put ads in the newspaper stating: "Guitarist looking for a band"? Have you ever had to?

I've never had to advertise anything this way. Never done it in newspapers, or on those bulletin board things you see in music stores. If you've got enough of a network built up you simply don't need to do this - instead you just cherry-pick the musicians you want to work with from out of your existing friends. I'd rather do it this way than advertise and get some person in the band who is an unknown quantity - it's better the devil you know etc...

 

[BonsaiK]

On a scale of 1-10 with 10 being Michael Jackson dying, how scandalous would it be if an Opera singer was discovered to have been using Autotune?

It's a bit of a redundant question because opera singers would never use Auto-tune simply because opera singing technique includes a bit of natural pitch variance or vibrato, that Auto-tune would destroy. In other words, opera singers are trained to deliberately sing a little bit out of tune, and so any Auto-tune would ruin the point of singing in an operatic style in the first place. As soon as you turn that plug-in on you're basically not singing opera anymore.

It's also a bit of a murky question - because are you talking about using "soft" Auto-tune to fix bum notes so nobody notices (i.e a session singer fluffed a note so you patch it up) or are you talking about using Auto-tune in a "hard" way as a deliberately stylised vocal effect (i.e the way Ke$ha, Lady Gaga, Kanye West, T-Pain, Brokencyde etc use it)? The first one doesn't apply to opera because the smoothing over would also kill the operatic vibrato, thus destroying the point, and the second one also doesn't apply to opera because it's just not part of the genre. Even in modern stage and screen stuff like "Repo: The Genetic Opera" there's still no Auto-tune and the singers (including Paris Hilton!) are using their natural voices. It's just not part of the style.

Opera singers have been caught miming though. I remember a huge controversy a few years back when Pavarotti was busted miming a gig, and yes that did cause a 10-scale controversy! I guess what I'm trying to say is that people making a fuss about using Auto-tune to hide people's inadequate real voices is bullshit, because there are far more effective ways to do this. Auto-tune is actually the worst way you can do this, because as soon as you switch it on, people think you're hiding something, therefore the only people who tend to use Auto-tune a lot are those who feel that they have nothing to hide anyway. It's being used these days so much because the sound is trendy, not because it glosses over bad notes (although it does that too, but that's incidental). If people really cared so badly about bad notes they could have used vocoders all this time, which essentially have an identical function, they're just triggered manually.