current souls fans, would an easier souls game make you not want to play it

[00slash00]

okay we are all very familiar with the controversy over dark souls 2. based on the information we have been given about how they want to make it more of an action game, want to limit the amount of choices you have to make, and seemingly want to make a linear story that you dont really have as much control over, a lot of souls fans are upset. even if they dont include an easy mode, those changes are going to make dark souls 2 extremely different from dark sols or demons souls. it would be a very big change for the core fans of the series (almost like turning an isometric, strategic turn-based rpg, into a first person shooter). but i have to wonder...even if they just turned dark souls 2 into a linear story driven action game set in the dark souls universe, would you play it? i would be very sad if the format of the sols games i have loved playing for so long, was changed so fundamentally, but im not sure i can honestly say i wouldnt play it. i can still see it being fun, but a very different kind of fun. would you give it a chance or would you just write it off as a failure?

 

[krazykidd]

Two things i'm worried about .

A) allowing people playing on easy mode( if there is one ) , to interact with everyone else online . Now this is for balancing reasons . If i invite a guy playing on easy and he can't carry his weigh ( because his difficulty gets changed to normal), it sucks for both me and him . Now if i join a guy , and my difficulty tuens to easy and i blaze though it , again sucks for both of us . OR of i invade someone on easy mode , they are likely to be less able to defeat me and thus gives me the advantage . Or inversely , getting invaded by someone in easy mode the same level as me but with better gear because grinding gear is easier and such , giving me me a disadvantage .

And B) If the say screw difficulty levels we are making the entire game easier . I want more bone crushing difficulty . I want it harder , tougher . I want MORE dark souls . Not less , i can't go from something hard and satisfying to something easy . It just wouldn't be the same .

 

[LetalisK]

Two things i'm worried about .

A) allowing people playing on easy mode( if there is one ) , to interact with everyone else online . Now this is for balancing reasons . If i invite a guy playing on easy and he can't carry his weigh ( because his difficulty gets changed to normal), it sucks for both me and him . Now if i join a guy , and my difficulty tuens to easy and i blaze though it , again sucks for both of us . OR of i invade someone on easy mode , they are likely to be less able to defeat me and thus gives me the advantage . Or inversely , getting invaded by someone in easy mode the same level as me but with better gear because grinding gear is easier and such , giving me me a disadvantage .

And B) If the say screw difficulty levels we are making the entire game easier . I want more bone crushing difficulty . I want it harder , tougher . I want MORE dark souls . Not less , i can't go from something hard and satisfying to something easy . It just wouldn't be the same .

If they were to allow an easy mode, I can't imagine they would allow those playing on easy to interact with those playing on normal, let alone making it easier across the board.

For the OPs question, I would give it a chance. Simply writing it off as a failure before even trying it is the act of a fool.

 

[Windcaler]

At the end of the day it really depends on how these new directors handle the game. For me, the fun of dark souls doesnt come from any one thing. Its many things that form a "perfect storm" of excellent gameplay that have kept me engaged for over 30 playthroughs (probably a lot more then that but I lost count around 30 back in april).

For me, I love the blank slate allowing me to roleplay a character of my choosing whether they be a Carim Inquisitioner who becomes a Darkmoon blade, meeting out justice like he did before he became undead or a nihilistic great swamp dweller who became a Darkwraith to pillage humanity from others and use it in his own way.

I also like how puzzling and mysterious the world is, I love how even the monsters are characters with their own motivations. Like Ceaseless discharge the son of the witch of Izalith who leaves you completely alone till you take his sisters stuff. Or how about Priscilla who is possibly exiled, trapped, or maybe even hiding in the painted world all because of what she is. The best part about the lore is how there are just unanswered questions allowing us to interpret characters how we desire, for example I personally think that Kaathe and Frampt are the of the same creature and that they're playing both sides, putting themselves into a winning position whether the chosen undead links the fire or brings the age of dark.

Then I like the weighty combat. Skyrim really drove home how bad RPG combat gets because there seems to be no weight behind anything. Theres no counter, dodge, parry, riposte style play its just run in swinging till something dies. The weighty combat is whats most engaging about the gameplay, how every weapon fucntions just a little bit differently and has its advantages and disadvantages. They encourage mastering the chosen weapon rather then just wild swings

I also love the level design. How places just give me a feeling that they could be real places and arent linear but yet arent to open either.

Finally theres the difficulty which is the least important in my list but still vitally important. It remains tough but fair. Exactly what it should be

This combination of designs are the things that makes dark souls one of my favorite games of all time. If they get messed with then the games going to be far less engaging for me but thats not to say it wont be a good game, it just wont be what dark souls is now

To be fair there are other games that completely changed themselves and worked out well. Fallout being the biggest one I can think of off the top of my head. It used to be a top down strategy game but today its a pretty spectacular FPS with the same theme. That said, Im still extremely concerned about the approach the new directors claim theyre taking. I dont know that the game will be better or worse, at this point I can only go by what my gut and personal tastes tell me and they say its probably not going to be as good.

It can also be said that Fromsoft love to troll. The pendant fiasco likely being the biggest red herring in gaming history. I would not be surprised if all of this turns out to be them just playing a prank on us and Dark souls 2 being everything and more that the Dark souls community wants. In fact I would even prefer that over what the alternative seems to be

At the end of the day difficulty is the least important characteristic of dark souls and while Im all for better tutorials and better explanations of covenants and items making the game more accessible through a menu option hurts the experience and makes me less enthused about the game

 

[Troublesome Lagomorph]

No, because the appeal of the Souls series is its difficulty.

 

[ultrachicken]

No, because the appeal of the Souls series is its difficulty.

Not the smooth action or the interesting settings or the foreboding atmosphere or the character growth? The Souls series is carried by more than just its difficulty, but its difficulty is what elevates it to godhood.

If they made a good action RPG, so long as it's not so easy it can't be enjoyed, then I might still play it. However, if they make Dark Souls 2 significantly easier, I will be seriously disappointed.

 

[Smolderin]

It probably would. Though that would be in part due to my over attachment to the current state of Dark Souls. If they made the game easier, I would probably have such a bad taste in my mouth that I would voice my displeasure by not giving the publishers the money. While it's true that it's not just the difficulty that makes Dark Souls great, it is at its core, the reason why it's Dark Souls. Easier difficulty = identity loss. That said, if they decided to change the title and make it unrelated to the Dark Souls universe, then I sure as hell would be more inclined to buy it since the attachment aspect is virtually rendered non-existence. Just goes to show that the title of game means more than people think.

 

[Signa]

(Why is it that of all the thread in the last week, the ones based around a game I've never played are the ones I feel most inclined to respond to?)

I have a feeling OP that we are going to see something similar to what I went through with The Elder Scrolls series. Everyone who enjoyed Dark Souls (or my Morrowind) is going to eventually break down and buy Dark Souls 2 (my Oblivion) because they are craving more of the same that they enjoyed in the previous game. They are going to be let down and complain a lot after playing it a bit because it's not what they really wanted. The developers are going to see the extra sales they pulled from the mainstreaming, and are going to release Dark Souls 3 with the same design philosophy as DS2, while telling the fans of DS1 that things are better (Skyrim). At that point, we're going to see a split in the fanbase between those that enjoyed DS2, those that keep coming back like beaten dogs, and those that said "fool me once..." like I did with Skyrim.

Or just maybe we will see them pull off an amazing game and properly cater to both groups, but the odds are not with them on that. I've seen too many good games go bad because of trying to cash in on a market the originals weren't designed for. Megaman on the iPad anyone?

 

[NightHawk21]

Let me preface this by saying I haven't played the games yet.

For the issue at hand, I don't think anyone has a valid argument for them not including an easy mode as long as its done well. There were a couple valid points raised about stuff like not allowing for easy players to interact with normal characters (and vice-versa), but they mostly point seem to get at the idea that if easy is to exist it should be a separate entity and not affect their difficult version.

Those that are making the argument that no, because dark souls is supposed to be hard, or some other nonsensical statement, well in short your argument is stupid and bad. The difficulty is not going anywhere. There is talk of an addition of an easy mode, not the elimination of the normal mode. The brutal, no forgiveness gameplay that you claim to love will still be there. Why would you deprive other people who might be interested in the game, but not in its difficulty the ability to play and enjoy its contents? Sure they may not get the full experience of the game in your opinion (they probably won't in my opinion), but why is that your call to make? Let them play the game and decide for themselves.

The above argument eventually boils down to plain pointless elitism. People whose lives are empty, their lives are unfulfilling, or maybe they're just bitter and afraid of change, who don't want a change because it makes them feel special.

 

[TehCookie]

I wouldn't want to play it because if casuals can play it it won't add to my e-peen. [font color=e6e7e8] Seriously easy mode takes out enjoyment of beating the game. The fun from the series (I've only played Demon Souls) is overcoming the challenge. This is coming from someone who sucks and never beat it.[/font]

 

[Windcaler]

Let me preface this by saying I haven't played the games yet.

For the issue at hand, I don't think anyone has a valid argument for them not including an easy mode as long as its done well. There were a couple valid points raised about stuff like not allowing for easy players to interact with normal characters (and vice-versa), but they mostly point seem to get at the idea that if easy is to exist it should be a separate entity and not affect their difficult version.

Those that are making the argument that no, because dark souls is supposed to be hard, or some other nonsensical statement, well in short your argument is stupid and bad. The difficulty is not going anywhere. There is talk of an addition of an easy mode, not the elimination of the normal mode. The brutal, no forgiveness gameplay that you claim to love will still be there. Why would you deprive other people who might be interested in the game, but not in its difficulty the ability to play and enjoy its contents? Sure they may not get the full experience of the game in your opinion (they probably won't in my opinion), but why is that your call to make? Let them play the game and decide for themselves.

The above argument eventually boils down to plain pointless elitism. People whose lives are empty, their lives are unfulfilling, or maybe they're just bitter and afraid of change, who don't want a change because it makes them feel special.

You know I am so bloody tired of people like you calling purists elitist because they feel that an easy mode cheapens the game. I have reported that very statement I dont know how many bloody times but the moderators of the forum refuse to address the personal attack on us. By definition an elitest seeks to be exclusionary and the souls community is anything but that, we've always been inclusionary. We've always tried to be helpful, to offer advice, to help people adapt to the challenges of Dark souls but for all those attempts people like you keep attacking us and calling us elitest. Im sick of it. How about you all make an actual intelligent argument while listening to our side without relying on insulting our views?

 

[King of Asgaard]

I would play it just to have experienced it, but I do feel that making it easier or adding an easy mode (though I could look past it if it's optional).
This video explains the basis of my dislike of the idea:
Yeah, it's long, but it perfectly illustrates my points.

 

[Headdrivehardscrew]

It's as if this thread pops up at least once every week now.

Would I play it? Doubtful. Would I enjoy it? Hell no.

Let me word it this way: Had a new Souls game been announced to be released tomorrow, I would have queued to get it ASAP. Now, with all this blah clogging my arteries, happy bubbles and brain tubes, I'll definitely wait it out and see what others make of it. I want Dark Souls 2, not God of Crash Bandicoot 4.5.

If they still manage to make a splendid Souls game, all the power to them. If they ruin the franchise, best regards, thanks for all the fish and bone cancer to them.

You don't mess with the Souls.

 

[gigastar]

Well Dark Souls 2 will certainly be a different beast from Demons- and Dark Souls as this one has new directors at the helm.

We will see how it pans out.

.. based on the information we have been given about how they want to make it more of an action game, want to limit the amount of choices you have to make, and seemingly want to make a linear story that you dont really have as much control over

Get a source for your rumors and speculation next time.

 

[Crazyjay]

I would like an easy mode, since the game goes at such a slow pace unless you want to die horribly that I usually get bored to death after i kill a boss, if I even get there. I usually do play on the easier settings of games just so I can blow through the story and content, and if I like the game, I almost always go through the higher difficulties for a more difficult challenge of stuff I already know. I feel an easy mode would maybe allow me to enjoy the game more, since as of this moment the game doesnt fit me at all.

 

[BlackFlyme]

Well Dark Souls 2 will certainly be a different beast from Demons- and Dark Souls as this one has new directors at the helm.

We will see how it pans out.

.. based on the information we have been given about how they want to make it more of an action game, want to limit the amount of choices you have to make, and seemingly want to make a linear story that you dont really have as much control over

Get a source for your rumors and speculation next time.

The only thing we have in terms of a source at the moment is an interview with the new directors. I've been trying to find it, but when i try searching google i only get people's reactions to the article.

The only thing i know for sure is that the new directors said they want the game to be more "straightforward and understandable", which can mean just about anything.

If I manage to find the article I'll update this post.


Found it. I gave up on google and went straight to Edge itself.

http://www.edge-online.com/news/dark-souls-iis-new-director-on-making-one-of-the-toughest-series-in-videogames-more-accessible/

I also found an interview with Miyazaki, the director of the first Dark Souls, and it is much more reassuring.

http://www.edge-online.com/news/miyazaki-insists-dark-souls-ii-will-stay-true-to-what-fans-expect/

 

[Headdrivehardscrew]

I wouldn't want to play it because if casuals can play it it won't add to my e-peen. Seriously easy mode takes out enjoyment of beating the game. The fun from the series (I've only played Demon Souls) is overcoming the challenge. This is coming from someone who sucks and never beat it.

LOOK! HIDDEN TEXT!

Here's the thing: Somebody shows me the game of chess. I like chess, so I learn all about it until I can play chess and not insta-lose against the chess pro hobo down in the park.

Now, if chess is my thing, nine men's morris might well look a bit like it from afar, being all black-and-white or brown-and-cream or opaque-and-clear or ebony-and-ivory - but it's definitely not the same game. You can't make chess 'more easy', as the game is in its perfect shape already. You can't add squares or a piece. With a Souls game, you only really need to create a new world to conquer, new foes to identify and dispose of in the most stylish manner and new riddles, traps and environmental hazards to glue me to the edge of my comfy gaming chair until it's all over again. Farm FMV, melonfarm QTE, the Souls games are where it's at. It's a white truffle, a diamond sailing the sea of mud, the marriage ring shining brightly in a pile of dog poop.

 

[wild0061]

I would like an easy mode, since the game goes at such a slow pace unless you want to die horribly that I usually get bored to death after i kill a boss, if I even get there. I usually do play on the easier settings of games just so I can blow through the story and content, and if I like the game, I almost always go through the higher difficulties for a more difficult challenge of stuff I already know. I feel an easy mode would maybe allow me to enjoy the game more, since as of this moment the game doesnt fit me at all.

I thought the same, hence why I didn't bother buying any of the games. So many games to choose from (and good games at that), either on steam waiting to be installed (from over buying on steam sales), or other AAA release games that I haven't gotten around to playing yet because I'm already playing another new release that came out only a little before that one did. Don't see any point in playing something to be bored to tears, and having the lifetime of it extended artificially through difficulty, when there's so many games out there competing to entertain me already.

 

[TehCookie]

I wouldn't want to play it because if casuals can play it it won't add to my e-peen. Seriously easy mode takes out enjoyment of beating the game. The fun from the series (I've only played Demon Souls) is overcoming the challenge. This is coming from someone who sucks and never beat it.

LOOK! HIDDEN TEXT!

Here's the thing: Somebody shows me the game of chess. I like chess, so I learn all about it until I can play chess and not insta-lose against the chess pro hobo down in the park.

Now, if chess is my thing, nine men's morris might well look a bit like it from afar, being all black-and-white or brown-and-cream or opaque-and-clear or ebony-and-ivory - but it's definitely not the same game. You can't make chess 'more easy', as the game is in its perfect shape already. You can't add squares or a piece. With a Souls game, you only really need to create a new world to conquer, new foes to identify and dispose of in the most stylish manner and new riddles, traps and environmental hazards to glue me to the edge of my comfy gaming chair until it's all over again. Farm FMV, melonfarm QTE, the Souls games are where it's at. It's a white truffle, a diamond sailing the sea of mud, the marriage ring shining brightly in a pile of dog poop.

Oh no, you found it (So was it by highlighting or quoting?)

Although I don't get your chess metaphor at all. You can make chess more easy, face a kid then face a veteran. Same mechanics, but do you feel the same victory beating a kid? I can't even tell if that was the point you were going for.