Dad Alters Donkey Kong for His Daughter - With Pauline as the Hero

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

Clearly they didn't have equal protection before the act as you can see they were attacked more. The act gives them equal protection to men. That's logical.

No the lawyer didn't have stats but that is someone influential in the business saying what they have learned from experience.

 

[Epona]

I see, so Sony is sexist. Nice.

I didn't say that at all. I said they wanted something fresh. You just picked that out of thin air.

Then what was your point here?

You say they "replaced" Lara Croft with Nathan Drake during a discussion about sexism.

Sigh you said 'There would be an uproar if someone replaced a female character with a male one.'
I said 'But they replaced Lara Croft with Nathan Drake' and Here's the important part 'BUT NO ONE CARED'

You said they didn't replace her, I argued the point. Sexism was never mentioned...

Replace Mario with Peach in Super Mario Bros 3 is not the same as making a new game franchise with a male protagonist.

 

[Epona]

snip

Clearly they didn't have equal protection before the act as you can see they were attacked more. The act gives them equal protection to men. That's logical.

No the lawyer didn't have stats but that is someone influential in the business saying what they have learned from experience.

I see, so if there is an imbalance then the minority group should get special laws?

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I see, so Sony is sexist. Nice.

I didn't say that at all. I said they wanted something fresh. You just picked that out of thin air.

Then what was your point here?

You say they "replaced" Lara Croft with Nathan Drake during a discussion about sexism.

Sigh you said 'There would be an uproar if someone replaced a female character with a male one.'
I said 'But they replaced Lara Croft with Nathan Drake' and Here's the important part 'BUT NO ONE CARED'

You said they didn't replace her, I argued the point. Sexism was never mentioned...

Replace Mario with Peach in Super Mario Bros 3 is not the same as making a new game franchise with a male protagonist.

I'd say that it is as it had an obvious connection with the Tomb Raider style. Again I don't think it's bad I'm just using it as an example of no one being bothered by it.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

Clearly they didn't have equal protection before the act as you can see they were attacked more. The act gives them equal protection to men. That's logical.

No the lawyer didn't have stats but that is someone influential in the business saying what they have learned from experience.

I see, so if there is an imbalance then the minority group should get special laws?

Yes, to make the situation equal. Since if left on it's own the situation is not equal.

 

[Epona]

snip

Clearly they didn't have equal protection before the act as you can see they were attacked more. The act gives them equal protection to men. That's logical.

No the lawyer didn't have stats but that is someone influential in the business saying what they have learned from experience.

I see, so if there is an imbalance then the minority group should get special laws?

Yes, to make the situation equal. Since if left on it's own the situation is not equal.

Ok, so are you in favor of laws that balance out the custody issue or laws to balance out college enrollment?

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Snip

Snip

Think it might be time to take this to private messages, guys? It's not like you could derail this thread any harder at this point.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

snip

Ok, so are you in favor of laws that balance out the custody issue or laws to balance out college enrollment?

I don't think they are necessary as currently those things aren't skewed in the favour of anyone. The extra 7% could be even be from male female birth rates for that generation/class of kids. It's not really that worrying.

However if the percentage went to like 70% or above then I would be in favour of action towards it but as we can see that isn't the case.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Snip

Snip

snip​

Think it might be time to take this to private messages, guys? It's not like you could derail this thread any harder at this point.

Can I be the red one? And sorry to derail. I didn't intend it to be that way

Like I said I think Pauline is adorable, Especially her climbing animation. I hope Shigeru Miyamoto sees it.

 

[Epona]

I don't think they are necessary as currently those things aren't skewed in the favour of anyone. The extra 7% could be even be from male female birth rates for that generation/class of kids. It's not really that worrying.

However if the percentage went to like 70% or above then I would be in favour of action towards it but as we can see that isn't the case.

Yes, they are skewed in favor of women. You know that too but then claim the 7% isn't significant. Yes, women still win most custody cases.

The Typical Single Parent is a Mother:

- Approximately 84% of custodial parents are mothers, and
- 16% of custodial parents are fathers

http://singleparents.about.com/od/legalissues/p/portrait.htm

More here: http://dalrock.wordpress.com/2011/08/15/latest-u-s-custody-and-child-support-data/

 

[gibboss28]

Reading the posts on this thread have made me sad.

 

[charge52]

snip

For my comment, I was using retro in what is the most popular definition of SNES/Genesis and before.

2) Where the supposed most started with the franchise(which due to popularity was either 4, or as said, 6) doesn't change my point. And yes, Final fantasy 1, 2, 3, and 4 were re-released on the app store. Metroid is not, though not many Nintendo games are(that I know of), which brings me to a question. On what device was Donkey Kong released as an app?

Because I did some research and no mention anywhere of an appstore re-release could be found. So I borrowed a friends Iphone and browsed through(then browsed a computer version just in case) and could not for the life of me find it.

3) That's not actually true. See since you count FF5 as having a female lead I know you consider them a lead even if they aren't the main main character, so I checked some facts. FF1, I'll concede because it occurs to me the playable characters aren't really people. FF2 has the protagonist Maria, who is both a female lead and playable character. FF3 has Refia, a female lead and main character. FF4 has Rosa Farrell, a female lead and main character, and obviously, you already know about 5 and 6. Also app re-release see above.

4) Not atari, was re-released.

So, now I question your context here, if you only are referring to atari games, well you should have specified that rather than just say "retro" which commonly means SNES/Genesis and older. Then there is the App store re-release problem, because, donkey kong does not appear to fit that criteria.

 

[Maevine]

This is neat .w. I like this.

 

[chozo_hybrid]

This is neat .w. I like this.

Same here, the little running animation is adorable. Nintendo should see this, then make it an option in the next re-release of this classic title.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

**snip**

This is the problem arguing minutia - it gets away from the point.

The fact that later SNES games had female protagonists is a good thing. I'm happy about that. Never said I wasn't. And the fact that even SNES era games with female protagonists can be counted on two hands actually supports my point.

You have effectively been calling me out on a bit of hyperbole (that 1% of retro games had a female protagonist rather than 0% games). So yes, I was wrong about that. I was exaggerating to make a point. But your response kinda proves my larger point - how few there are that you can literally name them all.

Now name every single male protagonist in all retro gaming. I'll wait. See you in about a week.

And yes, that was also hyperbole. Needing a full week to list them, I mean. If you hadn't noticed, I tend to talk that way.

My point is, and always has been, that editing Donkey Kong so that Pauline can be the hero is a great idea. There are tons of retro games that wouldn't be changed at all by simply switching the sprite. Not all - I never said all - but many.

Pac Man wasn't significantly altered by creating Ms. Pack Man - the same game with a female protagonist.

As demonstrated, Donkey Kong isn't significantly altered by having Pauline be the hero.

There are hundreds of other very simple retro titles that could get this treatment and not change in the slightest. I it would both allow for more female protagonists and get women out of demeaning Damsel roles.

And I'm not saying that men shouldn't be playable. I have always suggested a choice of sprite at the beginning, so that the player could choose the original male character or the sprite-reversed female character. If you want to play as Jump Man or whomever, you still can. And I can play as Pauline.

What do you have against simple to add gameplay options that don't affect you at all?

 

[Reyold]

It's stuff like this that makes me want to be a dad.

 

[goliath6711]

But the entire games media does not do that, not at all in fact. Many games have female leads or main characters such as . . . the final fantasy series, ghost in the shell, buffy (it had games), metroid, mirrors edge, mass effect, oni, perferct dark, silent hill, xena (had a game), streets of rage, golden axe, resident evil, portal, alice and gears of war to name a few. Tomb raider, bayonetta and that X blade thing but i will forget these because they heavily sexualise the characters which is it's own issue. That's a good mix of new and retro right there. Yes, I am aware Bella Swan is the worst thing to happen to feminism in the last 20 years I totally agree with you there. The Damsel in Distress theme was around before the classical era and is the basis of a great deal of mythology, it has pervaded through literature since that time in some form or another. Many of the works based on this are classics and will continue to be considered so even if the societal view of woman and men has changed. I think it would be ridiculous to call them sexist because you should consider the time they were created. Just like I think it's ridiculous to call the 1980's 2D platformer sexist because no one was considering that angle of the game then, no one considered the societal impact of games at all. The industry is changing but you have to let it and crying foul on stupid things just cheapens your point.

Thanks for the link but if I want 25 minutes of my life wasted I can think of better ways than listening to an uninformed charlatan.

Completely agree with your point, but Mass Effect doesn't belong in that group of games you mentioned. And that's because games where the story centers around one main character, and that character's look can be created by the player from the ground up, that's not an example of the game being progressive toward any group, that's it giving you the tools to be progressive if you feel like it, and if you don't, it'll satisfy you too. The difference between that and games like Streets of Rage is that those games center around a team and you're playing as a member of that team. So whether you're playing through as Blaze Fielding, Adam Hunter or Axel Stone, you're playing the game of that trio bringing down the Syndicate. The intros and the endings to that and Golden Axe constantly remind you that while you're not currently playing as them, all three characters are supposed to be taking part in this story. When you're playing as Commander Shepard, no other version exists but the one you created. Everything revolves around your Shepard. So if you never wanted to create a female Shepard or you never wanted to create a male Shepard, you can play the game to the end of time and it will never acknowledge either one's existence.

 

[goliath6711]

I see, so Sony is sexist. Nice.

I didn't say that at all. I said they wanted something fresh. You just picked that out of thin air.

Then what was your point here?

You say they "replaced" Lara Croft with Nathan Drake during a discussion about sexism.

Sigh you said 'There would be an uproar if someone replaced a female character with a male one.'
I said 'But they replaced Lara Croft with Nathan Drake' and Here's the important part 'BUT NO ONE CARED'

You said they didn't replace her, I argued the point. Sexism was never mentioned...

Replace Mario with Peach in Super Mario Bros 3 is not the same as making a new game franchise with a male protagonist.

I'd say that it is as it had an obvious connection with the Tomb Raider style. Again I don't think it's bad I'm just using it as an example of no one being bothered by it.

That's like saying that Hancock was replacing the existing Superman with a black one.

 

[charge52]

**snip**

This is the problem arguing minutia - it gets away from the point.

The fact that later SNES games had female protagonists is a good thing. I'm happy about that. Never said I wasn't. And the fact that even SNES era games with female protagonists can be counted on two hands actually supports my point.

You have effectively been calling me out on a bit of hyperbole (that 1% of retro games had a female protagonist rather than 0% games). So yes, I was wrong about that. I was exaggerating to make a point. But your response kinda proves my larger point - how few there are that you can literally name them all.

I hope this is another hyperbole, because if you want, I can, and will list far more. I was primarily focusing on the games the previous commentor had listed.

Now name every single male protagonist in all retro gaming. I'll wait. See you in about a week.

Challenge accepte-

And yes, that was also hyperbole. Needing a full week to list them, I mean. If you hadn't noticed, I tend to talk that way.

Damn.

My point is, and always has been, that editing Donkey Kong so that Pauline can be the hero is a great idea. There are tons of retro games that wouldn't be changed at all by simply switching the sprite. Not all - I never said all - but many.

Pac Man wasn't significantly altered by creating Ms. Pack Man - the same game with a female protagonist.

As demonstrated, Donkey Kong isn't significantly altered by having Pauline be the hero.

There are hundreds of other very simple retro titles that could get this treatment and not change in the slightest. I it would both allow for more female protagonists and get women out of demeaning Damsel roles.

And I'm not saying that men shouldn't be playable. I have always suggested a choice of sprite at the beginning, so that the player could choose the original male character or the sprite-reversed female character. If you want to play as Jump Man or whomever, you still can. And I can play as Pauline.

What do you have against simple to add gameplay options that don't affect you at all?

Oh I have no objection to this, in fact for the most part I agree with it. I was just arguing whether or not the games that he listed were retro, and points brought up after the fact.