Dark Souls Has Been Ruined

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hondommond

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Aug 19, 2008
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shrekfan246 said:
hondommond said:
No average person can achieve this regularly without assistance and seeing as there are hundreds of the same type of class it is easy to determine that they aren't skilled enough to have reached that point in the first place.
What I'm reading here is "I'm better than all of these people, why are they capable of doing the same things I am!?"

Look, I get it, running into people who exploit glitches for their own gain and then use it to fuck over other people sucks. It does. I'm not denying that. But tone down the elitism. As soon as you start referring to other players of the game as an "average person", you're transcending the line beyond 'playing the game for fun'. I like to think I'm 'better than the average person' in World of Warcraft, because I'm sure the 'average' person hasn't killed Heroic Madness of Deathwing, no matter how pathetic it may be now. But I'm not going to go bitching on forums about how Blizzard has nerfed Dragon Soul by 35%, giving the 'average' players a better chance of experiencing the same content I've done.

All of your 'skill' in the game doesn't give you any more of a right to complain about how terrible the multi-player is being made by these exploiters. I'd argue that your 'skill' should make you complain less, since by all rights you should be able to decimate these exploiters if you're as good as you claim. Complain about the issues, by all means, but don't hold yourself up on some imaginary pedestal in the process. It's a game. You can complain about bullshit like item duplication without using anecdotal evidence proving how good you are at it. And regardless, given how many ways there are to avoid being invaded, I don't feel that this being broken 'ruins' the game, unless all you're playing it for is the multi-player component.

(And on that point I can't empathize, because I play in offline mode if I can help it. Never been a huge fan of multi-player in non-MMO's, and my connection likes to randomly drop out or slow down often enough that it'd be a pain for me anyway.)
I can understand how some people would view my posting as "complaining" but that is by no means what I am going for. People are entitled to view my posting in whatever light they want.

No matter how I word my posting people are going to find some way to find negativity in it. I never state that I am some sort of "Super incredible elite player" I am by no means the best player and by referring to the "Average player" most regular people aren't going around doing challenge playthroughs. Its not a very popular thing to do, but I enjoy the added challenge in the No-Level Up type of playthroughs in RPGs.

I also enjoy everyone's opinion on the matter, and even if its negative I like reading everyone's opinion on these matters and thank them accordingly for posting them in my thread!

OT: I use to play World of Warcraft; I quit after 6 years of playing and can say that all the comparisons to this game are out of place. If you cant find it in yourself to reference something else I suggest following in my own footsteps and broadening your gaming verity!

I have picked up other MMOs in the most casual and temporary of manners and have found it to be extremely refreshing to see other things than World of Warcraft (TERA being one of my favorite, Now that is a good game!)
 

shrekfan246

Not actually a Japanese pop star
May 26, 2011
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hondommond said:
I can understand how some people would view my posting as "complaining" but that is by no means what I am going for. People are entitled to view my posting in whatever light they want.

No matter how I word my posting people are going to find some way to find negativity in it. I never state that I am some sort of "Super incredible elite player" I am by no means the best player and by referring to the "Average player" most regular people aren't going around doing challenge playthroughs. Its not a very popular thing to do, but I enjoy the added challenge in the No-Level Up type of playthroughs in RPGs.

I also enjoy everyone's opinion on the matter, and even if its negative I like reading everyone's opinion on these matters and thank them accordingly for posting them in my thread!
Fair enough.

OT: I use to play World of Warcraft; I quit after 6 years of playing and can say that all the comparisons to this game are out of place. If you cant find it in yourself to reference something else I suggest following in my own footsteps and broadening your gaming verity!

I have picked up other MMOs in the most casual and temporary of manners and have found it to be extremely refreshing to see other things than World of Warcraft (TERA being one of my favorite, Now that is a good game!)
I use World of Warcraft as a comparison because it's the only game I tend to play competitively. I have plenty of variety in my gaming habits, I enjoy games such as Okami, Shadow of the Colossus, Final Fantasy XII, Dragon Age: Origins, Mass Effect, Deus Ex, Star Wars: Jedi Knight, Metal Gear Solid, Darksiders II, Dark Souls, The Witcher 2, Batman: Arkham City, Alice: Madness Returns, Sonic Generations, Kirby's Return to Dreamland, Xenoblade Chronicles, Tales of Symphonia, Pokemon, The World Ends With You, Kingdom Hearts, Halo, Sins of a Solar Empire, Kingdoms of Amalur, Transformers: War for Cybertron/Fall of Cybertron, Prototype, inFamous, Sleeping Dogs, Crysis 2, Resistance: Fall of Man, New Super Mario Bros., Super Smash Bros., The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, Persona 3/4, Bioshock - Just to name a few.

But the one thing that tends to hold true through all of them is that if it can be helped, I ignore any multi-player component.
 

hondommond

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Aug 19, 2008
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Lumber Barber said:
A couple of cheaters completely ruined the whole game?
Nah.
Your absolutely right! Dark Souls is still an amazing game! the title refers to the game being ruined for myself. This is something I should of specified earlier and I apologize!
 

theultimateend

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PieBrotherTB said:
I don't understand at all how exploiting glitches to give oneself an unfair advantage is fun.

At all.
I don't understand how someone could pick up smoking.

But lots of folks do.

Different strokes for different folks.

I just learned that folks are different and pleasantly accept it, makes life easier.
 

hondommond

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Aug 19, 2008
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daveman247 said:
hondommond said:
Then delete a character, and start again. Legit this time :D
I was actually thinking about doing so for the Prepare to Die Edition DLC! I thought it would be interesting to play through the DLC as an Artorias Build. The look on Artorias' face would be priceless!
 

Mr Binary

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Jan 24, 2011
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I'm getting rather tired of people complaining about these games. If you don't like the players playing, then just don't play the bloody game. They're not going to stop unless it's patched, so it's pointless to even moan about them.

In terms of PvP, I'd like to say yes it is unbalanced, but for good reasons. If I work for hours, weeks, or months on character I'm going to want to feel that power when I invade another's world ergo, killing them in two shots with my bow or a single backstab.

Basically if you don't like the players, don't play the game. Don't like the multiplayer, don't play the multiplayer. It's all your choice to keep playing.
 

Lex Darko

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Aug 13, 2006
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I can understand where the OP is coming from. I had a DkS character with 178 hours on it; ten of those hours were spent just farming demon titanite in the Lost Izalith Chaos covenant shortcut. I farmed enough to make every demon weapon +5. Recently with the new dlc coming I decided to get muled and prepare new characters.

I deleted my 178 hour character and made a new one based on the mule. And in doing that I instantly felt the lost of incentive to explore the optional areas of the game. Like I have no reason to go to, or explore: the depths, most of blight town, upper levels of New Londo, Darkroot Forest covenant area, Undead asylum, the Catarina sidequest, the crystal forest etc.

But my favorite weapon in the entire game is the Darksword, and this was the only way to get more than one on a single character. So I don't regret this decision at all, but at the same time I won't be signing an petition for the continuation of this glitch or any other glitch for the purpose of convenience. And this feeling of loss of incentive is also why I'm against any type of armory idea or mechanic for the next souls game.

The last thing the PS3 version or any verison of DkS needs are players running around with 99 of Elizabeth's mushrooms during pvp.
 

Dansen

Master Lurker
Mar 24, 2010
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fuzz said:
Bottomless boxers haven't ruined the whole game, but they have ruined the undead burg if you're in human form. I use the glitch all the time just to try different builds and have fun. I don't use it to backstab level 6 people in the burg and be an asshole. Recently I've been taking my level 87 character on ng+ into the burg for some pvp. Every now and then a twinker will show up and often runs away or circles me constantly before being killed, it really is pathetic.

I don't want to see the glitch removed because it adds a lot of fun to the single player aspect. What dark souls really needs is better scaling for regular weapons and less damage for lightning and fire weapons to balance it out a bit overall.
Can you believe that they actually had to change stat scaling already? It was a lot worse before.

This has been a problem for a long time. Its not even hard, the average grief usually rolls a +15 pyromancy hand or nito's grave lord sword, both of witch are high end weapons and easy to get early on. The worst part is that if you connect to them once you will probably connect to them again. I was helping people out as a white phantom and the same asshole connected three times, to three different hosts. He had a lightning claymore and he always put his soapstone in front of the gargoyle room so we couldn't escape. After the third time I just got off because it wasn't any fun.

Mr Binary said:
I'm getting rather tired of people complaining about these games. If you don't like the players playing, then just don't play the bloody game. They're not going to stop unless it's patched, so it's pointless to even moan about them.

In terms of PvP, I'd like to say yes it is unbalanced, but for good reasons. If I work for hours, weeks, or months on character I'm going to want to feel that power when I invade another's world ergo, killing them in two shots with my bow or a single backstab.

Basically if you don't like the players, don't play the game. Don't like the multiplayer, don't play the multiplayer. It's all your choice to keep playing.
Your attitude reminds me of a lot of the players on the wiki. Since you spent the time to grind for loot you have a right to grief? Sorry but I don't think going out of your way to ruin someone else's game is right. I am also not sure if you understand the problem. These griefers are actively going to spots where people are low level and then invading them with end game gear. There is no way to beat them.
 

Smeggs

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Oct 21, 2008
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So apparently, the game is ruined because the already incredibly broken PVP is now even more broken?

lolwut?

The single player is still perfectly fine, just choose not to use the glitches.
 

ChildishLegacy

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Apr 16, 2010
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People can still grief without the bottomless box glitch, you can just NOT level up and go kill four kings if you're good enough.

Most people (myself not included) use the bottomless box glitch because they want to tinker around with genuine PvP builds and try them at a high level, but they don't want to make 10 characters and take them through the entire game to make 10 different builds. If I wanted to PvP a lot I know I'd really stop having fun with the game entirely if I were running through the whole game every time I felt like mixing it up a bit. I'm sure these people have already enjoyed playing the game through multiple times, but it doesn't mean they won't get sick of it.
 

Calibanbutcher

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Nov 29, 2009
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Well, the thing that ruins it for me aren't the guys with impossible gear, but rather the damn lagging problems. Seriously, how am I supposed to fight someone, when he stands a few meters away from me in front of me and the next instant I get backstabbed to death?
I mean, I managed to get my Darksword as well, but I stayed fair throughout the fights, with gesturing and bowing and whatnot.
(My second Darksword I traded, simply so I could dual-wield a fire and a lightning Darksword.)
But only today, I was assissting someone against sif, when we were invaded.
The first guy was courteous, allowed us to take out the NPCs first and then engaged the host.
And, since he had proven himself to be polite, I did not interfere.
Then, the second guy invaded.
I waited until he had fully spawned, did the polite bow and was immediately flattened by his giant hammer-thing and sent back home.
Yaay.
This example hopefully serves to show, why I would prefer polite players over the removal of the bottomless box glitch.
 

Eponet

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Nov 18, 2009
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I heard that it was a problem, so I did my PVP at level 120. It seems to be working, nothing is over the top.

The only BB glitch I find worth using at that level range is the one that allows multiplying items you already have 100 of.

It's a practically inexhaustible supply for a single battle, and it simply prevents having to run back from the forest/kiln/tomb of giants etc. to get more prism stones (Because spamming those things to write messages/draw pictures is the only thing to do while waiting for someone to invade/your invasion to go through)
 

Darksoulsistheshyte

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OK OK OK, Hondommond, first of all, I am foremost a lover of difficult games. From the very first Castlevania, to M.U.L.E., to the first Resident Evil on hard mode, even unbeatable games like the first Gauntlet for NES or even classic arcade module Pac-Man. Let me say, for the record, that Dark Souls, second only to the first Dead Space, is the most difficult and also the best game I have ever had the pleasure of experiencing.

After putting over three full work weeks into my first DS character, I soon found out about this "bottomless box trick". With no intention to rob myself of difficulty or replay-ability, I decided to attempt this glitch for myself. First of all, the soul duplication "glitch", in which one must first ring both bells of awakening and then speak with King Seeker Frampt, is an exploit. Designed into the game with the specific intention of; A. Rewarding those with enough attention to detail to see that Frampt pays more souls for basic arrows, fire bombs, and prism stones, and B. to allow completion of a character to lvl 100. If you have ever played the game, then you know as well as I do, that to level a character that far, without first completing the game and starting a new game+, is utterly impossible.

Second, with no intention to discredit you, to fully complete ten characters in less than 20 years (even with the soul "duplication glitch") is physically, chronologically, and irrevocably impossible. For the player to go from Firelink Shrine, through Undead Burg to the merchant, buy 99 fire bombs and 999 wood arrows, then to run back through Undead Burg, up the sewage hall, talk to the female undead merchant, buy 99 prism stones, and run back to King Seeker Frampt, sell the items for souls (which i believe only gives you about 25,000) takes at the very least 5 minutes per run. THERE IS NO WAY AROUND THAT.

Furthermore, unless you really feel like spending FOUR HUNDRED HOURS duplicating the soul of gwynn, you wont be able to complete more than one character using this method, before you get carpal tunnel.

And as for the controvercial bottomless box glitch... well, it has been said that this is a means of holding your hand to improve playability, it has also been said that we as dedicated players just shouldn't do it. Well, (pardon my french) I think that is a bunch of horse shit. First of all, if this was a means to make first time players want to keep playing, then the designers would have made the opening and the attainment there of much less difficult. Think about this for a moment. In order to purchase the bottomless box, (before the most recent binge of updates, anyway) one has to first: escape the Undead Asylum, (a task most first time players never got past) then FIND Undead Burg, (a task which caused FOUR of my friends to stop playing the game, much to my dismay) defeat Taurus Demon (a task that made me break one perfectly good pc conroller)
then find their way up through the Undead Parish, (which took me over three hours when I first started, mainly because of the warthog demon thing, and I tried to kill Knight Lautrec of Carim) Defeat the Gargoyles, Ring the bell, find the key to the basement, run through lower Undead Burg and kill Kapra (one of my favorite and most hated parts of the game because of the level of difficulty) and this is the most important part. KILL KAPRA, who in my humble opinion was more difficult than most later game bosses. And what do you get for killing KAPRA?!?!?!? Why of course you get cursed in the depths, and wander about trying to fucking find a cure. (purging stones are sold in only two places in the entire game. Sold namely by the priest in the first bell tower and also by the female undead merchant, another incredibly difficult detail to discover without a google search). For those keeping track, this takes at the very least three hours. I've done it like thirteen times, I should know that it is no walk in the park. After traversing the depths, and finally accquiring the bottomless box, you dont even have a reason to use the glitch, because you dont have jack shit to transfer to another character aside from the drake sword and some early game armor. The only real reason one may have to use this glitch, is an over abundance of crafting materials. Even then it would be wise to wait until at least Anor Londo, where one may first smith an elemental/boss weapon.

THE DRAKE SWORD IS THE ONLY MECHANISM EXPLICITLY DESIGNED FOR MAKING THE EARLY GAME EASY. Period. Even that is an overstatement, since it isn't even that powerfull.

Something tells me that the ONLY REASON for adding a feature like the bottomless box (which is disorganized and unmanageable) is for this purpose, seeing as how there is no weight limit and it is more profitable to just sell unused equipment to Frampt.

But the REASON the bottomless box glitch was left in the game, is this. Without the bottomless box glitch, it is IMPOSSIBLE to fully upgrade more than one boss\special weapon, let alone a full set of armor without starting a new game+. Take Twinkling Titanite and the Outfit of the Sealer for example. Total in one play through, (granted I don't know everything about the game) I found at the most I think nine pieces of twinkling titanite. This means, that I could only upgrade the equipment so much before the game automatically by default limited me, despite the theoretical potential of the upgrade system. This wasn't meant to be a means of "twinking" your characters, it was meant as a mechanism for those who wished to achieve absolute perfection with this game, as that is what it deserves. Not to mention, on my first character, when I got around to fighting Ceaseless Discharge, I was for a time absolutely incapable of defeating him by any means other than using the bottomless box glitch. (Granted, I went back as an EXPERIENCED PLAYER, and beat the game innocently, and it was all the more rewarding.) All together, the only reason to beef with this glitch is because you got ganked by an experienced invader. There is nothing about the game that wasn't intricately thought out, for better or worse. Dark Souls for life yall!
 

hazabaza1

Want Skyrim. Want. Do want.
Nov 26, 2008
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Darksoulsistheshyte said:
1- Necros, man. Fuck.
2- All materials (including twinkling, demon and slabs) are farmable (is that a word?) in NG since release. No need to NG+ at all.
 

lRookiel

Lord of Infinite Grins
Jun 30, 2011
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My crusade against necromancers failed apparently. -.-

Fine then.. OT: Every resource is easily accessible with the right amount of time put into it. The only gripe I have with Dark souls is the hackers.
 

Tomaius

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Jan 25, 2012
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Gameguy20100 said:
I love this guy sometimes. Fitting don't ya think

He got banned the other day. Though I think he would start a tirade about how Dark Souls is actually just poor game design.