Dilemma: To buy or to build?

[wasalp]

I'm thinking of having one built too.
I have a budget of about 5500 euros, so I hope I can get one that plays Fallout 3 and Oblivion on max settings.

5500 euros will most likely get you a comp that can run both those games at max seting simultaneously

 

[Sir-jackington]

BUY! just buy

 

[Aenir]

If you have a bunch of friends who are experienced with building computers, get them to help you decide on parts and assemble it all together.

It will be WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY cheaper than buying a pre-built computer.

 

[Valiance]

First off, you can play Starcraft II on a laptop that has integrated graphics at roughly 30-40 FPS. A laptop that doesn't cost over 500 USD.

If you have 800 USD, you can get a very decent PC. All that really matters is a decent CPU and videocard anyway.

 

[Zacharine]

What I'm arguing is that, with graphics, you can invoke a emotional response with little story and context needed.

And what I'm arguing is that you don't absolutely require those good graphics to create that emotional response. That has been my point this entire time. That a good game does not necessarily require good graphics, that you can have a good game without good graphics. My entire debate in this thread sparked off from Azure Sky saying that

"While it IS possible to build one for that price, you wouldn't do it in this day and age, as it would be several years out of date before it is even built, which defeats the point of a gaming PC."

to me responding with a "...Seriously, dear readers, anyone who tells you you need at least 800-900$ to build any kind of gaming computer is, well... talking BS."

which led to Azure Sky saying

"Unless they are after a PC that won't be obsolete by the time next years/year after game releases come around."

In MW, the only think you need to know about the context is that you've been killing countless enemies for hour and BOOM, you got hit by a nuke. That sequence along is worth thousands of words.

I agree. It is one of the few rare cases where graphics was used to show an emotionally touching scene. And yet, my point has been, that you don't need a top-of-the-line gaming beast wunning at 2000-something resolutions with 24" or greater display to appreciate that scene. It is just as touching with a smaller screen, with a smaller resolution, with less than maxed out graphical settings. You don't need to see it from a movie theater canvas for it to reach out and grasp your soul.

I happen to think that an RPG ought to tell a story. I think a story is an important supporting element in FPSs (though exceptions like Painkiller exist). A good story can make an RTS rise above the multitude of average and shine on it's own. In action games, a story can tie levels together, and make you return to the game time after time.

I think gameplay is the single one core thing you can't detract from. Good graphics and a good story can compensate for a somewhat mediocre gameplay, but nothing can save a game with a poor gameplay. But excellent gameplay with a good story can compensate for poor graphics, but such a game will never rise to greatness. That I feel is the essence of a videogame: Gameplay is the core, story the adhesive and supporting structure, graphics the cream on the top. Without gameplay, the whole structure collapses. Without even a token story, graphics will wobble and not quite sit right, as you won't have the proper context to place what you are seeing in relation to everything else. Without graphics, gameplay and story need to be excellent for the game to be interesting, but the basic structure can be made sound (see NetHack, Dwarf Fortress, Master Of Orion II, Limbo, Psychonauts etc) ; but when you have solid performance on all three, you have a stable tower of entertainment reaching for the skies for all to see.

 

[veloper]

build.

failing that, because you somehow can't do it yourself, choose the parts yourself and have the rig assembled for you. This should typically cost around 50 extra.

 

[migo]

If you're going to buy, look at a system from Puget Systems, it's custom designed and comes in at a very good price, even better than Falcon-NW's Talon systems that when they launched were the best deal for a pre-made gaming system.

 

[Asehujiko]

I'm thinking of having one built too.
I have a budget of about 5500 euros, so I hope I can get one that plays Fallout 3 and Oblivion on max settings.

Depending on your resolution and whether you can actually see the difference between 2xAA and 16xQSAA(not many people can), you might be able to get a PC which does that for ?550.

I'm curious on how you managed to spend so much money since I can build a top of the line PC for less then half that which runs everything but the worst console ports perfectly.

 

[razer17]

As for the $800 you said? Yeah no, just no. Unless you want a comp that is under pressure from just running its OS...

Yeah... No. http://www.hardware-revolution.com/budget-gaming-pc/ would suggest otherwise. True, it won't run some of the tougher games on high settings, but I, as someone who appreciates gameplay over graphics, you can build a system to play pretty much every game for way under $800. Hell, if you go to $700 or $850 you can make a pretty damn good PC, looking at the specs on that site.

 

[Owlslayer]

I'm thinking of having one built too.
I have a budget of about 5500 euros, so I hope I can get one that plays Fallout 3 and Oblivion on max settings.

5500 euros will most likely get you a comp that can run both those games at max seting simultaneously

I lol'd, since it is true. Seriously, 5500 euros...Jesus Christ. Damn you people are wealthy.

anyways, i was intrigued with this debate going on here, that is, SakSak versus some other people.

Funny that, because I built mine at around that budget level. I play comfortably at 1680x1050 resolutions.

My build:
AMD Phenom XII 925 2.8GHz Quad-core, overclocked to run at ~2.95 GHz per core.
4Gb of DDR3 1333MHz CL-7 RAM.
Radeon HD5750 1Gb (PCI-e) graphics card
ASUS AM3 AMD785G Motherboard
64-bit Win7 Ultimate OS (bought via a student's upgrade from WinXP)
High-quality 500Gb internal SATA Hard-drive
Corsair VX550W power-supply (80+ certified, 5 year warranty, inbuild short-circuit protection, overvoltage, -power and -current protection)
Basic keyboard + a basic logitech gaming mouse
Basic case and two extra fans.
display and speakers scavenged from previous comp (22" BenQ and basic logitech speakers)

Total price 560?

Seriously, dear readers, anyone who tells you you need at least 800-900$ to build any kiond of gaming computer is, well... talking BS.

I like what you're talking about. Most likely since I'm trying to get a new PC with 800 $ or so, can't really afford anything higher than that. My friends, who know a great deal more about PCs that me, all suggest that i build one myself, and with 800$ I'll get a decent one (that's what they say, at least).
Just to be sure: how old is your PC, or when did you last upgrade it ? And did you built it yourself?
I found a website that builds PCs more or less custom, and I'm trying to understand the price difference and how the values have changed on different items. And since I'm quite a newbie at all things technological, a lot of research is quite...difficult to comprehend.
I'm currently trying to find a friend or a friends acquaintance, who would be willing to help me, since help i need, and a lot of it. I guess I'm asking "Hey, what can i get with this much money?"

Also, to my surprise, while i checked your profile (something i do when i agree with people), i noticed you're Finnish. That was quite a good surprise, as i am Estonian and i don't think the prices of computer parts differ a lot in the two countries (well, at least i hope so). So the prices on your PC parts might be quite familiar to the ones here i might get.

 

[Kagim]

If your friends know how to build a computer and you can get it for cheaper you might as well go for it.

In my experience there isn't much of a difference.

My computer had a critical melt down last summer. I have no clue what was wrong with it, neither did my friend who has been trained to figure out this shit, his only explanation was "God hates you a fair bit".

Shrugging my shoulders and noticing i had a fair bit of cash laying around i went out and bought a prebuild gateway. Since i already had a monitor it was roughly $600.

After my friend wouldn't shut up about how i wasted money so much money i asked him to prove how much it would have cost me to build it, and found out i only lost a whopping $100. As well it would have required waiting up to three weeks for a good half of the parts to come in. Meaning my first two weeks of college would involve not having a function PC. I would still have had to put it together to. Something i know how to do, just find really, really boring. (Note: When I say that I find it boring i do mean me and me alone.)

So its up to you honestly. Shop around, compare prices and see if its worth it. Honestly for me paying that extra 100 bucks I feel was worth not having to wait for parts or have to put it together myself.

If you can build a better computer and don't mind waiting then get one. If you can get a good PC pre built and don't find the extra cost to much buy it out of a store.

It's about whats valuable to you.

 

[manliestofmen]

I built mine like 2 years ago, with a couple upgrades last year. was only $900(CDN) total

Intel 3.06 dual core
4gigs ddr2 RAM
Nvidia GTX 280 OC (BFG)

it runs starcraft II at max settings with no problems, and you could probably get the parts for cheaper then i did 2 years ago ( 1 for the video card )

 

[Zacharine]

I like what you're talking about. Most likely since I'm trying to get a new PC with 800 $ or so, can't really afford anything higher than that. My friends, who know a great deal more about PCs that me, all suggest that i build one myself, and with 800$ I'll get a decent one (that's what they say, at least).
Just to be sure: how old is your PC, or when did you last upgrade it ? And did you built it yourself?

I built my PC myself. It was the first PC I have ever build from scratch up, previously I had experience of switch RAM-blocks and swapping HDDs. I ordered my parts at the end of last november, with the exception of my graphics card, which I bought this february (my motherboard comes with an integrated GPU, sufficient for basic web surfing etc.). I build my computer during the christmas holidays, it took me roughly 2,5 hours with a simple checklist I made for myself, from opening the packages to having Win7 installing. I could have done it faster, but I double checked every phase before doing it and had my motheboard manual right next to me for constant reference.

No hitches, no hiccups, everything went fine and no parts got damaged (thanks to a cheap anti-static wristlet) and non-conductive surface to build it on.

I found a website that builds PCs more or less custom, and I'm trying to understand the price difference and how the values have changed on different items. And since I'm quite a newbie at all things technological, a lot of research is quite...difficult to comprehend.
I'm currently trying to find a friend or a friends acquaintance, who would be willing to help me, since help i need, and a lot of it. I guess I'm asking "Hey, what can i get with this much money?"

Wll, what helped me out significantly was the Tom's Hardware website
(http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/)
where they do, for example, monthly 'Best GPU for your money' type price/performance tests, and they have an active forum with a subsection for homebuild computers and guides for first-timers.

Check to see if you can find a local version of the Mbnet's Hintaseuranta (price-following) where they list the prices and average price for individual components, based on shop retail prices.

Here's the address if you can find someone who reads Finnish, or a competent translator program (google might manage it, though I've never tried)
http://www.mbnet.fi/hintaseuranta/

They give a good solid look at what you can expect a component or a device to cost. So finding a local version of that would be great for you;if not, try to trudge trough the language barrier.

So the prices on your PC parts might be quite familiar to the ones here i might get.

That might very well be the case. Also, several Finnish online stores have shipping to anywhere in Europe, so if you find that local prices are for some reason significantly higher than those at MBnet Hintaseuranta, you might wish to look at ordering components from Finland. I however, think the situation is the opposite price-wise. But it's something to keep in mind.

If you got further questions, I'll be happy to help. Just send me a PM, and I'll respond within the day most likely.

 

[Bocaj2000]

build your own. you cut out the middle man that way. it's cheeper, more efficient, and usually better in quality.

 

[Willsor]

Definitely build. There is a uk site called novatech.com which gives pretty cheap prices on everything. (I don't know where you live, but Im not sure they ship anywhere else). They have things called Barebone bundles where they give you a case, processor and power supply, and ram, and you can add hard discs or video cards and whatever else you want.
Really good money saver that

 

[GBlair88]

I also have Starcraft 2 (come on, who doesn't)?

Well me actually but that's beside the point. If you don't feel confident building your own PC then you could buy one from a different company and still save money.

Spoiler: Alienware @£2,392.99

Included in your system:
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium 64bit- English
Intel® Core? i3 Processor 540(3.06GHz,4MB)
English Microsoft® Office Home and Business 2010 (Word, Excel, Powerpoint, Outlook, One Note)
No Security/Anti-Virus Protection
3Yr Next Day Hardware Support
1GB ATI® Radeon? HD 5670 graphics card
16GB 1333MHz (4x4GB) Dual Channel Memory
500GB (7200RPM) SATA Hard Drive
24X DVD+/- RW Optical Drive (DVD & CD read and write)
Display Not Included
No Keyboard
No Mouse
Soundblaster XFi Titanium PCIe card
Alienware Aurora (P55) Standard Cosmic Black Chassis
Accessories
Alienware 3D
Astral Aqua
Steam® Client and Portal? Game - Factory Installed
Services & Software
Also Includes
No Accidental Damage Support
Alienware Aurora Resource DVD
English - Documentation with UK/Ire Power cord
D08AWV01
Alienware Aurora (P55) DT Order - UK
No Speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system)
AutoMatic Updates : AutoMatic updates - On
One free Dell Expert call to help with your PC queries within 60 days of purchase
1 year Next Business Day Hardware Support included with your PC

Spoiler: PC Specialist.co.uk @£1201

Case
COOLERMASTER COSMOS 1000 SILVER SILENT CASE (£159) (Most expensive on the site)

Processor (CPU)
Intel® Core?i3-540 Dual Core (3.06GHz, 4MB Cache) + HD Graphics

Motherboard
ASUS® P7H55-M SI: MICRO ATX VALUE MAINBOARD,USB 2.0 & SATA 3.0Gb/s

Memory (RAM)
16GB SAMSUNG DDR3 DUAL-DDR3 1333MHz (4 X 4GB)

Graphics Card
1GB ATI RADEON? HD 5670 PCI EXPRESS - DirectX® 11

2nd Graphics Card
NONE

3rd Graphics Card
NONE

Memory - 1st Hard Disk
500GB SERIAL ATA 3-Gb/s HARD DRIVE WITH 8MB CACHE (7,200rpm)

2nd Hard Disk
NONE

1st DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
24x DUAL LAYER DVD WRITER ±R/±RW/RAM

2nd DVD/BLU-RAY Drive
NONE

Memory Card Reader
NONE

Power Supply & Case Cooling
350W Dual Rail PSU + 120mm Case Fan

Processor Cooling
INTEL SOCKET LGA1156 STANDARD CPU COOLER

Sound Card
Sound Blaster® X-Fi? Titanium PCI Express (£69)

Network Facilities
ONBOARD 10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT

USB Options
6 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL (MIN 2 FRONT PORTS) AS STANDARD

Modem
NONE, I WILL BE USING BROADBAND

Floppy Disk Drive
NONE

Firewire & Video Editing
NONE

TV Card
NONE

Operating System
Genuine Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit - inc DVD & Licence (£79)

Office Software
Microsoft® Office Home & Student 2010 (1 License Product Key Card) (£77)

Anti-Virus
NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE

Monitor
NONE

2nd Monitor
NONE

DVI Cable
NONE

GeForce 3D Vision
NONE

Keyboard & Mouse
NONE

Mouse
NONE

Speakers
NONE

Webcam
NONE

Headsets (VOIP)
NONE

Surge Protection
NONE

Printer
NONE

External Hard Drive
NONE

Home Installation
NONE

Warranty
3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, Lifetime Tech Support)

Data Recovery
NONE

Delivery
STANDARD INSURED DELIVERY TO UK MAINLAND (MON-FRI)

Build Time
Standard Build - Approximately 7 to 9 working days

Quantity
1

 

[Cody211282]

As for the $800 you said? Yeah no, just no. Unless you want a comp that is under pressure from just running its OS...

Really, I built one for $500 and it runs great, I have no idea why you think $800 is to low.

 

[Azure Sky]

If a game isnt fun on low settings then its not a good game your just attracted to how it looks. Thats not a good thing thats very bad and makes you a rather shallow person.

Seeing as I started this argument, I'll bite.
Graphics are just as integral to a game as Story, Mechanics or even Music.
There have been many games that delve deeper into each of these then others, and all have been successful.

Here's one, would you enjoy Shadow of the Colossus, one of the most visually rich games of its release year, and probably for several after that, if you were forced to play it on say... 800x600 on low settings?

No I wouldnt enjoy it on 800x600 because I didnt think it was a very good game period. If it had graphics that blew crysis away I still wouldnt like the game. Also its graphics were average for the time it came out.


If games have a terrible story, gameplay, combat system, etc but great graphics like say ff13, you couldnt pay me enough to play it. If it has a great story, gameplay, etc but terrible graphics like say crono trigger, bg 1&2, c&c, red alert, sc1, diablo 1 & 2, oh and dozens more then id play them and actually do still play them.

Gameplay can make up for story and story can make up for gameplay but good graphics makes up for nothing at all.

I do hope you realize you are badmouthing one of the best games that was released that year?
But that is not the point.
But attempting to sidestep a perfectly good example because it wasn't your cup of tea isn't very becoming.

Now, as for all the games you mentioned, they are how old? 5 years? 10? more? Please do not bring archaic examples into a conversation about modern gaming. =3

 

[Azure Sky]

As for the $800 you said? Yeah no, just no. Unless you want a comp that is under pressure from just running its OS...

Yeah... No. http://www.hardware-revolution.com/budget-gaming-pc/ would suggest otherwise. True, it won't run some of the tougher games on high settings, but I, as someone who appreciates gameplay over graphics, you can build a system to play pretty much every game for way under $800. Hell, if you go to $700 or $850 you can make a pretty damn good PC, looking at the specs on that site.

As for the $800 you said? Yeah no, just no. Unless you want a comp that is under pressure from just running its OS...

Really, I built one for $500 and it runs great, I have no idea why you think $800 is to low.

Read up a little more, I did specify where I took my prices from. =3