Discussion - Are modern controllers to complex, are kinect/move the next evolution. !!Continued!!

[Akalistos]

<youtube=0PS_vu-WBb0>
That thing kicks ass.

Yes... and no. What would sell that thing for me is if i don't wiggle the gun to move. An separate addition would be nice to move the character, like the nunchuk of the wiimote. Not like the GUNCOM3. It make for less accurate shooting. Also if they could remove the attachment and use a cocking mechanism to make the recoil, a bit like in the arcade versionTime Crisis 2 but with force feedback, it would be a must buy for me. I love going down to arcade and playing FPS with a plastic gun.

 

[Tony2077]

i hope normal controllers stick around till i lose interest in gaming

You mean when you die, right? ...

i hope so. i may have to drop consoles if they go all wii on me!!

 

[radred]

Xbox 360 is the best controller out there. it sits in the hand comfortably and the trigger and button layout, not to metion the bumpers, is great
the psp controller isn't as good, but all 'traditional' controllers still better than the wii remote or the , or ps3 one.
i'd rather use the SNES or Nintendo 64 controllers than motion sensing remotes

 

[Druyn]

Nope. Nodern controllers are just fine. All buttons easily reachable, thumbsticks in good positions, thats all. Nothing to worry about there.

Im just gonna take yahtzees stand on the motion controls deal. Hardcore gamers will not like it. No matter what Microsoft says, hardcore gamers do not go home and play games to get a workout, even if its an FPS and they are actually the person. That requires movement, which I do not want to do when I get home from school and go play games. I want to sit down,be lazy, and play like that.

Casual gamers will love it, if they dont already have, or are fed up with, the wii. The wii is cheaper than Natal, because you dont need an xbox to have one, but I dont know about the move. Either way, the wii is identical to Move, so what do you think casual crowds who arent as big into console wars as us, are going to buy. They hear, "system with motion control" and arent going to think "Oh, I think playstation just came out with one, which is great, because I always liked sony better." They are going to think, "Oh, whats that really popular one... oh yeah, the wii."

Thats my stand on it, is all. DO I think motion controls are a gimick? For nintendo, no, for Microsoft and Sony, yes. I just see the natal failing to support microsofts core fanbase, and the move failling to take any ground from the wii.

 

[Gasaraki]

<youtube=0PS_vu-WBb0>
That thing kicks ass.

Yes... and no. What would sell that thing for me is if i don't wiggle the gun to move. An separate addition would be nice to move the character, like the nunchuk of the wiimote. Not like the GUNCOM3. It make for less accurate shooting. Also if they could remove the attachment and use a cocking mechanism to make the recoil, a bit like in the arcade versionTime Crisis 2 but with force feedback, it would be a must buy for me. I love going down to arcade and playing FPS with a plastic gun.

You don't wiggle the gun to move, the novint falcon is for aiming only so while you're using it you still use the keyboard like normal.

 

[Akalistos]

<youtube=0PS_vu-WBb0>
That thing kicks ass.

Yes... and no. What would sell that thing for me is if i don't wiggle the gun to move. An separate addition would be nice to move the character, like the nunchuk of the wiimote. Not like the GUNCOM3. It make for less accurate shooting. Also if they could remove the attachment and use a cocking mechanism to make the recoil, a bit like in the arcade versionTime Crisis 2 but with force feedback, it would be a must buy for me. I love going down to arcade and playing FPS with a plastic gun.

You don't wiggle the gun to move, the novint falcon is for aiming only so while you're using it you still use the keyboard like normal.

Even so, You still have to fix the gun on the base. Why couldn't i play like in the arcade? We got the technology with the x360 and Ps3 controller. And the Bluetooth in the PS3 controller(is it bluetooth?) make it so i can play from even the toilets, across the hall, doors close and it still as responsive as the ps2 controller. That and i don't like the keyboard control, they aren't as precise as a good analogue stick. But I'm glad you see thing my ways since you only got to complain about waving the gun to move.

 

[migo]

I never said it was, I just said that it's more important that motion controls.

And you'd be wrong. Force feedback is at best a moderately useful addition and at worst an irksome gimmick. Motion controls on the other hand are practically indispensible for certain game types.

 

[Nosense]

First Question: NO

Second Question: NO, we got a long way to go in my opinion kinect and move are just the beginning not the staple.

 

[Miles Tormani]

It's okay, dude, you're not. Unfortunately, I don't have Call of Duty for my PS3 nor am I enthusiastic about getting the same game just to test an experiment so I can't make the comparison. However, from what I gather the argument is that it feels different. But playing with rumble vs without is not like playing with a controller versus playing with a pc.

Heh. The only reason that happened in my case is because I was unable to play on an Xbox for awhile, and I had a bit of a CoD4 addiction at the time, so I got it for PS3 as well. That's when I realized just how important the rumble feature is to me.

Another, cheaper way of going about this is to play through any game that supports vibration, then turn the vibration off and play through again. It's easier on the PS3 since you can either use an old Sixaxis, or turn the vibration off directly in the system menu. I don't recall if you can do that on the Xbox's system menus.

...Hold that thought. I'm going to check right now.

Yeah, you can. Why didn't I think of that first? Probably has something to do with the fact that the vibration was more or less forcibly taken from me as opposed to turning it off deliberately. Either way, I found myself zoning out a bit more without the feature. Maybe it's personal preference.

This conversation has gotten pretty off topic. Either way, the point is, I like force feedback, no matter how simple or subtle it is. Kinect can't possibly have force feedback at all, so it's kind of hard for me to feel immersed into the game as much as I would otherwise. Playstation Move on the other hand still has a slight chance in that regard.

 

[I forgot]

It's okay, dude, you're not. Unfortunately, I don't have Call of Duty for my PS3 nor am I enthusiastic about getting the same game just to test an experiment so I can't make the comparison. However, from what I gather the argument is that it feels different. But playing with rumble vs without is not like playing with a controller versus playing with a pc.

Heh. The only reason that happened in my case is because I was unable to play on an Xbox for awhile, and I had a bit of a CoD4 addiction at the time, so I got it for PS3 as well. That's when I realized just how important the rumble feature is to me.

Another, cheaper way of going about this is to play through any game that supports vibration, then turn the vibration off and play through again. It's easier on the PS3 since you can either use an old Sixaxis, or turn the vibration off directly in the system menu. I don't recall if you can do that on the Xbox's system menus.

...Hold that thought. I'm going to check right now.

Yeah, you can. Why didn't I think of that first? Probably has something to do with the fact that the vibration was more or less forcibly taken from me as opposed to turning it off deliberately. Either way, I found myself zoning out a bit more without the feature. Maybe it's personal preference.

This conversation has gotten pretty off topic. Either way, the point is, I like force feedback, no matter how simple or subtle it is. Kinect can't possibly have force feedback at all, so it's kind of hard for me to feel immersed into the game as much as I would otherwise. Playstation Move on the other hand still has a slight chance in that regard.

what was the topic again? oh yeah, modern controllers too complex. Modern controllers are definitely playable just maybe a little daunting to the newcomer. But, controllers have nowhere else to go. I mean, what next? more buttons?
As for Kinect, you're right. Gesture-based gaming has limited use like the DDR pad or rockband guitar. It's also just awkward.
Kinect isn't the evolution of games but Move and Wii might be because they have functions that can be useful like pointing, six-axis and tilt controls.

 

[tardcast]

Just want to say Kudos to everyone who posted on this subject, was very interesting read throughout.
It also helped form a great subject of the week for the show, though Tyler Barber came up with some creative points of view I hadn't considered.

IMO:
I agree most definetly on the tactile feedback front, something which touchpads,motion controls and d-pads fail at terribly.
Controllers like the PS3 controller and xbox still provide the most tactile feel, though stand at a high entry point for non-gamers. Still they provide the best all round control hands down, but also ergonmicaly need some work.
Motion control and touchscreen tech both occupy their own 'casual' space (as big a space as that is becoming), which in almost all cases are attractive to the non-hardcore audiance. However for the people who need the control that current xbox,ps3 and mouse keyboard users need there is just no alternative.

Thanks again, and I hope no one minds if i continue to post the subject of the week for the podcast(as long as it is not in reference to the podcast itself of course)here, just under GTC subject:. I promise no reference to the show other than the GTC bit in the title .