Do many Westerners really dislike Japanese games for such shallow reasons as "anime"?

[LilithSlave]

Just join some otaku/weeaboo forum, they are filled with people praising everything Japanese and preaching how it is the superior culture. I'm not saying you are like this, but atleast you'd have someone who shares your views on these games.

You missed the part where I said I lost my membership(banned from) the most prominent websites on the internet for admitting to my feelings. Where they called me shallow and superficial and a lot of other things. Telling me that caring about anything other than gameplay is stupid and embarrassing, and that anyone who feels remotely otherwise isn't worthy of calling themselves a gamer. I sacrificed my right to a good anime forum by espousing my feelings about video games(unless there is another good one out there I haven't found, which I doubt). That experience changed me, and I've tried to learn from it. If it were to be expected of me to not be shallow, and to only care about gameplay and variety, I would certainly expect the same from others.

I don't know what to think anymore. If I say I prefer Japanese style video games and aesthetics, I'm destined to get ostracized and banned from most places, not least of which anime forums themselves. And can be expected to be called Autistic, bigoted, obsessed, shallow, superficial, embarrassing, and so forth. But I don't appear to have a luxury of expecting something similar of others. Just a double standard. Or at least from my experience.

Well, I don't know what to do exactly. I'm not sure what to say about things. I don't know what to say about my experiences that won't make people irritated at me and blame me of having some kind of victim complex. I'm not exactly sure how to go about liking what I like and attempting to talk about it anymore. I know that I am beginning to feel more and more alienated as an American who likes what I do. And I'm becoming more an more afraid to be honest with my feelings, and less and less confident in how to vocalize them.

I have such a headache even trying to sort all these things out in my mind right now.

 

[Azure-Supernova]

I'll be honest here, when it comes to Japanese games it's got nothing to do with the anime art style. For me it just feels like bad character design, because it's definitely not exclusive to Japanese games that use the anime style.

I'll offer you some examples, both of which are Japanese games which I love dearly, but I believe they both have good character design, relevant to the context of their universe.

Example One

Spoiler: Valkyria Chronicles

So we can see that there's a definite anime art style here, but it's clear these guys are soldier right? I mean even if you take out the weapons and the tank, they are wearing a military uniform, albeit stylised. It's hardly realistic, but there's some rationale behind the designs.

Example Two

Spoiler: Eternal Sonata

There isn't much I don't love about this game (except the English voice acting). At first the character design looks completely haphazard and plain stupid. At least until...

Spoiler: Story Spoilers

we learn that the entire game is set in Frederic Chopin's dream as he lays on his death bed.

You want a bad example? Look at Rachael from Resident Evil Revelations or any character from some of the more heavily stylised Final Fantsy titles. This isn't saying that Western games don't have their own bad designs, I'm just too tired to do the googling for them and I can't think of one off the bat right now.

 

[Tony2077]

Just join some otaku/weeaboo forum, they are filled with people praising everything Japanese and preaching how it is the superior culture. I'm not saying you are like this, but atleast you'd have someone who shares your views on these games.

You missed the part where I said I lost my membership(banned from) the most prominent websites on the internet for admitting to my feelings. Where they called me shallow and superficial and a lot of other things. Telling me that caring about anything other than gameplay is stupid and embarrassing, and that anyone who feels remotely otherwise isn't worthy of calling themselves a gamer. I sacrificed my right to a good anime forum by espousing my feelings about video games(unless there is another good one out there I haven't found, which I doubt). That experience changed me, and I've tried to learn from it. If it were to be expected of me to not be shallow, and to only care about gameplay and variety, I would certainly expect the same from others.

I don't know what to think anymore. If I say I prefer Japanese style video games and aesthetics, I'm destined to get ostracized and banned from most places, not least of which anime forums themselves. And can be expected to be called Autistic, bigoted, obsessed, shallow, superficial, embarrassing, and so forth. But I don't appear to have a luxury of expecting something similar of others. Just a double standard. Or at least from my experience.

Well, I don't know what to do exactly. I'm not sure what to say about things. I don't know what to say about my experiences that won't make people irritated at me and blame me of having some kind of victim complex. I'm not exactly sure how to go about liking what I like and attempting to talk about it anymore. I know that I am beginning to feel more and more alienated as an American who likes what I do. And I'm becoming more an more afraid to be honest with my feelings, and less and less confident in how to vocalize them.

I have such a headache even trying to sort all these things out in my mind right now.

go ahead vocalize them you'll still have random people like me on the internet who won't judge you for your likes. i love anime/cartoons and video games from here or there doesn't matter as long as they don't break what i like about the style

if you have to sacrifice your like for something to satisfy people there not worth knowing

 

[SageRuffin]

Nobody but Japan wears the clothing that they put on their characters so it also makes the game look twice as crazy when you see for example that new game ninja garden 3 with ninja's in Britain.

Totally unrelated to the core discussion, but has it not occurred to you that maybe Britain has a martial school that teaches ninjutsu? Or maybe those guys actually traveled to Japan at some point and learned ninjutsu that way?

It's not unheard of, god.

 

[kingthrall]

Nobody but Japan wears the clothing that they put on their characters so it also makes the game look twice as crazy when you see for example that new game ninja garden 3 with ninja's in Britain.

Totally unrelated to the core discussion, but has it not occurred to you that maybe Britain has a martial school that teaches ninjutsu? Or maybe those guys actually traveled to Japan at some point and learned ninjutsu that way?

It's not unheard of, god.

no but the game involves England recruiting ninjas from japan for their secret service, from that incredible distance just to go to the U.K seems highly improbable. Besides England has some of the best Spec ops in the world.

 

[SageRuffin]

no but the game involves England recruiting ninjas from japan for their secret service, from that incredible distance just to go to the U.K seems highly improbable. Besides England has some of the best Spec ops in the world.

Be that as it may, it's still not unheard of.

Besides, in regards to NG at least, it hasn't had a decent story since Black.

 

[A Weakgeek]

Just join some otaku/weeaboo forum, they are filled with people praising everything Japanese and preaching how it is the superior culture. I'm not saying you are like this, but atleast you'd have someone who shares your views on these games.

You missed the part where I said I lost my membership(banned from) the most prominent websites on the internet for admitting to my feelings. Where they called me shallow and superficial and a lot of other things. Telling me that caring about anything other than gameplay is stupid and embarrassing, and that anyone who feels remotely otherwise isn't worthy of calling themselves a gamer. I sacrificed my right to a good anime forum by espousing my feelings about video games(unless there is another good one out there I haven't found, which I doubt). That experience changed me, and I've tried to learn from it. If it were to be expected of me to not be shallow, and to only care about gameplay and variety, I would certainly expect the same from others.

I don't know what to think anymore. If I say I prefer Japanese style video games and aesthetics, I'm destined to get ostracized and banned from most places, not least of which anime forums themselves. And can be expected to be called Autistic, bigoted, obsessed, shallow, superficial, embarrassing, and so forth. But I don't appear to have a luxury of expecting something similar of others. Just a double standard. Or at least from my experience.

Well, I don't know what to do exactly. I'm not sure what to say about things. I don't know what to say about my experiences that won't make people irritated at me and blame me of having some kind of victim complex. I'm not exactly sure how to go about liking what I like and attempting to talk about it anymore. I know that I am beginning to feel more and more alienated as an American who likes what I do. And I'm becoming more an more afraid to be honest with my feelings, and less and less confident in how to vocalize them.

I have such a headache even trying to sort all these things out in my mind right now.

Well, then you've clearly been on a fucking shitty forum, if you get banned for telling your opinion. If thats the case search for one less shitty than this "best anime forum on the internet".

However I feel that if you actually did get banned, it is more likely that you were either trolling or flaming in your thread because I haven't come across many forums that ban you outright for something like that.

Also again, not all anime sites are covered with just weeaboos. Maybe you just need to find another with more bias towards japanese culture, not nessecarily an anime forum. Something along the lines of 4chan's /jp/, although possibly less trollish.

 

[Condiments]

-snip-

Look dude, I get what you're saying, but you're over-thinking this way too much and coming across a little crazy. Who gives a shit if people disregard things for mere superficial reasons, especially on a videogame forum. Most discussions here rarely evolve past banal surface level bullshit anyways. Nothings stopping you from jumping to another site if people's general interest aren't in accordance with yours.

I frequent the RPG codex, a forum dedicated to hardcore RPGs, which is so filled with all sorts of bile that most users here would run screaming from the internet. There are however, worthwhile discussions that go on that have helped shape some of my opinions about games. Its also a forum where no one agrees on pretty much anything, and often malign each other because of it. Its not a huge deal.

 

[Eclectic Dreck]

While I do not dislike all Japanese games by any stretch, they do tend to come packed with things seemingly designed to irritate me.

1) Character design: I may be in a minority, but I tend to find irritation when a character simply seems out of place. Final Fantasy's fascination with belts. The heavy long coats worn by people fighting hand to hand. The presumption that armor somehow has nothing to do with defense. Western games do the same of course but western violations tend to fall in the unreasonably large armor that provides surprisingly little protection and armor does nothing camps. This has never been a deal breaker. I loved Bayonetta in spite of the fact that I was playing a character wearing a hair suit.

2) Basic Plot Trajectory: I get that different cultures generate different myths. The ever common "I'm doing something stupid because of honor" story simply doesn't appeal to me. The western equivalent is no better in the strictest sense but it forms the core of stories of prominence in my culture.

3) Interface: There are no excuses here. Why must everything be driven by menus designed for crab and by fish people? Even games I like meet this criteria in spades. Resident Evil, Bayonetta, Devil May Cry - all bury features in menu after menu. I understand that, when it comes down to it, most interfaces are just a tree of some kind but after decades of research, others figured out how to make that tree easier to navigate.

4) Player Communication: Japanese games are often guilty of simply not being good at communicating with the player. From features that are undocumented but important to failing to give adequate feedback regarding margins of success or failure to simply changing the rules at a moments notice without warning. This precise problem is what lies at the core of the perceived difficulty of games like Ninja Gaiden or Bayonetta or Demon's Souls.

5) I already played that exact game: This is pretty self-explanatory. The Japenese game industry lives and dies by the strength of haggard franchises. I played Devil May Cry yet they continued to hand them out without significant alterations to the theme. I played Resident Evil and they gave me a few dozen iterations. Western Games are just as guilty of course. I don't need to play another call of Duty - I've played five of them already. I suppose the difference there is simply that we are not talking about games slumping under decades of wear.

 

[Fieldy409_v1legacy]

I think the reason I dont like JRPG's is because the stories seem to mainly be about teenager characters. But that's a weak excuse as I don't know a huge amount of them. I liked them back when I was a teenager myself.

I guess I'm just the wrong target audience. I enjoy darker grittier universes and stories of mighty warriors putting their strength to the test. I love playing rpg games as barbarians and will play as an Orc whenever given a chance. I love reading Conan stories. Generally that awesome testosterone filled male power fantasies that I enjoy are far from what JRPGs, anime and manga offer.

you may want to give the manga "Berserker" a try.

Berserker Eh? Allright well the title sounds promising....

 

[Therumancer]

[

I've gotten to the point where I feel no real need to jump through hoops every time someone doesn't like something I point out. It was more of an expansion for those who were interested, rather than a justification. I'm not even really trying to engage in an arguement .

You can either accept the voice of decades of experience, or not. It's no skin off my back either way. In some threads people don't actually want the answers to the questions posed, and nothing I say is going to change that.

Haha, I wasn't aware that I was in the presence of the Voice of Decades of Experience. Tell me, o Voice of Decades of Experience, do you have any factual data to back your assertions up, or did you pull them out of the Behind of Decades of Experience?

My advice is that if you don't want to see answers from people who know more than you, don't ask questsions to begin with, or get involved in threads designed to pose questions you might not like the answer to.

There are some things I'm just not going to do research for people on, honestly if you don't like what I have to say, go head over to your search button and check yourself instead of trolling.

 

[Therumancer]

[

Because I wasn't trying to. My statement stand on their own to the point where I feel no need to back them up any further. I've gotten to the point where I feel no real need to jump through hoops every time someone doesn't like something I point out. It was more of an expansion for those who were interested, rather than a justification. I'm not even really trying to engage in an arguement .

So you were talking just for the sake of talking. Got it.

No, I was answering the question. If you don't want to hear the answers you don't belong in this thread. If you don't like what I have to say, do your own research. I am here to share knowlege, if people don't like that, they can research on their own. I am not going to dance with every troll whose inner child starts to cry when the truth isn't nessicarly politically correct.

To be blunt, my answer saves you some research, don't like it, do the research yourself and if you do it right you'll wind up in the same place if you do it right. Anything other than that is just QQing, and/or trying to bait flame wars.

 

[Kahunaburger]

To be blunt, my answer saves you some research, don't like it, do the research yourself and if you do it right you'll wind up in the same place if you do it right.

Has it occurred to you that the reason people are so dismissive of your posts is because they have done the research?

(Also, I always find that posting with an air of condescension works better when you spell words correctly.)

 

[Lugbzurg]

To me Japanese games are lifeless with no energy or spark. they are just way too organised in dialog with monotone voices and homogenized game play. There is also the fact there is no variation or variety in Japanese design looks. Nobody but Japan wears the clothing that they put on their characters so it also makes the game look twice as crazy when you see for example that new game ninja garden 3 with ninja's in Britain.

So, in other words... exactly like western games!!!

 

[Gorilla Gunk]

Weeaboo: "You don't like anime or JRPG's? MINDLESS FPS DRONE!"

PS: The anime style you all know and love (or hate) came from Scrooge McDuck.

And as a gay man I can confirm that the character designs in anime ARE really faggy looking.

Seriously, that shit makes me feel homophobic.

 

[Lugbzurg]

Weeaboo: "You don't like anime or JRPG's? MINDLESS FPS DRONE!"

PS: The anime style you all know and love (or hate) came from Scrooge McDuck.

And as a gay man I can confirm that the character designs in anime ARE really faggy looking.

Seriously, that shit makes me feel homophobic.

1. No. The style has been around much longer than that. MUCH longer.

2. Stating your opinion as fact. You are the only person I've ever heard of to make a claim that the visual styles of all forms of animé make characters appear "gay".

 

[Gorilla Gunk]

Weeaboo: "You don't like anime or JRPG's? MINDLESS FPS DRONE!"

PS: The anime style you all know and love (or hate) came from Scrooge McDuck.

And as a gay man I can confirm that the character designs in anime ARE really faggy looking.

Seriously, that shit makes me feel homophobic.

1. No. The style has been around much longer than that. MUCH longer.

2. Stating your opinion as fact. You are the only person I've ever heard of to make a claim that the visual styles of all forms of animé make characters appear "gay".

Osamu Tezuka, the "Godfather of Anime," got the "big eye" look most if not all anime use today from Walt Disney properties such as Scrooge McDuck and went on to make Astro Boy.

And they do appear gay. So. Incredibly. Gay.

 

[Tony2077]

Weeaboo: "You don't like anime or JRPG's? MINDLESS FPS DRONE!"

PS: The anime style you all know and love (or hate) came from Scrooge McDuck.

And as a gay man I can confirm that the character designs in anime ARE really faggy looking.

Seriously, that shit makes me feel homophobic.

1. No. The style has been around much longer than that. MUCH longer.

2. Stating your opinion as fact. You are the only person I've ever heard of to make a claim that the visual styles of all forms of animé make characters appear "gay".

Osamu Tezuka, the "Godfather of Anime," got the "big eye" look most if not all anime use today from Walt Disney properties such as Scrooge McDuck and went on to make Astro Boy.

And they do appear gay. So. Incredibly. Gay.

wow that the first time I've heard of anime described that way and to be honest i hope its the last