Endings that should have well been the end...

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springheeljack

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So I watched John Wick 2 a couple of weeks ago and while I thought it was a fine film and I enjoyed returning to that world I couldn't shake the feeling that all of it felt so unnecessary.I absolutely loved the first one namely the brilliant simplicity of it's plot. It was a story of revenge distilled to it's core. It gave us a glimpse at an interesting world filled with interesting characters and I thought that was enough. The ending also tied up everything nicely. And while the sequel is not a bad film it felt like they should not have made another.

Anyway that was an overlong preamble to get to my question...

What is a ending(Ending of a show, movie, even character)that you felt was ruined by making a sequel or bringing a character back that would have been better just staying dead. It can be any show/game/movie/book
 

twistedmic

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This might be a minority opinion, but Pirates of the Caribbean should have been a single, stand alone movie. The sequels were mere shadows of the original.
Terminator 2: Judgement Day, Die Hard with a Vengeance, Aliens and Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade should have been the end of those franchises.
To add to that, the Alien vs Predator movies should not have been made.

Though I will say that Alien: Covenant shows promise and I am interested in seeing what James Cameron can do when the rights to Terminator revert back to him.
 

KissingSunlight

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Alien and The Terminator should have been stand alone movies. The sequels to those movies were really over-rated and unnecessary.

I had this discussion last week. I thought Buffy The Vampire Slayer should have ended at Season 5. The season finale was a million times better than the one they ended on. Also, we could have skipped the last two "emo" seasons.
 

Hawki

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I can nominate:

-Aliens: Okay, here's the thing with the first three Alien films...you could end the series at any one of them. Alien doesn't need a sequel, Aliens doesn't need a sequel, Alien 3 doesn't need a sequel, Resurrection doesn't need a sequel. That said, of the four, I think ending at Alien 3 would be the most appropriate.

Now, I don't deny that may be unpopular, but I've always considered Alien 3 to be criminally underrated, at least based on the Assembly Cut. And like I said, you could have ended it earlier and not lost anything. Still, I feel the first three films form a nice trilogy, with each film having a different 'essence,' and each film being executed quite well, even if Alien and Aliens are notably better than Alien 3. But Resurrection doesn't quite fit this arc. Not in terms of time period, not in terms of protagonist, not in term of themes. So, I don't think the Alien universe had to end at 3, but for me, Alien 3 did a nice job of closing out Ripley's story. She goes from innocent space trucker (Alien), to badass space warrior (Aliens) to war-weary leader (Alien 3). Like I said, I'm more charitable to Alien 3 than most, but IMO, Resurrection isn't needed in the arc in question.

-Avatar (movie): I really like this movie, even if others don't, but as a pre-emptive entry, I don't think sequels are needed.

-Diablo III: Mixed thoughts about this, because I can't claim that there was no plot hook to follow after the very ending. Thing is, yes, I like D3, and quite like the ending cinematic of the vanilla game. Since that point in time, circumstances on Sanctuary have gone from bad to worse, reinforcing that Sanctuary is indeed a shithole for average joe, and any bright spots are doomed to fade.

Which I can't deny is thematically appropriate, but still, I'd have been content storywise if the story did indeed end with the promise of a new dawn.

-Firefly: The film Serenity. As in, I'm not fond of the sequel comics that followed, or at least, 'Leaves on the Wind', what with the introduction of characters like Kalista (bleh), and the promise of a new rebellion forming. IMO, the film was a perfect way to cap off the series.

-Golden Sun: Not one of the most egregious examples, because I can't deny that The Lost Age did have some plot points that could be followed up, namely Alex and Anemos. Then came Dark Dawn, which introduces completely new plot points, draws out Alex's arc even further, and has left the series on a cliffhanger. So, yeah - narrative-wise, I think the series should have ended in the second installment.

-Halo: Should have ended with Halo: Reach, as it served not only as a good prequel to Combat Evolved, but also an excellent book-end for the series as a whole. Then came Halo 4 and...sigh...

-Harry Potter: Cursed Child isn't needed. It's not bad per se, but it doesn't really add anything to the overall story, and if anything, detracts from it (one word - "Delphi." Gah.)

-Mass Effect: Okay, only played the first Mass Effect, but it strikes me that Andromeda would have been better served as a new IP. However, this is still one of the least egregious examples on the list.

-My Little Pony: Specifically the Equestria Girls series, namely 'Legend of Everfree'. This would be a long post explaining why, but the short version is that the fourth film doesn't really fit in with the rest of the series, at least under the premise that films 1-3 are really Sunset's story, not Twilight's, while the fourth film is just...there.

Also arguably Friendship is Magic should have ended with season 5, but really, that's the kind of show that can go on ad infinitum, as the status quo generally remains in place, even if there's distinct continuity.

-Pirates of the Caribbean: Well, on that note:

twistedmic said:
This might be a minority opinion, but Pirates of the Caribbean should have been a single, stand alone movie. The sequels were mere shadows of the original.
I don't think that's as unpopular as you think it is. Still, far as I'm concerned, the films go 1>2>3>4. I'd be happy for just one film, but by film 4, it really became clear that the series should have ended with the third installment.

-Pokemon: Jesus Christ, just end it already, or at least shift protagonist. Ash will never catch them all, he'll never become a Pokemon master, he'll never age, he'll never experience character development, he'll never hook up with anyone, I mean...gah!

-Red vs. Blue: I'd like to nominate two points to end the series - season 5, or season 8. Season 5 was a fine ending, while season 6 is, IMO, the show's best season. Unfortunately, seasons 7 and 8 were a bit lackustre, but ending them there would have spared us from Freelancer. So, season 5, or season 8.

-Resident Evil: Resident Evil 5. It felt like a good conclusion to the series as a whole, even if there were other plot points that could be followed up.

-The Simpsons: Come on, you let Futurama go out with dignity. :(

-Sonic the Hedgehog: Not necessarily the games, but rather the comic series. Namely:

**Archie: Should have ended at issue 125 or issue 50, I'm mixed. Issue 125 if it ended happily and not with a cliffhanger. If not, Issue 50 would have been perfect, since it had Robotnik's defeat, Sonic and Sally hook up, etc. The only reason that 50 isn't definitive is that some of the series's best issues came between issues 75 and 125, but after 125, something went...off. Maybe it's because I got older, maybe it was the art style, maybe it was the tonal inconsistancies that started popping up, but either way, one of those two.

**Fleetaway: Okay, technically it did end at issue 184, but did they have to drag it out? I know there's a continuation, but thematically, I felt the series ended when it had to.

-StarCraft: Namely, Legacy of the Void...maybe. Okay, Nova Covert Ops was fun, Evolution was good, in as much that it introduced a lot of new concepts (e.g. the adostra), so it remains to be seen whether the series should have ended at LotV. But, honestly, after LotV, I felt the series ended perfectly.

-Star Wars: Return of the Jedi. Okay, fine, I'm sure good EU works came out afterwards, but seriously, who watched the end of the film and asked for a sequel? I'm not saying Star Wars as a concept should have ended, but, well, TFA does undo a lot of what RotJ accomplished, basically resetting the status quo, so I ask again, who asked for this?

-Terminator: Terminator 2. I won't deny I like Salvation and Genisys, the latter of which can be seen as a bookender to the series (which would be another discussion entirely), but I won't deny that the series peaked at this point. It's made all the worse by Terminator 3, which...sigh...

-The Walking Dead: I'm mixed about this, but I'd like to submit the idea that maybe the TV series should have ended at season 3. Now, this is a long story, but I feel it needs explanation.

Of the five series I've seen, it goes 3>4>1>2>5, so while 4 is a good season, seasons 1-3 form a natural arc in my eyes. Season 1 serves as an introduction to this new world, and it cements at the end of how the group are truly on their own (end of the CDC, last vestiges of civilization, etc. Season 2 is based around the group trying to recapture their old lives (the farm), only to end with failure, and Rick turning for the darker. Season 3, for me, has great thematic inverse between Rick and the Governor - both people who were good, were pushed to the brink, who do terrible things, both look out for their own, and both collide. Come the end, the Governor's been defeated, but even after all that's occurred, Rick does let his humanity come through (at this point being more humane than Carl), lets the people of Woodbury into the prison), and, at this point in time, has a secure location at said prison, not to mention that by this time, he's recovered from Lori's death. Taking season 3 as a hypothetical ending, we have a recovery from the darkness of the end of season 2, and an overall optimistic view on the future. That in the end, it's humanity (as in, being humane) that pulls through. Nice, simple arc.

Now, ending at season 3 would have cost us season 4, but come season 5...yeah. And maybe my ideal ending is too optimistic for the setting, but, well, there you go.
 

Thaluikhain

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I didn't mind Pirates4, except for that annoying Johnny Depp person. Originally was going to be a stand alone story, but they stuck it into the franchise.

Stargate SG-1 should have ended when they finally defeated Anubis for reals, if not earlier.
 

bartholen_v1legacy

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A recent case I can think of doesn't even have a sequel, it's more of a Return of the King type scenario. The new Martin Scorsese film Silence.
So after 2 hours of essentially psychological trauma and torture the main character finally gives in, and renounces his faith. He continues his life in Japan as a sort of reverse priest, whose job is to find Christian paraphernalia on arriving foreigners, and make sure it's destroyed. This is perceived from the point of an entirely new character in voiceover, signifying a quite clear ending. But it goes on for like 15 minutes! And through all of it we learn nothing new about the characters, no significant events happen, and it drags on forever.

Chrono Cross following Chrono Trigger. I haven't even played it, and I'm sure it's a fine game, but Chrono Trigger's ending is so perfectly sweet it never needed to be expanded upon. It's my go-to example of a happy ending done right. As far as I'm concerned, everyone returned to their respective ages and lived happily ever after. Except Magus of course.
 

Redryhno

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KissingSunlight said:
Alien and The Terminator should have been stand alone movies. The sequels to those movies were really over-rated and unnecessary.

I had this discussion last week. I thought Buffy The Vampire Slayer should have ended at Season 5. The season finale was a million times better than the one they ended on. Also, we could have skipped the last two "emo" seasons.
Personally I think it should've ended at season 3(4? Whichever one gave us the best villain to ever appear on the show in the Mayor). He was campy enough to love, but just dangerous enough in-universe to feel like a threat. And that whole graduating class defense scene was neat.

After that it just got so fucking caught up in itself. It couldn't decide if random people knew about the occult or not the longer it went on. It decided that magic, that thing that nobody should really practice more than absolutely necessary due to how dangerous it was(and even then, by someone that actually has half a clue of how dangerous it could be), was a-ok. But only so long as Willow did it. The kid that was going to off himself using it wasn't ok in any way, shape or form and he wasn't deserving of friendship despite that being the one single thing he ever wanted(he went over the line with it sure, but at least he did what he could to make it right, which is a helluva lot more than Willow ever did). And even after making a big deal out of people making fun of the guy, Buffy and Willow go right into making fun of him, in front of the guy. At least the people they were throwing a fit at were doing it behind his back.

Also Seth Green left the show, and Oz leaving just torpedoed Willow's character development as far as I'm concerned(and by extension, most of the group simply because he was the one actual mature one, fucked up the character balance so much, even if Zander grew into that around the middle of season 6 with his ex-demon girlfriend). What's-her-name had no defining trait besides being the lesbian witch that turned into the dead lesbian witch, which sorta carried into Willow simply being the lesbian witch. Not to mention that trope of a bad breakup turning women gay, not even a mention or whisper of the possibility of bi, is so fucking tired.
 

Kyrian007

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bartholen said:
Chrono Cross following Chrono Trigger. I haven't even played it, and I'm sure it's a fine game, but Chrono Trigger's ending is so perfectly sweet it never needed to be expanded upon. It's my go-to example of a happy ending done right. As far as I'm concerned, everyone returned to their respective ages and lived happily ever after. Except Magus of course.
It isn't really expanded on, and I would suggest playing Chrono Cross. The only major connection between the two, is the events in Cross are kicked off by the results of the ending of Trigger. But otherwise it may as well happen on another planet or in a tangential reality or timeline. The connections are very subtle at best. Like Square does with continuity between Final Fantasy installments. Chrono Cross won't ruin anyone's take on Chrono Trigger. Both are in my top ten, and when asked (just to be contrary) I usually say Cross is my favorite.
 

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Halo 3 didn't need a sequel. I don't mean ODST and Reach, they are fine. (though I wouldn't recommend paying 60 bucks for odst) but the idea of a halo 4 just didn't make sense from the start. Same goes for mass effect: andromeda which has no artistic reason to exist. Both those stories had pretty conclusive endings that didn't leave much room for sequels. In the case of halo: peace with what is left of the covenant, the flood defeated, the monitor killed, gravemind killed, the prophet of truth killed, etc. With mass effect, there was a single overarching storyline and that one is done. For both of these goes, if they had a brilliant idea for a sequel, then even if it wouldn't make immediate sense to me I could get it, but halo 4 was just a pile of meh and mass effect andromeda is mediocre from what I hear.
 

sXeth

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Terminator probably should've ended at the 2nd (Happy ending) or maybe 3rd one (Not so happy ending, as the machine war is inevitable, but John Connor more or less completes his arc and becomes the founder of the resistance in the present timeline)


Heroes (Tv series). Pick a character death or season finale, lol. They tried to play "anyone can die", but also didn't seem willing to let any fan favorites go away. So the whole thing became a mess of reset buttons, retcons, and randomly dropped plots. Ironically true to their inspiration material in comics, but kind of derailing the longer it went (How many times will Sylar/Claire/Peter die/lose their powers then inexplicably come back!. How will Bennett redeem himself this season!").
 

JemothSkarii

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My one will be a tad controversial, but Supernatural you know that show about those brothers that shoot salt at ghosts? Yeah, that one.

Loved it, adored it even. Spirits and such really tickle my fancy, and I enjoyed the modern wild west feel it gave.

But it should have ended at Season 5. I remember watching the ending and going 'Wow, they wrapped up everything, even thematically'.
Then I started watching Season 6 and I was all 'Wait, this is dumb, this is shit'. It's like having closure then some asshole rips it back open.
I later discovered it was meant to end with Season 5 but MONEY happened.

Yeah, didn't watch past a couple of episodes into Season Six. Don't think I ever will. Made me mad as all hell.
 

Hawki

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Thaluikhain said:
I didn't mind Pirates4, except for that annoying Johnny Depp person. Originally was going to be a stand alone story, but they stuck it into the franchise.
Stand-alone as in separate characters, or stand-alone in terms of plot? Haven't seen anything suggesting that.

Thaluikhain said:
Stargate SG-1 should have ended when they finally defeated Anubis for reals, if not earlier.
While one of the less egregious examples, I am inclined to agree. I don't think SG-1 suffers per se from continuing onwards, but I do feel that the Ori lacked a lot of the 'oomph' that the goa'uld had, not the least of which is that we barely see them, and a lot of time is spent on side-stories in the last two seasons. If anything, dealing primarily with the Lucian Alliance would be a better plot arc - focusing on the power vacuum of the Milky Way rather than arbitrarily introducing another big bad.

Seth Carter said:
Terminator probably should've ended at the 2nd (Happy ending) or maybe 3rd one (Not so happy ending, as the machine war is inevitable, but John Connor more or less completes his arc and becomes the founder of the resistance in the present timeline)
As mentioned above, I'm of the opinion that the Terminator series would have ideally ended with T2, at least as far as the movies went. Ending with T3 however, is an idea that does have some merit in my eyes...sort of. Still, it does ring hollow, because not only is T3 to T2 what The Force Awakens is to A New Hope (in terms of plot repetition), but it's basically the antithesis of the previous films thematically. The first two, especially the second, emphasize the idea of "no fate," that the future isn't immutable. T3 makes it clear that the future can't be changed, which makes a lot of T2 a waste of time. At best, they pushed JD a bit into the future. At worst, they make an even worse JD because of there being more people in the world to die, not to mention that Salvation (to its credit) emphasizes how much the timeline has changed.

So, yeah, really not a T3 fan. I will reiterate that if the Terminator series couldn't end with T2, Genisys does make a better series ender than T3, though I'm guessing that's not a popular opinion.

JemothSkarii said:
My one will be a tad controversial, but Supernatural you know that show about those brothers that shoot salt at ghosts? Yeah, that one.
That's controversial? I've never seen Supernatural, but every time I've seen it mentioned, it's usually with the notion that the series should have ended long ago.
 

09philj

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Samtemdo8 said:
09philj said:
Death Note. You know when.
People really wanted Light to win in the end and become God Emperor of the entire world?
At least
Mello and Near wouldn't have been it. Not a fantastic ending, but it would have gone out on a high rather than just muddling along for a few more volumes of hugely inferior work.
 

WhiteFangofWhoa

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Lots of people saying Pirates of the Carribean, but I did enjoy the original trilogy. It wrapped up very neatly and Davey Jones and Cutler Beckett were both excellent villains. Everything after AWE has looked like mere window dressing at best, and even Depp's character can only carry things for so long.

No, you know what Disney property I really feel needs to stop before they make another sequel? Toy Story. The third could not have ended things on a more triumphant note, but now they want to make a fourth.
 

BrawlMan

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09philj said:
Death Note. You know when.
My problem with the ending is how it ended, more than anything else. I fucking HATE Near. HAAAATTTE.

Shaman King (manga) - The ending is overly long and pretentious compared to the TV adaption. Yes, the manga came first, but the writers knew what they were actually doing, while the original writer for the manga had misanthropy stuck up his or her anal hole.

There are no sequels to Aliens and Terminator 2, just very bad live action fan fics.

Furious 7 should have been the last movie. The death of Paul Walker does not help matters. I am glad all the other actors are getting work, but there is nothing left to the series. If they go in to space for F&F 9, then anything else is going to be a step backwards. It will be the Jason X/Mario Galaxy pronlem.

There is only 1 Land Before Time. The sequels never happened.

Gurren Lagann and Panty & Stocking. You fans know exactly what I am talking about. Because of the ending to GL, I'll never buy the box set at all. With Panty and Stocking, turn off the video before the after credit sequence. What is with Gainax and their endings?!

The Karate Kid only needed two movies. Not two rehashed sequels, and a remake that should have been called The Kung Fu Kid.
 

Catfood220

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KissingSunlight said:
I had this discussion last week. I thought Buffy The Vampire Slayer should have ended at Season 5. The season finale was a million times better than the one they ended on. Also, we could have skipped the last two "emo" seasons.
If not season 5, then it definitely should have ended after season 7. I mean, that wrapped everything up nicely, Sunnydale and the Hellmouth destroyed and Buffy finally getting away from the Slayer life that she always wanted to do. They shouldn't have continued on in comic book form, there really was no need.
 

Poetic Nova

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I don't acknowledge the Bioshock Infinite DLC's as cannon, since it all hangs on a very flimsy reason that's in my view impossible to have happend.

Any Hellraiser movie after the third I simply don't ackowledge at all.
 

Canadamus Prime

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Kyrian007 said:
bartholen said:
Chrono Cross following Chrono Trigger. I haven't even played it, and I'm sure it's a fine game, but Chrono Trigger's ending is so perfectly sweet it never needed to be expanded upon. It's my go-to example of a happy ending done right. As far as I'm concerned, everyone returned to their respective ages and lived happily ever after. Except Magus of course.
It isn't really expanded on, and I would suggest playing Chrono Cross. The only major connection between the two, is the events in Cross are kicked off by the results of the ending of Trigger. But otherwise it may as well happen on another planet or in a tangential reality or timeline. The connections are very subtle at best. Like Square does with continuity between Final Fantasy installments. Chrono Cross won't ruin anyone's take on Chrono Trigger. Both are in my top ten, and when asked (just to be contrary) I usually say Cross is my favorite.
That is why I ignore all connections between the 2 games, despite the CT remakes' tacked on epilogues trying to tie the 2 games together. Fall of Guardia? Never happened. Disappearance of the Masamune? Never happened.