ESA Weighs In On Possible Xbox 360 Ban

[Kinguendo]

I own a 360 and all that but... if they infringe upon patents then they shouldnt be punished as money is involved?! What the fuck is the point in patents then? I would see Microsoft burn and all 360s be recalled before I accept this kind of bullshit corporate hypocrisy.

 

[RvLeshrac]

I think I speak for all Xbox owners when I say imposing a Licensing Agreement has a MUCH better ring to it.

Well played. Except for the part where it isn't fucking funny, since it could result in the loss of hundreds of thousands of jobs in the US, and millions of additional jobs world-wide.

I fail to see the source of that exaggeration, care to expand a little bit please?

Is it *really* necessary to provide a citation for why the blocking of import of one of the leading consumer entertainment products might cause job losses both in the US and in each country which produces the components for the product?

Not to mention the fact that banning the product from import into the US would lend greater legitimacy to the claim, likely leading to import holds in most Western countries.

This is basic market economics, not neurosurgery or astrophysics.

I mean, I guess I could dumb it down a bit for you. Here:

"When it isn't legal for you to sell your product, you start firing people."

 

[RvLeshrac]

I own a 360 and all that but... if they infringe upon patents then they shouldnt be punished as money is involved?! What the fuck is the point in patents then? I would see Microsoft burn and all 360s be recalled before I accept this kind of bullshit corporate hypocrisy.

You're guilty of murder. Since I said it, it must be true. We'll execute you now, then hold your trial in three weeks.

I mean, the evidence against you is substantial, so why should we bother going to trial BEFORE handing out a punishment?

 

[008Zulu_v1legacy]

I wonder if Microsoft will make the rumoured X360 emulator for Windows a reality now?

 

[Therumancer]

If it were to happen it wouldn't affect multiplatform games and consumers could just play those games on the PS3 and/or WiiU when it releases.

However Microsoft is a US company and the US goverment received revenues from it doing business both here and abroad. What's more the other major console manufacturers are from other countries.

If Microsoft had the 360 banned this would allow foreign business interests to dominate the market unopposed, and the US would lose the revenues it would be getting from the success of it's product. We don't want this rising, billion dollar industry to be totally dominated by imports.

Gamers would still have games, but it's a bigger issue than that. This is why there are exclusions and specific laws and rulings that can be made for the greater good. Mororola's rights in this case might very well do damage on a level well beyond punishing Microsoft due to how entrenched Microsoft became and how it's the only major player for the US in the console/hardware arena.

It's a touchy subject, and I have mixed feelings about it. I don't think the 360 should be pulled or Microsoft crippled, like it or not in the big pictures they are "our" guys on this battlefield. On the other hand I *DO* think Microsoft should be required to pay something to Motorola over a period of time, and that this provides justification for increased scruitiny by the goverment into Microsoft's overall business practices.

There needs to be a penelty, but the obvious thing of pulling the 360 can't really happen because it affects so much more than Microsoft in the big picture right now. They do that, and we're pretty much giving the gaming industry (at least the hardware aspect of things) over to non-US (Japanese) interests which isn't a good thing from an economic perspective.

 

[Kinguendo]

I own a 360 and all that but... if they infringe upon patents then they shouldnt be punished as money is involved?! What the fuck is the point in patents then? I would see Microsoft burn and all 360s be recalled before I accept this kind of bullshit corporate hypocrisy.

You're guilty of murder. Since I said it, it must be true. We'll execute you now, then hold your trial in three weeks.

I mean, the evidence against you is substantial, so why should we bother going to trial BEFORE handing out a punishment?

Except that in reality there is absolutely no evidence of your claim... have you read the article? Do they say that it isnt patented? No, in fact it quite categorically states it does infringe upon patents... so what the hell are you talking about?

 

[OldNewNewOld]

I'm against a ban of the console, but I'm for a HUGE fine. Let it be like 10$ per sold console.
Hey, still less than per pirated song which is basically 20.000$

Why should MS be excluded from the law? Why should they be able to use Google's technology without paying. If they didn't like the price that Google asked, they should have just removed the technology, or made their own if they think they will make it cheaper.

They had plenty of other choices, legal choices.

I'm baffled that so many people here are on the side of Microsoft, jet they take every chance they get to insult pirates and say how there is no apology for piracy.
Guess what, this is basically the same. MS took something that isn't their without paying because the price was to high.

EDIT:
And do you guys really think that a ban of the xbox 360 would have a that huge impact on the US economy to allow such a hypocrisy?
lets face it, this generation is over. I doubt the number of sold consoles until the nextbox will be significant compared to the total numbers. I doubt the PS3 or WiiU would take over the market of the xbox 720.

The only thing that banning the xbox would really do is show that a company doesn't own the country. But judging from the fact that the court is still trying to find a way to get MS out of the shit, I would say that the companies do own the USA.

 

[Epona]

If it were to happen it wouldn't affect multiplatform games and consumers could just play those games on the PS3 and/or WiiU when it releases.

However Microsoft is a US company and the US goverment received revenues from it doing business both here and abroad. What's more the other major console manufacturers are from other countries.

If Microsoft had the 360 banned this would allow foreign business interests to dominate the market unopposed, and the US would lose the revenues it would be getting from the success of it's product. We don't want this rising, billion dollar industry to be totally dominated by imports.

Gamers would still have games, but it's a bigger issue than that. This is why there are exclusions and specific laws and rulings that can be made for the greater good. Mororola's rights in this case might very well do damage on a level well beyond punishing Microsoft due to how entrenched Microsoft became and how it's the only major player for the US in the console/hardware arena.

It's a touchy subject, and I have mixed feelings about it. I don't think the 360 should be pulled or Microsoft crippled, like it or not in the big pictures they are "our" guys on this battlefield. On the other hand I *DO* think Microsoft should be required to pay something to Motorola over a period of time, and that this provides justification for increased scruitiny by the goverment into Microsoft's overall business practices.

There needs to be a penelty, but the obvious thing of pulling the 360 can't really happen because it affects so much more than Microsoft in the big picture right now. They do that, and we're pretty much giving the gaming industry (at least the hardware aspect of things) over to non-US (Japanese) interests which isn't a good thing from an economic perspective.

Before the XBOX the game industry was owned by the Japanese. It didn't kill us then and it won't kill us now. Microsoft is more interested in making a cable box in the future anyway.

 

[RvLeshrac]

I own a 360 and all that but... if they infringe upon patents then they shouldnt be punished as money is involved?! What the fuck is the point in patents then? I would see Microsoft burn and all 360s be recalled before I accept this kind of bullshit corporate hypocrisy.

You're guilty of murder. Since I said it, it must be true. We'll execute you now, then hold your trial in three weeks.

I mean, the evidence against you is substantial, so why should we bother going to trial BEFORE handing out a punishment?

Except that in reality there is absolutely no evidence of your claim... have you read the article? Do they say that it isnt patented? No, in fact it quite categorically states it does infringe upon patents... so what the hell are you talking about?

Have you read the article? Or been keeping up with the case for months now? This case hasn't even gone to trial yet, and the bulk of the evidence is actually on Microsoft's side.

 

[RvLeshrac]

I'm against a ban of the console, but I'm for a HUGE fine. Let it be like 10$ per sold console.
Hey, still less than per pirated song which is basically 20.000$

Why should MS be excluded from the law? Why should they be able to use Google's technology without paying. If they didn't like the price that Google asked, they should have just removed the technology, or made their own if they think they will make it cheaper.

They had plenty of other choices, legal choices.

I'm baffled that so many people here are on the side of Microsoft, jet they take every chance they get to insult pirates and say how there is no apology for piracy.
Guess what, this is basically the same. MS took something that isn't their without paying because the price was to high.

EDIT:
And do you guys really think that a ban of the xbox 360 would have a that huge impact on the US economy to allow such a hypocrisy?
lets face it, this generation is over. I doubt the number of sold consoles until the nextbox will be significant compared to the total numbers. I doubt the PS3 or WiiU would take over the market of the xbox 720.

The only thing that banning the xbox would really do is show that a company doesn't own the country. But judging from the fact that the court is still trying to find a way to get MS out of the shit, I would say that the companies do own the USA.

I want you to read the articles. Read up on the patents. Motorola is holding certain patents which are necessary for the console to comply with international standards. Patents which they are required, by law and treaty, to license, but apparently have refused to license.

Even if Microsoft is infringing upon the patents, it may be *completely legal for them to do so* in this instance.

 

[Druyn]

They won't do it. Not only is it not really deserved, but no judge is going to consciously put a gun to the US (and thus, to a degree, the world's) head and pull the trigger like that. It'd be absolutely catastrophic damage for a company that wouldn't even gain anything from it.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

snip

I want you to read the articles. Read up on the patents. Motorola is holding certain patents which are necessary for the console to comply with international standards. Patents which they are required, by law and treaty, to license, but apparently have refused to license.

Even if Microsoft is infringing upon the patents, it may be *completely legal for them to do so* in this instance.

Motorola never refused to license. They only asked for more than MS was ready to pay. And they have the right to ask what they seem to be the right price. That's the core of capitalism. I own something, you want to buy it. I tell you the price, you either accept, decline or give me a price. Now I can accept or decline.

That was at least the story from some previous news about this problem.

 

[Kinguendo]

I own a 360 and all that but... if they infringe upon patents then they shouldnt be punished as money is involved?! What the fuck is the point in patents then? I would see Microsoft burn and all 360s be recalled before I accept this kind of bullshit corporate hypocrisy.

You're guilty of murder. Since I said it, it must be true. We'll execute you now, then hold your trial in three weeks.

I mean, the evidence against you is substantial, so why should we bother going to trial BEFORE handing out a punishment?

Except that in reality there is absolutely no evidence of your claim... have you read the article? Do they say that it isnt patented? No, in fact it quite categorically states it does infringe upon patents... so what the hell are you talking about?

Have you read the article? Or been keeping up with the case for months now? This case hasn't even gone to trial yet, and the bulk of the evidence is actually on Microsoft's side.

In May, Judge David Shaw recommended to the International Trade Commission that the importation and sale of the Xbox 360 be banned in the United States because the console infringes upon patents held by Motorola.

Bish, bash, bosh. Case closed. Job done. Game over. Go to bed.

 

[Steve the Pocket]

This would be the same ESA that supported the PROTECT-IP Act earlier this year, yes? The bill that would have imposed more or less this very same sort of blanket ban on websites for equally innocent "infringements" as the ones Microsoft is guilty of?

Fuck them, and fuck what they think about this or anything else.

 

[Dryk]

There are lot of reasons this is stupid. But that shouldn't legitimise what is effectively a "My client is too rich and famous to go to prison" defence... oh who am I kidding it's the US they legtitimised that defence ages ago.

 

[Eveonline100]

I'm against a ban of the console, but I'm for a HUGE fine. Let it be like 10$ per sold console.
Hey, still less than per pirated song which is basically 20.000$

Why should MS be excluded from the law? Why should they be able to use Google's technology without paying. If they didn't like the price that Google asked, they should have just removed the technology, or made their own if they think they will make it cheaper.

They had plenty of other choices, legal choices.

I'm baffled that so many people here are on the side of Microsoft, jet they take every chance they get to insult pirates and say how there is no apology for piracy.
Guess what, this is basically the same. MS took something that isn't their without paying because the price was to high.

EDIT:
And do you guys really think that a ban of the xbox 360 would have a that huge impact on the US economy to allow such a hypocrisy?
lets face it, this generation is over. I doubt the number of sold consoles until the nextbox will be significant compared to the total numbers. I doubt the PS3 or WiiU would take over the market of the xbox 720.

The only thing that banning the xbox would really do is show that a company doesn't own the country. But judging from the fact that the court is still trying to find a way to get MS out of the shit, I would say that the companies do own the USA.

I think a fine would be a nice compromices if they are banned then MS will have to layoff works(trust me i don't want to see anyone lose their jobs. Also your right its unlikely that this would a serouis impact on the economy(this is partof the reason why i would like to see a fine not a ban).

 

[Something Amyss]

I think I speak for all Xbox owners when I say imposing a Licensing Agreement has a MUCH better ring to it.

Well played. Except for the part where it isn't fucking funny, since it could result in the loss of hundreds of thousands of jobs in the US, and millions of additional jobs world-wide.

Gee, if only someone had thought about it before they went through with this.

 

[DaHero]

Now the human part of me is thinking that this could be bad for the economy, for the job rate, and all that stuff.

But there's still a part of me, a small part, call it the monster, that hopes this spells the end of the next CoD/shooter-chat room FPS game.

It's a small part, but it's there. No matter how many times I tell it to go away, it doesn't. The majority of me still hopes this doesn't lead to a mass loss of hardworking people, because life is hard enough right now.

 

[theultimateend]

I say ban the 360 till they make a Viva Pinata 3. It's been too long.

 

[Imthatguy]

Dammit someone ninja'd me to pointing out that this it a proxy battle between google and microsoft.

Anyway yet another case for why software codec copyrights are A BAD IDEA.