Agreed, and the "hurpa durpa girly men" (works better spoken, trust me) thing people go on about needs to die. In a fire.Awexsome said:
Also, it appears nobody used my link to his 9 review, as shown by the continuing cries of Japanophile.
Escape to the Movies: Halo Legends
- Thread starter MovieBob
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Also, it appears nobody used my link to his 9 review, as shown by the continuing cries of Japanophile.
And, by the same token, 'the West aka America' is represented by more than Master Chief and Gears of War. But given Bob choose to stereotype everything from Bioware games to Half Life to Bioshock to C&C as 'Halo', I don't see why my stereotype of Japan is any worse.Badassassin said:
Oh i know, his representation was totally biased. i'm just saying just cause he was biased to the west doesn't mean you should be biased to japan. at the risk of sounding like YOUR mom, "two wrongs don't make a right." lawl. I think we can all say honestly that since at least the Eli review, Bob is EXTREMELY biased. No way I look to him for which movie I should go see, I just observe it as a point of entertainment. Just how if you follow yahtzee's critiques to the word you wouldn't have any games but batman arkham asylum. But that doesn't mean he isn't the funniest guy on the escapist.Doug said:
Ok, maybe it was childish of me to go in the oppose extreme (though I generally don't like Japanese stuff in general - not necessarily because of the subject matter, more because of the gameplay styles they seem to like), but I'm sick to death of MovieBob claiming he's neutral and hates Japanophiles and then actually being an intense Japanophile.Badassassin said:
Yeah like I said, Bob is too biased to look to for movie advice. But to me, as long as he stays funny I can let that whole thing fly because I can make my own decisions. I don't like Japanese games either, I just don't like the characters that much in general. It's like every person in japan gets a hard on whenever they see something overly cute.Doug said:
>.> Ok, I've heard it from just about everyone else, Moviebob (the latest to protest there hate for Halo) has finally roused my to make a point. (note, I am fully prepared for the waves of hate towards me that are on the way, so don't bother, I will not be returning to check these comments after my post).
I am sick of this stereotype image of all Halo Fanboys being these Rabid, stick-stupid meatheads who ask "can-I-haz-xbox" and think that anything with more story then Borderlands is "too wordy". I love Half-life, Mass Effect 1&2 are some of my favorite games, and I'm even a fan of the old Final Fantasy games. Heck, I wonder how many people actually had heard of Ender's Game (or read the entire Shadow Series) before this Review. But I still feel, even before the second (and especially before the second) game came out, Halo was one of the most compelling stories I'd played in a game. Why? Because I was able to get into the Chief's helmet easier then any other role I've ever played. Is it the most original story every? No, but it wasn't trying to be.
I am sick of this stereotype image of all Halo Fanboys being these Rabid, stick-stupid meatheads who ask "can-I-haz-xbox" and think that anything with more story then Borderlands is "too wordy". I love Half-life, Mass Effect 1&2 are some of my favorite games, and I'm even a fan of the old Final Fantasy games. Heck, I wonder how many people actually had heard of Ender's Game (or read the entire Shadow Series) before this Review. But I still feel, even before the second (and especially before the second) game came out, Halo was one of the most compelling stories I'd played in a game. Why? Because I was able to get into the Chief's helmet easier then any other role I've ever played. Is it the most original story every? No, but it wasn't trying to be.
This review was another stump upon which Moviebob can spew his biased, non-factual, and frankly idiotic opinions and dress them up as criticism. Industry wide it's being acknowledged that the Japanese creative game market is stagnant, even from the Japanese themselves, look up interviews from the last tepid Tokyo Game Show if you don't believe me.
He comes across as an angry Nintendo fanboy, blasting his rage that these, in his opinion, inferior franchises have succeeded in the West. Setting aside that his opinions on Halo are unfounded, I've found that Halo hatred is a symptom of internet backlash rage at anything that gets popular enough and that most haters despise the games fans and its popularity outside gaming culture.
He ignores that most of the development in gaming over the past ten years has come from Western game developers, not the Japanese. I can think of Half-Life, Bioshock, Assassin's Creed, Gears of War, Obilvion, Fallout 3, Killzone, Uncharted, Modern Warfare, Mass Effect, Grand Theft Auto and that's just relatively recent games I can pull out off the top of my head.
Bob is ignoring the way gaming has been going, and his very ugly bias and ignorance shows
He comes across as an angry Nintendo fanboy, blasting his rage that these, in his opinion, inferior franchises have succeeded in the West. Setting aside that his opinions on Halo are unfounded, I've found that Halo hatred is a symptom of internet backlash rage at anything that gets popular enough and that most haters despise the games fans and its popularity outside gaming culture.
He ignores that most of the development in gaming over the past ten years has come from Western game developers, not the Japanese. I can think of Half-Life, Bioshock, Assassin's Creed, Gears of War, Obilvion, Fallout 3, Killzone, Uncharted, Modern Warfare, Mass Effect, Grand Theft Auto and that's just relatively recent games I can pull out off the top of my head.
Bob is ignoring the way gaming has been going, and his very ugly bias and ignorance shows
In response to MovieBob:
You do appear to enjoy caricaturizing Halo's fanbase, don't you. I mean, it's not like each and every game fanbase has it's share of mouth breathing, drooling troglodytes or anything. Nope, it's us who are the idiots.
To tell the truth I don't think Halo is that great, but I still enjoy it and it's expanded fiction enough to warrant a defense against the straw man argument you've seem to have created.
You keep making up points of how Halo is some muscle-tripping, testosterone filled cock-fest about beefy zipped up muscle-men beating down endless waves of bad guys in order to save humanity and get the girl. I think you've mistaken it with Gears of War (I know you haven't but just listen) whose unapologetic scandalous methods are intentionally done as such and shouldn't be taken seriously. Halo on the other hand actually has some depth, emulating world events such as ultra religious militaristic pragmaticism in the form of the covenant and a group of terroristic insurgents attempting to break away from the overly controlling human government. I'll admit Halo's story isn't exactly original unto itself but unravels in an at least glance-worthy way.
I understand some discrepancies you might have with the series but everything you've shown has been one giant bought of misinformation that is indicative enough that you really didn't give the series nothing more than a passing glance. Yes, I'll say it, the story doesn't feel all that good or well written without the expanded fiction, and you'll reply that if a game can't stand on it's own two feet than it is isn't good to begin with. There is however, only so much story one can fit into a game, something that Halo doesn't do all that well admittedly, but could never have been fit into, as you described, a truly multiplayer centric game.
I wrote this with the greatest amount of humility I possess, and I hope to death you don't take this overly-long and complex post as an insult as an insult it is not.
You do appear to enjoy caricaturizing Halo's fanbase, don't you. I mean, it's not like each and every game fanbase has it's share of mouth breathing, drooling troglodytes or anything. Nope, it's us who are the idiots.
To tell the truth I don't think Halo is that great, but I still enjoy it and it's expanded fiction enough to warrant a defense against the straw man argument you've seem to have created.
You keep making up points of how Halo is some muscle-tripping, testosterone filled cock-fest about beefy zipped up muscle-men beating down endless waves of bad guys in order to save humanity and get the girl. I think you've mistaken it with Gears of War (I know you haven't but just listen) whose unapologetic scandalous methods are intentionally done as such and shouldn't be taken seriously. Halo on the other hand actually has some depth, emulating world events such as ultra religious militaristic pragmaticism in the form of the covenant and a group of terroristic insurgents attempting to break away from the overly controlling human government. I'll admit Halo's story isn't exactly original unto itself but unravels in an at least glance-worthy way.
I understand some discrepancies you might have with the series but everything you've shown has been one giant bought of misinformation that is indicative enough that you really didn't give the series nothing more than a passing glance. Yes, I'll say it, the story doesn't feel all that good or well written without the expanded fiction, and you'll reply that if a game can't stand on it's own two feet than it is isn't good to begin with. There is however, only so much story one can fit into a game, something that Halo doesn't do all that well admittedly, but could never have been fit into, as you described, a truly multiplayer centric game.
I wrote this with the greatest amount of humility I possess, and I hope to death you don't take this overly-long and complex post as an insult as an insult it is not.
You mean, you hated system shock, as far is it sucking, you are horribly wrong in every aspect. Being one of the highest ranking games made of its time and all....simmeh said:
"so basically".... Thats a bs statement to make. There is no point wasting time with large list when you only had to name a few.
Moving back to one of the first statements about japan vs the west. All and all moviebob, for someone who analyzes game stereotypes you really generalized all western gaming by saying all of them "including everything not an fps" were about 1 dimensional machismo marines. Tim Schafer, Will Wright, Peter Molyneux? I don't recall them making many military grunt base games.
So this thread finally got me to register.
I'm not going to defend bob's statement about "western game characters" as accurate, I really don't think it was intended to be. Bob's comment was likely a hyperbole, meant at least in part as joke.
Obviously not all western game characters are cookie cutter space marines with stubble. However, it it very rare to see a western game character who is not a realistically rendered human. More specifically, a medium to well built adult, dressed in either practical clothing or armour, and able to handle a weapon. The only exception to this I can think of is Brutal Legend, and not much of one.
While this is more accurate than what moviebob said, it's a lot less funny.
I'm not going to defend bob's statement about "western game characters" as accurate, I really don't think it was intended to be. Bob's comment was likely a hyperbole, meant at least in part as joke.
Obviously not all western game characters are cookie cutter space marines with stubble. However, it it very rare to see a western game character who is not a realistically rendered human. More specifically, a medium to well built adult, dressed in either practical clothing or armour, and able to handle a weapon. The only exception to this I can think of is Brutal Legend, and not much of one.
While this is more accurate than what moviebob said, it's a lot less funny.
Let's see:paragon1 said:
Brutal Legend - Yeah That's a unique Character
Assasin's Creed II - that one too
Mass Effect 1 & 2 - I man or a woman created from stock parts, because the creator's were too lazy to do it themselves
Dragon Age - Same as Mass Effect
Uncharted - A guy
Bioshock - A guy
Even if you look further, you'll find many similarities between the characters in terms of design:
Half Life - A guy in a Suit
Gears of War - A guy in Armor
Modern Warfare - A Soldier
Call of Duty - A Soldier
Medal of Honor - A Soldier
Wolfenstein - A Soldier
Halo - A guy in Armor
Duke Nukem - A guy (pretty bad ass one though)
inFamous - A guy
Prototype - A guy
God of War - a Guy with chain weapons
The Only exceptions I can think of are:
Prince of Persia
Rayman
Beyond Good and Evil
Western Point & Click Adventures
Battletoads
Mortal Kombat
XIII
Comic Book and Movie Characters don't count since they originated in a different medium.
Let's look to the popular japanese games:
Super Mario - Main Franchise(that game series alone almost as much distinguishable Characters as are listed Above)
Sonic The Hedgehog - a blue stylized hedgehog
Bomberman - a ... thing
Alex Kidd - what ever the hell he is supposed to be
Bionic Commando - a guy with a Bionic Arm
Kirby
Pikmin - a very stylized space explorer
Donkey Kong - a Monkey
Bubble Bobble - a dragon that shoots bubbles
Megaman - a Robot
Devil May Cry - A Guy who is a demon with a big ass sword and two Pistols
Bayonetta - a witch with guns attached to her feet, that uses her hair to create giant monsters
Final Fantasy IX (the only one not using stock character designs)
Dig Dug
No More Heroes
many japanese nes/snes/mega drive/saturn/pc-engine/dreamcast etc.
There a plenty of other memorable and distinguishable characters on Japanese side, I just don't have the time to write all of them down, BUT their game industry is much bigger than western game industry, and opposed to all great designed characters, they have many games featuring anime style stock character's too.
so i would say japan wins at the moment. But I see what moviebob was trying to say when he said that the western games are represented by guys with gun's. Because the western game industry is aiming that way, most of the recent games are FPS games featuring stock character designs of a guy with some gimmick attached to him, so it's not that far away from the truth.
*sigh* Um excuse me, but do you even know that he DOESN'T play video games?mchoueiri said:
And we have a variety of games? Like what kinds? Because all I normally see out are either Guitar Hero/Rock Band, FPS, or God Of War-like action games. He has a strong point when it comes to gaming in the west. Japan has much better quality games than we do here. We used to have a lot of variety but ever since the PS3 and 360 came out, it hasn't been very interesting.