Female Gamers: Are you tired of being presented with no dignity?

[Gyrefalcon]

I'm not even a woman and *I'M* tired of women being presented with very little dignity.

Gaming needs more female rolemodels like Alyx Vance.
I cannot think of a single better written female character in any video game to date.

Im a mother effing DOG and IM tired of women being presented with very little dignity. But in all seiousness, how can you expect to not be portrayed badly when there are several girls in meadia that promote this crap, and the girls that stand against it just whine about it to people on message boards.

And about the normal male character thing, has anybody played friggin Braid? This guy looks like someone who trolls 4chan (I know he's an adult, he just LOOKS like that) and yet he can muster the strength to keep on searching for his princess when all the castles are filled with dinsaurs. For those of you that havent played Braid, what is wrong with you?

EDIT: And I know Im late on the bandwagon here, I know its page 16.

Women lost their dignity when they started wearing mini skirts and hot pants on a regular basis.
Not when video games started portraying those women in video games.

Does that mean guys lost there dignity when they started wearing their pants below their underwear like aspiring plumbers? Or is this and mini-skirts/hot pants something you see in the bar more than at the workplace?

Still, even if you excuse the clothing, or lack of, styles in many video games, it doesn't address "the jiggle engine" such as used in DOA Extreme Beach Volleyball. Will we be seeing as much gravity defying jiggle factor on the guys? What is good for the goose is good for the gander right?

 

[Gyrefalcon]

I'm not even a woman and *I'M* tired of women being presented with very little dignity.


One word: WWE games
Also, what about the meat and two veg in the lost and damned eh? Haha.

But anyways, where I come from, I don't see any guys wearing there underwear like that. I on the other hand see girls in revealing clothes on a regular basis.

Ha ha ha! True-but are those games designed to sell to women or men? I enjoyed playing some of the early WWF ones where we managed to make Gandalf and a pretty good Balrog to duke it out! And having the "fall down entrance" as you try to enter the ring was a really entertaining option with some characters. But left on my own? I would never have bought a single one. One of my friends called wrestling "Guy Soap Operas" and I think it's true.

In which case, the jiggle...isn't for us. But then again, we don't react to this stuff the same way. I guess women prefer things to be in context-it has to make sense, generally, rather than be gratuitous.

And although I have nothing against a little black dress or mini-skirt for a night at the bar, it never used to be day-wear. The fact that it sounds like it is becoming so is alarming. I'm sure these women are not all hand-sewing these items. They are being portrayed as desirable and possibly required to fit in socially. Women are susceptible to such portrayals, but the over-all effect causes more anxiety over looks and despair over not fitting into an increasingly narrow band of number. Numbers that are starting to look like a pre-teen with the chest of a 30 year old!

When was the last time you saw women portrayed in images like these:

http://mustbetv.net/1989nestlealpinewhite.jpg

http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/consumerist/2009/01/qGjDjKJWwvs.jpg

http://anunslife.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/psychology-today.jpg

http://traditionofexcellence.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/maejemison.jpg

http://www.by-the-sword.com/acatalog/tt8-059.jpg

http://www.travelinginspain.com/spain_festivals/moors_christians3.jpg

Space suits are not form-fitting on women, and a lot of medieval clothing had high necklines along with low hem-lines.

But reading this thread, I realize that it isn't only women that are being discriminated against. It is also men. I have a number of guy friends who would rather date an average-to-pretty woman with a great personality and a brain over one who looked stunning but was bad-tempered, or robotic in personality.

So games that offer females of interchangeable, improbable proportions with little or no care to back story or personality cheat men as much as women. Is that not enough reason to demand more from game companies/media in general? Even online games allow characters to be different heights and body proportions. Isn't it time we saw a bit more variance in our NPC's as well? Wouldn't you like a female bartender who looked like she could be her own bouncer (and wasn't an orc for a change)? Or a female thief with a small chest (so she wouldn't be unbalanced in a climb) and a scar across one eye-wouldn't that be more memorable than this endless parade of 44-18-22's? Think about it.

 

[squid5580]

Yes they may use a bit less clothes to sell a game. They may not. Operative word there is MAY. I figuresd since you were so grammaritically correct and not a "straw man" you would understand how a word like may doesn't mean will or does.

What does that have to do with the fact that in one post you told me the choice in games to "use a bit less clothes" "doesn't affect sales all that much" and then you tell me in another post that "we run out in the millions to buy" these kinds of games?

People don't buy games that MAY "use a bit less clothes to sell a game": by the time "we run out in the millions to buy" a game from, you know, Amazon or Best Buy or GameStop or some fine indie retailer, the game DOES or DOES NOT.

Maybe you buy your games from Schrodinger's big box store, but the rest of us buy games where the ass cheeks do or do not hang out of the bottom of the lead female character's shorts prior to the purchase collapsing the wave form.

Some might think you're just engaging in "stereotypical ramblings" if you're willing to say anything--even if it contradicts something you made a point of earlier--just to prove your issues with "bra burning feminists" aren't baseless whining.

WE MAY RUN OUT IN MILLIONS!!!!!!!!!!! Try keeping it in context for your "rational" discussion.

Those weren't your words though, were they? The "may" was referring to the game designers, not the 'millions': is this not the line:

"they may use a bit less clothes than they could have to sell a game. A game we run out in the millions to buy." [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.138610?page=14#3137741]

The "operative word" is not even in the same sentence.

And maybe I do buy games for the nice ass on the cover. So what?

Um, you just spent your entire time here telling us about how you can't worry about these issues because you are too busy typing "I am not like that" about the stereotype that all male gamers are sex depraved perverts who only buy games based on the size of the girls chest depicted on the box, and how you are sick and tired of the female gamer representing us gamers in such a way because the MC and the clothes they may or may not wear mean nothing until someone shines a huge political spotlight on it and makes a big deal about nothing.

Seems like a pretty big "so what" to me to come into a thread and talk endlessly about how sick you are of guys being the victims of the stereotypical ramblings of bra burning feminists over issues where the only problem is the huge political spotlight they shine on it, and then say "I do buy games for the nice ass on the cover" at the end.

Or are you just angry about being stereotyped as a boob guy when you're actually an ass man?

Oh right because I find something attractive, find some sort of beauty in a female character, I must be a sex depraved pervert. It can't be that Iwould much rather spend 5- 1000 hours looking at a nice female ass than a nice male one. But you know what I am done defending myself to you. The tables have now turned and you can tell me what gives you the right to put me down for my tastes. And why games I like that you don't shouldn't exist. Or are you going to try and avoid those questions from that issue once again?

 

[HyenaThePirate]

The greatest dagger in the back of this entire argument about the lack of dignity for women in video games, is probably Cosplay.

You know.. where women dress UP as IVY in sexy home made costumes for nerd conventions.

Just thought I'd bring that up.

 

[squid5580]

Oh right because I find something attractive, find some sort of beauty in a female character, I must be a sex depraved pervert. It can't be that Iwould much rather spend 5- 1000 hours looking at a nice female ass than a nice male one. But you know what I am done defending myself to you. The tables have now turned and you can tell me what gives you the right to put me down for my tastes. And why games I like that you don't shouldn't exist. Or are you going to try and avoid those questions from that issue once again?

I started this by saying you missed the OPs point, and you're the one who ran with the idea about how if a person buys a game for the nice ass on the cover, they're a sex-crazed pervert and you're always so busy typing you're not like that you can't worry about any other issue.

I've done nothing here but hoist you on you own petard. You were the one who told us not to worry about those games because men aren't like that and the market will take care of the problem for us. You're the one who put guys like yourself down as sex-crazed perverts.

I've done nothing but judge you by the things you yourself have said.

And while all of this you still avoid the question. Well done. And I didn't run with it. I simply said I am tired of people representing male gamers as this because of that. At the end of the day that is all that is happening.

You might wanna go back and read the OP. It isn't nearly as deep as everyone claims it is. All it is is bitching about this issue for no reason other than they don't like it. It is not any type of representation of female gamers. It isn't a self esteem problem. They just call it bad and wrong and that is all. That it is a problem with the industry. And since we gamers are the industry we are the problem. There is no taking into account there are tons of games out there that don't even have females of any sort in them. Others that portray women in a tasteful manner. No all of that is thrown out the window because of a few that they find offensive so it must be abolished. Instead of having the maturity to just ignore them and move on to games they like.

 

[squid5580]

And I didn't run with it. I simply said I am tired of people representing male gamers as this because of that. At the end of the day that is all that is happening.

Yeah, and you said one thing in support of why you think people representing males games as this is stereotyping them, and then you completely contradicted yourself later on.

You don't see a problem with that?

I will say it once again I am done defending myself to you until you answer the question.

 

[squid5580]

And I didn't run with it. I simply said I am tired of people representing male gamers as this because of that. At the end of the day that is all that is happening.

Yeah, and you said one thing in support of why you think people representing males games as this is stereotyping them, and then you completely contradicted yourself later on.

You don't see a problem with that?

I will say it once again I am done defending myself to you until you answer the question.

Why would you expect people to answer your questions when you show so little interest in having a meaningful exchange of ideas that you'll say anything up to the point you flat out contradict yourself without explanation?

Maybe because I at least have the courtesy to answer the entire post after of course reading the entire post instead of just taking pieces to keep the arguement perpetual motion.

 

[squid5580]

Maybe because I at least have the courtesy to answer the entire post after of course reading the entire post instead of just taking pieces to keep the arguement perpetual motion.

Why do you think anyone should show you any courtesy when it appears you will say anything in support of your argument you think will make it more convincing, including something that flat-out contradicts something you said earlier?

Funny cause that is exactly what you are doing when you dissect a post sentence by sentence to corrupt them and take them out of context to fit yours. Forcing a response that may seem contradictory in nature but has nothing to do with the issue but with your response to each sentence.

This is my last post in this thread until you can answer the question at hand. So quote me all you like and tell me I am contradicting myself all you like but I am rising above your little game since you can't seem to offer anything productive to it.

Thank you and goodnight.

 

[crypt-creature]

This is my last post in this thread until you can answer the question at hand.

Promise?

Well, he has responded after every post saying that he will stop.
The odds don't look so good.

 

[AwesomeNinjaPowers]

The game industry seems to mostly be based on the old adage 'sex sells' which sadly is true, but hey if I have to take my games with gratuitous T and A and a side order of raging ****, then that's how I'll take em but dammit I don't have to like it! But what's a girl to do? Play games with Neanderthal commando oh make things go boom! guys in? No thank you.

I disagree, think about a lot of popular games.

Some of my favourite games like Half Life 2, Final Fantasy 7, Saints Row 2 (With Shaundi) Fallout 3 and Uncharted do not use sex to sell at all. All of their female characters are very well developed and are never really portrayed in a sexual manner. It's why I love those games. I can't really think of a game I own that resorts to sexual appeal to sell, apart from meat head games like God of War.

Final Fantasy 7 didn't use sex to sell? Then what the hell was Tifa but T and A? And I wasn't talking about all games, just most of em, seem to have to throw in that unnecessary eye candy. Oh and Gears of War is the kind of 'Neanderthal commando oh make things go boom!' game that I was talking about.

 

[A.I. Sigma]

As far as I'm concerned, you don't need to have melons shoved down your top to be attractive. In fact, I'd like to see a game where a female lead was plain, or even ugly. Maybe then they could concentrate on more important aspects of the game, rather than how realistically the light reflects off the characters uncovered, perfect bosoms.

-.-

If anyone actually believes this is what runs through a developers mind when creating a game then may I suggest you sell all your gaming gear now. Just due to the simple fact the industry would be to stupid to sustain itself. X-Blades didn't sell well at all. Why you might ask? Well because this whole theory all you need is a pair of scantily clad breasts is all you need to make us stupid gamers happy is a dumbass theory pure and simple. Developers know it, gamers know it and the only ones who haven't clued in is bra burning feminists. The one big factor here is when you buy a game you are going to spend the next 5-1000 hours looking at these people. So now who here wants to look at an attractive character for the next 5-1000 hours and who wants to look at a character where the only thing running through you mind is I wouldn't do her with Bill's dick and John pushing?

I'm not a bra burning feminist, mate. I like to look at hot girl as much as a male gamer does. However, the industry seems to be focusing now on boobs and good looks than plot or story, etc. Dead or Alive, Tomb Raider, and Ninja Gaiden are pretty good examples of this.

Although it's nice to have a pleasing figure on screen, when it gets down to it, I'd rather have good gameplay or immersive plot rather than eye candy. I'm not suggesting boobs are the only selling point of a game, but it does seem to be a pretty prominent factor these days.

"I wouldn't do her with Bill's dick and John pushing"

If that went through your mind at any point during a game, then God help you. It certainly didn't support you argument of 'We don't need boobs to make us happy.'

 

[Lion_Goddess]

sorry I just HAD to register just so I could remark .. YES girls DO play video games ffs what do you think we are? boring?? only care about making babies and getting married and pleasing our husbands or significant other?(lol) er ok on to my point... I love mmorpg's heck I'm an mmo addict and I have played offline games too but its just not the same with no one to show what you've accomplished like WOW look at this new sword and I'm such and such a level now after all that hard work .. but as for female armor god wth were they thinking? they can't make it female shaped without showing bare skin? I'd seriously never g o into battle with my inner thighs(or chest,or stomach) exposed to a possible knife jab in one of my main arteries I'm just glad its Just a game.. but does tick me off that most of them don't offer an alternative more covered up version like say if we chose to not go for the skimpy kind we could go for the regular type .. then again all u pervs would be exposed. Ha! anyway if I was totally covered up I'd still want some upper torso detail whether or not it was fully covered or not.. just would make me cringe thinking how cramped my boobs would be Lol

 

[Legion3321]

In my most humble opinion, all games are forms of fantastical stories, simply created for our entertainment. Bam i just solved this thread. each and every game is a story. And what do you want in any story? A good fantasy.

But if its a reality game where the developers are TRYING to be real and not assing around then a cage fighting woman with moons for tits and a perfect face isnt going to sell it for me,after all shes a cage-fighter and you expect them to be bruised and battered most of the time.

So games likes SC and X-Blade you should be let off the hook for being unrealistic.
However, if a game claims to be realistic and has aforementioned Moon boobs then i may see a reason for this thread.

If this thread continues after this i will demand that you leave my office.
Good day sir/Madame.

Edit: I seem to have missed the point of the thread with this post, i do that a lot so its nothing special.
Dignity is what you perceive it to be therefore this thread is pointless, after all there are limitless views on Dignity

 

[battlewings]

Hiiiiiii!!~ I'm new to this site, and I'm currently doing an essay on the hyper sexualisation of females in games, and also that it should not be an issue in the games industry. I was just wondering if you guys could send me links to any good sites?

Thanksss!!!~