France Accuses Scientologists of Fraud

[Kevvers]

The thing about scientology itself is that, unlike many religions like Christianity and Islam, it assumes that people are bad and stupid by default. People aren't allowed to even see much of their texts until they "understand" the previous piece...
And France has a point. I mean, if they want to have their own beliefs, OK, go ahead. But if you start messing with the law, you're in for it.

I feel I should point out that much of the bible is devoted to the wickedness of man and his sinful nature, in fact the whole Pauline Christian doctrine has it that no one can be saved without Jesus precisely because we are too wicked to abide by the Law, and too stupid to understand God's word. That whole comment you made about not "understanding" the pieces, well that sounds exactly like how they used to conduct the bible studies classes I used to go to.
The church used to conduct the mass in Latin, even though none of the congregation could actually speak it for precisely these reasons. Many Catholics would like a return to the Latin mass! Islam probably holds an even lower respect for humanity next to God.

So my point is that although Scientology is kind've of weird and creepy, its not THAT different to the main religions in my opinion.

 

[HuCast]

funny how a thread about scientology creates more comments about france than the actual subject. I think you should make some comments/suggestions about scientologys future in the us instead of bashing the country that gave you the statue of liberty

 

[Abedeus]

funny how a thread about scientology creates more comments about france than the actual subject. I think you should make some comments/suggestions about scientologys future in the us instead of bashing the country that gave you the statue of liberty

You gave us nothing but a faulty alliance in the past.

 

[Hyoscine]

funny how a thread about scientology creates more comments about france than the actual subject. I think you should make some comments/suggestions about scientologys future in the us instead of bashing the country that gave you the statue of liberty

You gave us nothing but a faulty alliance in the past.

Really? Quaintly xenophobic ribbing is fine, but that's your actual serious-face take on France? I'd rate somewhere between ignorant and borderline retarded.

 

[Abedeus]

funny how a thread about scientology creates more comments about france than the actual subject. I think you should make some comments/suggestions about scientologys future in the us instead of bashing the country that gave you the statue of liberty

You gave us nothing but a faulty alliance in the past.

Really? Quaintly xenophobic ribbing is fine, but that's your actual serious-face take on France? I'd rate somewhere between ignorant and borderline retarded.

I'm not xenophobic. I'm just good at History and how France did shit when Nazis attacked Poland, instead of crushing them, they waited.. and got pwned.

 

[Arbre]

Because I suppose that people were not "asked" to give money to the Christian Church for salvation, right?

Also, why should you pray for salvation? Isn't kind of idiotic, when fundamentally, all you have to be concerned about is just doing good around you, which mind you, you don't need any theocratic book to "reveal".

Fucking hypocrisy. They just don't want to see a new current gain momentum.
Where are the lions?

 

[Arbre]

funny how a thread about scientology creates more comments about france than the actual subject. I think you should make some comments/suggestions about scientologys future in the us instead of bashing the country that gave you the statue of liberty

You gave us nothing but a faulty alliance in the past.

Really? Quaintly xenophobic ribbing is fine, but that's your actual serious-face take on France? I'd rate somewhere between ignorant and borderline retarded.

I'm not xenophobic. I'm just good at History and how France did shit when Nazis attacked Poland, instead of crushing them, they waited.. and got pwned.

How to say it in simpler words... they ALL waited. That laissez-faire. Each crisis is a "formidable opportunity" (Condoleza Rice TM) to gross massive amounts of money and go take control of foreign resources and plant military bases in crushed countries.

 

[Omnidum]

I'm going to go ahead and say "orly?" about that Scientology is a fraud. It's a cult for the rich and the popular, and it has nothing to do with science...

 

[Arbre]

Is this surprising? The French LOVE to protest, especially the Parisian French (from what I've heard from French people).

This applies to all of France, not just Paris.
And that's a good thing, because people are constantly abused, and don't want to take more crap. This is quite an oddity in fact, because France is a country where syndicalism within companies is very low.

 

[Taizan]

Good work, you Gauls!

Still don't like the French, but i have a little more respect for them now.

 

[Arbre]

I'm going to go ahead and say "orly?" about that Scientology is a fraud. It's a cult for the rich and the popular, and it has nothing to do with science...

It's also and almost nothing more than a form of secret society made public.

 

[Parsley]

Ah this is good. This should happen in all the other countries where Scientology is around. Watch the BBC panorama thing on youtube, its really good and shocking.

Here is the first part: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dv4u3fVQrU

 

[Scientia]

I'm gutted that so many people see Scientology as something to be ridiculed or despised. If any organisation violates the law then they should definitely be held accountable, sure. But aside from the organisations (which are made up of some truly phenomenal individuals...and yes, a few fanatics thrown in for good measure) the subject itself, the core philosophy and practice of Scientology is really quite simple and, when applied, extremely beneficial. In a nutshell:

1) You are a spirit, a soul. You do not ~have~ a soul, you ~are~ the soul; that uses a body & mind on this planet for the pleasure of experience, and the experience of pleasure. (Like using a control pad to play PS3... the pad being the "body", the buttons being the "mind").

2) You have lived before and you will live again, maybe somewhere other than Earth. (Who says reincarnation doesn't occur elsewhere?)

3) Through a combination of self-help and counselling Scientology-style, one can become a kinder, more confident, competent and empowered individual, and ultimately more spiritually aware.

And that's pretty much it. Weird sh*t, I'm sure you'll agree...

All the best,
Mike

 

[Auron555]

This actually does make me respect the French a lot more. I'm actually not surprised that they're the ones who managed to look past the freedom of speech/religion that any modern country is required to allow and realize that Scientology is still pretty screwed up. I'm not saying they should make up charges just to get rid of them, but if they did do something wrong then for God's sake prosecute them. Don't be afraid of being seen as opressive or something just because they're a poor minority group. Get something done.

I... I don't know about this part. It seems very ironic. Other than that, I agree totally. If religion crosses over into law, then it is the goverment's duty to stop whatever is happening.

 

[Hyoscine]

I'm not xenophobic. I'm just good at History and how France did shit when Nazis attacked Poland, instead of crushing them, they waited.. and got pwned.

Wow, how succinct! You truly must be Good at History...

How to say it in simpler words... they ALL waited. That laissez-faire. Each crisis is a "formidable opportunity" (Condoleza Rice TM) to gross massive amounts of money and go take control of foreign resources and plant military bases in crushed countries.

Hmm, an excellent counterpoint. And maybe, just maybe America's involvement in WWII wasn't a delayed reaction to the invasion of Poland. What history are you good at, Abedeus? It doesn't seem to be the 20th century.

 

[Hyoscine]

I'm gutted that so many people see Scientology as something to be ridiculed or despised. If any organisation violates the law then they should definitely be held accountable, sure. But aside from the organisations (which are made up of some truly phenomenal individuals...and yes, a few fanatics thrown in for good measure) the subject itself, the core philosophy and practice of Scientology is really quite simple and, when applied, extremely beneficial. In a nutshell:

1) You are a spirit, a soul. You do not ~have~ a soul, you ~are~ the soul; that uses a body & mind on this planet for the pleasure of experience, and the experience of pleasure. (Like using a control pad to play PS3... the pad being the "body", the buttons being the "mind").

2) You have lived before and you will live again, maybe somewhere other than Earth. (Who says reincarnation doesn't occur elsewhere?)

3) Through a combination of self-help and counselling Scientology-style, one can become a kinder, more confident, competent and empowered individual, and ultimately more spiritually aware.

And that's pretty much it. Weird sh*t, I'm sure you'll agree...

All the best,
Mike

Thanks "Mike", thanks for signing up just to tell us that. We look forward to hearing from you again next time a searchable discussion involving Scientology takes place anywhere on the internet.

 

[Wargamer]

As tempting as it is to laugh at the French, there are times when they are the only ones with the balls to do the right thing.

Here's one of them.

 

[Pyre1million]

Heh. I've never been overwhelmingly hateful toward scientology OR the French (Point of fact I supported the French rather strongly when everyone in my own country went fuckshit nuts and started calling things names like "Liberty toast"), but if all this really is due in any way to the work of Anonymous, then god damnit I have to hate Anonymous less. That's going to rankle for awhile. But regardless of the involvement of an internet quasi-group the sheer amount of discussion this thing has provoked is glorious.

That interview with L. Ron Hubbard Junior seems leery to me, but then that's because all of Black magic is utter bullshit, and any reference to it makes me suspicious. It was invented by really stupid peasants and priests in the dark ages who thought Christianity granted magical powers, and that they could pervert these magical powers by reversing some Scripture and prayers. And doing perverted things. Literally, that's the ENTIRE founding.

On the one hand, here in the US we have some very tolerable and even outright NICE people who are scientologists (Tom Cruise does not spring to mind, but John Travolta does). So I'll stand by what other people have said - People are entitled to their own (PEACEFUL) faiths. But when a religion begins impinging on the area of law, it is the government's responsibility to intervene.

Also

Thanks "Mike", thanks for signing up just to tell us that. We look forward to hearing from you again next time a searchable discussion involving Scientology takes place anywhere on the internet.

Truer words may have been spoken, but I bet not too often.

 

[Abedeus]

I'm not xenophobic. I'm just good at History and how France did shit when Nazis attacked Poland, instead of crushing them, they waited.. and got pwned.

Wow, how succinct! You truly must be Good at History...

How to say it in simpler words... they ALL waited. That laissez-faire. Each crisis is a "formidable opportunity" (Condoleza Rice TM) to gross massive amounts of money and go take control of foreign resources and plant military bases in crushed countries.

Hmm, an excellent counterpoint. And maybe, just maybe America's involvement in WWII wasn't a delayed reaction to the invasion of Poland. What history are you good at, Abedeus? It doesn't seem to be the 20th century.

French is the closest country to Germany (out of our "allies"), and they had the best chance of rushing at Berlin and stopping them. America had it's problems, although they just didn't want to make enemies and thought they could avoid the war.

Defend France all you want, the truth is - people don't like you. Very much.

"- You will be now... French soldiers!
- *dropping rifles* WE SURRENDER!"

Taken from Armed and Dangerous.

 

[Eleuthera]

Though I surely applaud the French for taking this step. They are not the first country to do this. In Belgium Scientology are currently being prosecuted as a criminal organisation, the effect of this, if/when they are convicted, will be quite a bit more than the french suit. If convicted they will in essence become an illigal organisation in the entire EU and possibly in several other countries depending on treaties and such.

sorry, this [http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/09/04/belgian-justice-prosecutes-scientology/] is the only english article I could find atm