Game Voice Actors Reject Contract Due to Low Pay

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Danpascooch

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Apr 16, 2009
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ShadowKirby said:
Therumancer said:
I mean honestly, it's guys going from "I'm happy to make a living, and still have to do other jobs" to "Well geez, I need more money so I can afford that second Lamborgini and a garage expansion to hold it because of the space my boat is taking up next to the first one". There *IS* a middle ground. Nobody who makes $3,200 a month for working 4 hours a week is going to tug at my heart strings. Even if they do 20 differant voices and read a thousand lines in that time, it's still only four bloody hours. Plus for all their cries about strain I'd feel it's a safe bet that these guys are doing other jobs, and probably hitting every studio needing voice work in town that they can find.
Believe me, voice actors can't afford a Lamborgini. The 4 hours at 200.00$/hour is maybe the only gig they will get in the whole month.
Perhaps the dumbest argument I have ever heard.

If they can only find 4 hours of work per month, then that is NOT a full time job, its a "little thing on the side" get a real job, hell, if you are only able to work 1 hour a freaking week and don't find a supplementary job, you don't deserve $200 for each of those hours, you deserve to be hit with a shovel until you stop moving.
 

j0frenzy

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danpascooch said:
Therumancer said:
Booze Zombie said:
Game companies don't respect voice acting talent, I've been hearing about this for some time.
I have mixed opinions on the subject.

In the past I've talked about corruption in the games industry and the fact that I think people are being overpaid. When I look at some of the price tags attached to games it's pretty ridiculous, I mean even with hundreds of employees when your spending a quarter of a billion dollars to produce a video game something is wrong. I think a big part of it is the fact that a lot of people in the industry have simply gotten TOO greedy and are demanding what amounts to lavish fees for doing very little. Much like Hollywood.

I point this out because the sheer amount of money tossed into games is one of the excuses used to try and justify the high prices. Albeit the high prices are also largely because nobody in the goverment cares enough to prevent them from engaging in price fixing (like when the industry as a whole pulled a $10 price hike), and the simple fact that with price fixing it means that a game costing a quarter of a billion (I refer to Modern Warfare 2 here), and one developed on a shoestring both wind up costing the same price upon release.

Going into voice acting I am looking at people basically whining about getting paid $200.00 an hour, and I think that represents a mentality that is destroying the game industry, and hurting us gamers as a whole. Sure, it can be argued that 'voice actors' are a skilled profession but so are a lot of things that make a lot less money than they do. I think the basic issue is the fact that they feel they CAN demand more money given these ridiculous budgets so they are going to do so.

Truthfully this is pretty lulzworthy because back when I was seriously following Anime a lot of magazines and such did articles on voice actors since they were just coming into demand to produce quality dubs and such. The basic gist of it was that these guys were doing it for peanuts and were lucky if they could support themselves at it, mostly sticking in voice acting as a labor of love.

Now voice acting is taking off because video games want to use these guys too, and while I can see wanting to be able to support themselves, saying that a contract is "unfair" if they make $200.00 an hour is absolutly ridiculous. I think in this case the "Screen Actors Guild" is pretty much demonstrating the worst aspects of union behavior.

What's more demands this this trickle down to use consumers, because really the game industry is so excessively greedy and wasteful today, they aren't just going to "eat" the costs. Rather they will wind up hiking the price of a game another $5-$10 to cover it and leave us holding the check so to speak.

So basically my attitude is that they should pretty much tell the Voice Actors "have a nice life" and work around them with synthetic voice programs, volunteers, or whatever. Truthfully I'd rather suffer a year worth of cr@ppy voice acting... which we get half the time anyway... than have these guys dictating their pay rate quite this way because in the long run that hurts me.

I mean honestly, it's guys going from "I'm happy to make a living, and still have to do other jobs" to "Well geez, I need more money so I can afford that second Lamborgini and a garage expansion to hold it because of the space my boat is taking up next to the first one". There *IS* a middle ground. Nobody who makes $3,200 a month for working 4 hours a week is going to tug at my heart strings. Even if they do 20 differant voices and read a thousand lines in that time, it's still only four bloody hours. Plus for all their cries about strain I'd feel it's a safe bet that these guys are doing other jobs, and probably hitting every studio needing voice work in town that they can find.
A quarter billion? Has ANYONE, EVER, spent a quarter billion making a game?
http://terminalgamer.com/2009/11/20/modern-warfare-2-production-cost-sales-figures-revealed/
Apparently, adding in promotion costs, yes. MW2 cost 50 million to make and another 200 million to promote, costing the company an investment of a quarter of a billion dollars.
EDIT:
also, from a more known source:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/96227-How-Much-Did-Modern-Warfare-2-Cost-to-Make
And apparently I am mistaken of what a launch budget is. According to this article, it includes stuff like the discs the games come in. On the other hand, I whole-heartedly believe that the bulk of the launch budget was spent on advertisements.
 

Danpascooch

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Apr 16, 2009
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j0frenzy said:
danpascooch said:
Therumancer said:
Booze Zombie said:
Game companies don't respect voice acting talent, I've been hearing about this for some time.
I have mixed opinions on the subject.

In the past I've talked about corruption in the games industry and the fact that I think people are being overpaid. When I look at some of the price tags attached to games it's pretty ridiculous, I mean even with hundreds of employees when your spending a quarter of a billion dollars to produce a video game something is wrong. I think a big part of it is the fact that a lot of people in the industry have simply gotten TOO greedy and are demanding what amounts to lavish fees for doing very little. Much like Hollywood.

I point this out because the sheer amount of money tossed into games is one of the excuses used to try and justify the high prices. Albeit the high prices are also largely because nobody in the goverment cares enough to prevent them from engaging in price fixing (like when the industry as a whole pulled a $10 price hike), and the simple fact that with price fixing it means that a game costing a quarter of a billion (I refer to Modern Warfare 2 here), and one developed on a shoestring both wind up costing the same price upon release.

Going into voice acting I am looking at people basically whining about getting paid $200.00 an hour, and I think that represents a mentality that is destroying the game industry, and hurting us gamers as a whole. Sure, it can be argued that 'voice actors' are a skilled profession but so are a lot of things that make a lot less money than they do. I think the basic issue is the fact that they feel they CAN demand more money given these ridiculous budgets so they are going to do so.

Truthfully this is pretty lulzworthy because back when I was seriously following Anime a lot of magazines and such did articles on voice actors since they were just coming into demand to produce quality dubs and such. The basic gist of it was that these guys were doing it for peanuts and were lucky if they could support themselves at it, mostly sticking in voice acting as a labor of love.

Now voice acting is taking off because video games want to use these guys too, and while I can see wanting to be able to support themselves, saying that a contract is "unfair" if they make $200.00 an hour is absolutly ridiculous. I think in this case the "Screen Actors Guild" is pretty much demonstrating the worst aspects of union behavior.

What's more demands this this trickle down to use consumers, because really the game industry is so excessively greedy and wasteful today, they aren't just going to "eat" the costs. Rather they will wind up hiking the price of a game another $5-$10 to cover it and leave us holding the check so to speak.

So basically my attitude is that they should pretty much tell the Voice Actors "have a nice life" and work around them with synthetic voice programs, volunteers, or whatever. Truthfully I'd rather suffer a year worth of cr@ppy voice acting... which we get half the time anyway... than have these guys dictating their pay rate quite this way because in the long run that hurts me.

I mean honestly, it's guys going from "I'm happy to make a living, and still have to do other jobs" to "Well geez, I need more money so I can afford that second Lamborgini and a garage expansion to hold it because of the space my boat is taking up next to the first one". There *IS* a middle ground. Nobody who makes $3,200 a month for working 4 hours a week is going to tug at my heart strings. Even if they do 20 differant voices and read a thousand lines in that time, it's still only four bloody hours. Plus for all their cries about strain I'd feel it's a safe bet that these guys are doing other jobs, and probably hitting every studio needing voice work in town that they can find.
A quarter billion? Has ANYONE, EVER, spent a quarter billion making a game?
http://terminalgamer.com/2009/11/20/modern-warfare-2-production-cost-sales-figures-revealed/
Apparently, adding in promotion costs, yes. MW2 cost 50 million to make and another 200 million to promote, costing the company an investment of a quarter of a billion dollars.
Well, I don't know if you can really say a quarter billion to MAKE then, but yeah, that's a shitload of advertising.
 

Lord_Panzer

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Feb 6, 2009
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When asked, sources inside the SAG were quoted, saying "Maaaaattt Daaaammmmon."
 

j0frenzy

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danpascooch said:
j0frenzy said:
danpascooch said:
Therumancer said:
Booze Zombie said:
Game companies don't respect voice acting talent, I've been hearing about this for some time.
SNIP
A quarter billion? Has ANYONE, EVER, spent a quarter billion making a game?
http://terminalgamer.com/2009/11/20/modern-warfare-2-production-cost-sales-figures-revealed/
Apparently, adding in promotion costs, yes. MW2 cost 50 million to make and another 200 million to promote, costing the company an investment of a quarter of a billion dollars.
Well, I don't know if you can really say a quarter billion to MAKE then, but yeah, that's a shitload of advertising.
I edited my original post with more information about the 200 Mil. I do think it is fair to include the launch budget though, because it is part of the investment producers must pay in order for a game to go it. MW2 cost Activision a quarter of a billion dollars.
 

Jaebird

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Aug 19, 2008
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If that means that Steve Blum is no longer in games, then good riddance. I'm sick of his voice, now.
 

Lovelocke

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The_root_of_all_evil said:
1. Now if you don't think Heavy Weapons Guy, GLADos, Minsc, Kyle "Shadow" Simmons, Demoman, The Joker, Lucan D'Lere aren't worth that much money, then I'm sure you can voice them with the bods around the office.

2. You don't HAVE to have great voices in the same way you don't HAVE to have great music, graphics, or anything else. Hell, Peggle gets away with cutesy pictures, Ode to Joy and a bagatelle board.

3. Imagine Jessica Rabbit with Fran Drescher's voice...
Alright - A half funny, half serious response to these points.

1. Good voices, sure: But I don't think people would have enjoyed the game LESS if they cast a "sound alike" VA from the beginning because NOBODY WOULD KNOW WHAT THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO SOUND LIKE PRIOR TO LAUNCH! I also can't recall a high profile title in the past failing to meet sales expectations because they got an unknown old English gentleman to voice a character instead of Patrick Stewart - The fact a game GOT Patrick Stewart is simply "pretty cool" and also wouldn't lend itself to instant success. BONUS POINTS: Do you remember who voiced all the characters in the original Team Fortress Classic? Nobody... and that game did monstrously well!

2. I know I agreed with you in my response to point 1, but I wanted to tack this opinion on about your #2 specifically: Peggle didn't "Get away" with those modest offerings, the first time I won a round in the game - That's what convinced me to buy it on the spot! It's not that the game could've been better with higher production values, its all about hitting the mark with what they've got.

3. I think Fran's voice is hot somehow... that with Jessica Rabbit = Exploda-Bone Action.
 

TsunamiWombat

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j0frenzy said:
Because what the games industry as a whole needs right now is to increase production costs to hire more voice actors. Yes, the treatment of voice actors could be better, but the industry can't really afford to keep increasing how much is needed to make a game.
Also, unlike movies, voice actors are not the crutch of the game. If acting in a movie sucks, then the movie sucks. If the voice acting in a game sucks, it brings down the experience, but is does not completely ruin the experience. It is the developers who do the majority of the work in a game and who deserve the bulk of the money for their work.
VA's are talent and they deserve money for their work- to bring down costs they need to work on building games more efficiently and lowering the graphics threshhold. Only innovation will lower cost.
 

pantsoffdanceoff

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I don't mind this at all, considering I love the impossibly stoic silent protagonist and don't mind reading words instead of hearing them. The best voice actor I know is the little voice in my head.
 

j0frenzy

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TsunamiWombat said:
j0frenzy said:
Because what the games industry as a whole needs right now is to increase production costs to hire more voice actors. Yes, the treatment of voice actors could be better, but the industry can't really afford to keep increasing how much is needed to make a game.
Also, unlike movies, voice actors are not the crutch of the game. If acting in a movie sucks, then the movie sucks. If the voice acting in a game sucks, it brings down the experience, but is does not completely ruin the experience. It is the developers who do the majority of the work in a game and who deserve the bulk of the money for their work.
VA's are talent and they deserve money for their work- to bring down costs they need to work on building games more efficiently and lowering the graphics threshhold. Only innovation will lower cost.
Yes, they do deserve to be paid. But can the industry can't really afford to pay more. And they don't deserve to take the chunk of money from a project that developers give up years of time to make when the actor only does a day's work to contribute to the experience.
 

sneakypenguin

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Tenmar said:
Being a voice actor is really difficult and deserves to be paid well because of how competitive each job they have to apply for.
.
Yet that is a major reason that wages would be so "low". Precisely because there are 5 million(hyperbole) wannabe actors in LA(and every major college) (or wherever) that will gladly take the paycheck. VA in games is usually not very important(baring some RPGs), there are a few main characters then 5000 npcs whos job it is to die horrible deaths so I can understand trying to keep VA fees low.
 

Capo Taco

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bjj hero said:
That still makes it one of the highest paid, unskilled weekend jobs on earth. It's not like flipping burgers. You can tell me its a skill but I'm guessing most people here could put in an hour or two voice acting. Lets see the same people put an hour or two in as a paramedic. Thats a skilled job and paramedics dont get $200 an hour.
Unskilled? This is why we can't have nice voice acting most of the time. People are wholly uneducated to the reality.

All types of actors are paid well not just because the quality of result depends very much on the quality of the actor, but because it's very common to only get one out of 10 auditions. This means being scheduled and possibly preparing 10 times for just one $800 a day job.
 
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johnx61 said:
The_root_of_all_evil said:
Unskilled?

Uhuh...wanna record yourself doing one of Master Chief's infamous lines? Coz I'm damn sure it won't be as good as Steve Downes.
It doesn't take any real skill to mimic an accent. I can do it, most people probably could also with little difficulty.
Consider the gauntlet thrown in your direction then.

Lovelocke said:
Alright - A half funny, half serious response to these points.
And a return in the same manner.

1. BONUS POINTS: Do you remember who voiced all the characters in the original Team Fortress Classic? Nobody... and that game did monstrously well!

I thought on this for a moment and realised I couldn't remember a single line of dialogue from TF Classic. That both proves and counters my point, given that few people even remember TF Classic now, or even that there was one. Memorable voices make the game memorable. They may not be necessary but can you imagine Zoey sounding like a bored phone receptionist? L4D wouldn't have half the value it had without her.

(Did you know Zoey's voice is also Cortana, Cate Archer and Princess Peach? So L4D=HALO=NOLF=Mario : How's that for a flame war? :))


2. Peggle didn't "Get away" with those modest offerings, the first time I won a round in the game - That's what convinced me to buy it on the spot!
And what was it that did it? Bullet time and Ode To Joy.
It doesn't just have to be about voices, but the subtle sound-fx of "DING!", "tink-tink-tink" or the trumpet of domination/revenge get you enthralled. A GOOD voice actor can do that,
Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen! Hey, Listen!
3. I think Fran's voice is hot somehow... that with Jessica Rabbit = Exploda-Bone Action.
And you think voices aren't important? :)
 

Georgeman

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Since voice-acting isn't as important on games as it is on movies. I don't think they should be paid as much as they do on movies. A game with bad voice-acting can still be a good game. A movie with bad voice-acting will always be bad.