Games as a True Artform.

[OmegaXIII]

Each and every next gen Final Fantasy (VII-XIII) i would consider an art form. The sheer detail that Sqaure go into with the environments and Nobuo Uematsu is nothing short of a musical genius - his work truly fits the mood that games set every time. Each story as well (well apart from 12), convoluted though some may be and disliked for their Jness by some i feel each story is expertly crafted to build the characters and scenario to truly epic proportions.

 

[AdmiralWolverineLightningbolt]

wind waker
prince of persia
murasame the demon blade/odin sphere
no more heroes
madworld
mirror's edge

all those games stunned me when i saw them in motion

 

[AdmiralWolverineLightningbolt]

There are no games that are art. There are games that use art.

Games are mechanisms or rule-sets if you prefer to contest the players or an individual against the rule set.

How can a set of rules be art ? Seriously pretentiousness is what breeds disdain. Games will never be considered as art in the same way comics will never be art. They utilise art to create something greater.

how can paint on paper be art?
how can a funnily shaped rock be art?
art is anything that visually takes your breath away
a game can be art as much as a film can be art and a picture can be art

 

[SeymourSan]

There are no games that are art. There are games that use art.

Games are mechanisms or rule-sets if you prefer to contest the players or an individual against the rule set.

How can a set of rules be art ? Seriously pretentiousness is what breeds disdain. Games will never be considered as art in the same way comics will never be art. They utilise art to create something greater.

I think that what you just put forward was your definition of some games, but have you never played a game which has meant more to you than just a set of rules? Have you never played a game which spoke out to you in a more profound way?

Please do correct me if I am mistaken, but I think you are perhaps playing the wrong games.

 

[rockingnic]

Art is the process or product of deliberately arranging elements in a way that appeals to the senses or emotions. It encompasses a diverse range of human activities, creations, and modes of expression, including music and literature. -definition

By that definition, any game that makes you feel something is art. So therefore Halo is art to my emotions.

 

[Elemental]

The Neverhood and Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee
Amazing games

 

[Hazy]

Mother 3
Braid
BioShock

All are art. All are masterpieces.

 

[RusticMonkey]

Most people here tend to name a game which is beautiful visually, like say, a painting. In my opinion Games as Art entail much more then an interesting environment/visual art style. Games are a multi-medium.

I would say I consider MGS4 art. Why? They managed to combine emotions and interweave them into actual gameplay, which really connected me to game and it's protagonists. The Old Snake crawling sequence at the end really conveyed this sense of distress and hopelessness. The entire MGS series is riddled with all kinds of tricks like these to create a stimulation of all the senses. Creating an actual experience and connection between the artist and the "user". Audio, vibration, music, cinematics and game design all conspire to this end.

I haven't seen a game/series which is able to achieve that, at such a high degree. It is no coincidence that Hideo Kojima is notoriously hard to work with.

 

[Xvito]

Well... Let's see shall we.

Pong, Tetris, Mario, Zelda, Sonic, Contra, Megaman, Halo, Final Fantasy, Half-Life, Metal Gear, Tekken, Street Fighter, Bioshock... Do see where I'm going with this...?

In case you didn't see where I was going with it: all games are art, end of discussion.

--Xvito, keeping it excellent.

 

[SeymourSan]

Most people here tend to name a game which is beautiful visually, like say, a painting. In my opinion Games as Art entail much more then an interesting environment/visual art style. Games are a multi-medium.

I would say I consider MGS4 art. Why? They managed to combine emotions and interweave them into actual gameplay, which really connected me to game and it's protagonists. The Old Snake crawling sequence at the end really conveyed this sense of distress and hopelessness. The entire MGS series is riddled with all kinds of tricks like these to create a stimulation of all the senses. Creating an actual experience and connection between the artist and the "user". Audio, vibration, music, cinematics and game design all conspire to this end.

I haven't seen a game/series which is able to achieve that, at such a high degree.

I am in complete agreement. I only wish I could have comunicated it quite so well! I have always been of the opinion that Computer Games have some of the greatest potential of any artform, however I can't help but feel that the industry is still along way from realising that potential.

Console games only? I would argue that The Majesty of Colors [http://www.kongregate.com/games/GregoryWeir/the-majesty-of-colors] qualifies as art, despite being a flash vidjeo game.

That is an interesting little game there, simplistic, I just wish there was more of it!

 

[RusticMonkey]

Well... Let's see shall we.

Pong, Tetris, Mario, Zelda, Sonic, Contra, Megaman, Halo, Final Fantasy, Half-Life, Metal Gear, Tekken, Street Fighter, Bioshock... Do see where I'm going with this...?

In case you didn't see where I'm going with this: all games are art, end of discussion.

--Xvito, keeping it excellent.

I disagree, but you already took it upon yourself to close the discussion. Silly me.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

I think you could hang a LCD screen playing Super Mario Bros 3 in an art gallery.


Game design's an art in itself. That's not even a sneaky "games contain art assets" argument. Mario Bros 3 is just an intricate, beautifully designed game. And it's not the only one. There are plenty of games that I consider art for the sake of the game as a whole.

That said, I liked the plot twist in Bioshock, it was perfectly executed and stands on it's own as an artistic element. One that worked very well in the context of a game.

 

[cobra_ky]

Okami obviously

I know I'm going to get a lot of hate for this, but I don't think so. Sure, Okami had a really beautiful calligraphy art style, but I think for a game to truly be considered art is has to be special. Art comes from an artist's unique expression, and Okami, while it looked pretty and played great, didn't really innovate all too much.

My choices would be Braid, Psychonauts, and Shadow of the Colossus; since these games provided a more "newborn" experience than the rehashed ones we have to sit through today.

EDIT: Just wanted to add Half-Life 2. Yeah it's "another FPS," but it's constructed so well I just had to include it. Put it this way: if Braid is a pretty painting, then Half-Life 2 is a gigantic sculpture; unoriginal, but amazing none the less.

so what you're saying is:

Okami looked and played great, but it didn't innovate so it's not art.
HL2 didn't innovate, but it looked and played great so it is art.

am i missing something here?

also what exactly was so innovative about psychonauts?

 

[Halo Fanboy]

All games ever made ever.

But mostly Halo.

 

[ThrobbingEgo]

HL2 didn't innovate, but it looked and played great so it is art.

Does art have to innovate? Sure, some of the most significant works of art are the movers and shakers, but art isn't marked solely by innovation.

I'd say that games are art for the same reason the Atari failed: The market flooded because the me-too developers didn't realize that you can't just throw a bunch of moving pixels at a screen, put it in a pretty box, and call it a game. Game design's an art, it takes a good eye and special care. An artist's touch, if you will.

 

[SeymourSan]

how can paint on paper be art?
how can a funnily shaped rock be art?
art is anything that visually takes your breath away
a game can be art as much as a film can be art and a picture can be art

Because it looks nice.
Again nice.
Nothing visually takes your breath away or art musuems would have to provide oxygen tanks to resusitate the choking victims.
Learing to read is apparentelly a forgotten art. Ill recap on your behalf using small words in lieu of crayons.

Art is pretty pictures. Game USES pretty pictures game isnt art. Game can be ARTY but game itself not art. Phrasing your point as some pretentious arty farty questions about aesthetics is kinda undershooting the usual standard of the Escapist. Aesthetic art (Painting, sculptures) require skill to emulate a physical representation of the artists imaginings. Cinematography for example is not art, Art is created not exactly copied from real life. Games are MECHANISMS the mechanisms can run with any overlay. You can play pong using the venus de milo & the mona lisa but its not artisitic. Reading is very artistic.

I think that what you just put forward was your definition of some games, but have you never played a game which has meant more to you than just a set of rules? Have you never played a game which spoke out to you in a more profound way?

Please do correct me if I am mistaken, but I think you are perhaps playing the wrong games.

A profound game ? No I think if your awestruck by a game you are in need of serious mental care. If you mean the storyline of a game moved you emotionally that isnt art thats emotive. While art can be defined as something which evokes emotion thats usually an arguement put forward by liberal art college students trying to justify charging $5000 for shitting on a plate. Art is the creation of an original piece of work distinct in style & distinctiveness for a purpose. Driftwood is not art its nature, photographs are not art they are posed pictures of reality, paintings are art even landscapes & portraits because an individuals skill is required to make the product it has marks of being made on it.

So yes you are mistaken & corrected I thank you.

It appears obvious that you are one of those people in life who is unable to accept that others have thier own oppinions. Your own oppinion is very welcome in this thread, however your disregard for what others are saying, and your outright rude attitude is not. It is fine to be passionate about your views, but please do not assume them to be any more worthwhile than the next persons.
Please let's not turn this into a flame war...

 

[AdmiralWolverineLightningbolt]

how can paint on paper be art?
how can a funnily shaped rock be art?
art is anything that visually takes your breath away
a game can be art as much as a film can be art and a picture can be art

Because it looks nice.
Again nice.
Nothing visually takes your breath away or art musuems would have to provide oxygen tanks to resusitate the choking victims.
Learing to read is apparentelly a forgotten art. Ill recap on your behalf using small words in lieu of crayons.

Art is pretty pictures. Game USES pretty pictures game isnt art. Game can be ARTY but game itself not art. Phrasing your point as some pretentious arty farty questions about aesthetics is kinda undershooting the usual standard of the Escapist. Aesthetic art (Painting, sculptures) require skill to emulate a physical representation of the artists imaginings. Cinematography for example is not art, Art is created not exactly copied from real life. Games are MECHANISMS the mechanisms can run with any overlay. You can play pong using the venus de milo & the mona lisa but its not artisitic. Reading is very artistic.

by god! how the hell are you talking so much crap out your ass? i didnt think it was possible

"because it looks nice" - what the hell? so a still image is art, but lots of still images together which can be interacted with is art inside a game? my god you dont have a clue what you're talking about

ill put it in simple words since apparently you cant read a dictionary
art, a definition:
"the quality, production, expression, or realm, according to aesthetic principles, of what is beautiful, appealing, or of more than ordinary significance."


ie
an expression of something that invokes an idea of beauty

or ill put it even simpler
something which looks nice

cinematography is art, that's why galleries show art films by famous artists,
think
games can be art in their design and presentation, not in their basic gameplay surprisingly enough
anything can be art, art is in the eye of the beholder

now maybe grow a brain before you go making outlandish claims

god, there's having an opinion and there's not having a clue what the hell you're talking about