Games Where The Only Way To Win...Is To Lose?
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In Dark Souls you have to die the first time you fight Seath the Scaleless. But generally speaking I really don't like unreasonably difficult bosses right off the bat just to kill the fledgling player, but what I hate especially is when you can win a fight but still lose by virtue of story segregation. This is a problem particularly in games with the format of mostly exposition and custscenes, then the gameplay for each individual case (like Fire Emblem).
"The Secret World" has a few puzzles or quest stages that can only be done while dead. In one or two cases, it's fairly obvious, other times it might click because of something you see/remember much earlier in a quest chain, or having seen in passing. In these cases, the player needs to suicide in order to, for example, speak to a ghost, find an object that only exists in the ghost-world, find a clue left behind by a spirit, etc.
I think it's used to very good effect and quite creatively in those cases. Good effect because it usually makes sense in context, adds to the feeling/story/theme currently being explored and creatively, because I like the blending/crossover of life/death and the head-scratching moments when it hasn't yet clicked.
I think it's used to very good effect and quite creatively in those cases. Good effect because it usually makes sense in context, adds to the feeling/story/theme currently being explored and creatively, because I like the blending/crossover of life/death and the head-scratching moments when it hasn't yet clicked.
Yes, but you can beat the boss that's supposed to kill you, in which case you die in a cutscene afterward.FizzyIzze said:
Suikoden pulls a fast one on you, where there's a duel that will work like this, except you progress whether you win or lose, it's a massive difficulty spike to make you think you are supposed to lose, and you can only get the good ending if you win.
Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain - the games starts off with Kain being attacked by a group of assassins - you get to play the fight but they are simply too many. Also, it's the very fist gameplay - you lose but that's how the game actually starts after. You could actually win due to a glitch but then you cannot progress further at all.
I thought this was going to be answers like 'Spec:Ops' or there's this browser paltformer about abusive relationships called Loved and at one point the person asks "Do I own your body or your mind?" and you have to choose. I consider the correct way to beat the game is to close the window at that point
http://www.kongregate.com/games/AlexanderOcias/loved
But from memory Golden Sun makes you lose a boss fight at the start of the game
To be a dirty cheat, here are the TV Tropes pages about it =D
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HopelessBossFight
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FissionMailed
I forgot about Metal Gear Solid 3, the boss fight with the Sorrow. And the description of Seduce Me sounds like part of the objective is to know when to lose
http://www.kongregate.com/games/AlexanderOcias/loved
But from memory Golden Sun makes you lose a boss fight at the start of the game
To be a dirty cheat, here are the TV Tropes pages about it =D
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HopelessBossFight
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FissionMailed
I forgot about Metal Gear Solid 3, the boss fight with the Sorrow. And the description of Seduce Me sounds like part of the objective is to know when to lose
Yeah you do. There's another one in Dark Souls too; Seath the Scaleless kills you and then you wake up in prison. Apparently you can get round it using a glitch, don't know whether you can progress normally if you do that.FizzyIzze said:
I always wondered if getting gunned down in the Subway and waking up a prisoner in Deus Ex was part of the main story, or if there was a whole other plot if I had survived the shootout.
Also there's that game with missiles, where you're in a command center of sorts and you have missiles at your command and the idea is to command your missiles into the sky to destroy incoming missiles that are trying to bomb your command, along with the cities around you.
Dashed if I can remember the name of it though...
Also there's that game with missiles, where you're in a command center of sorts and you have missiles at your command and the idea is to command your missiles into the sky to destroy incoming missiles that are trying to bomb your command, along with the cities around you.
Dashed if I can remember the name of it though...
My most recent example would be Dragon's Dogma.
During the first boss fight, at the opening's sequence.
You fight the final boss with nothing but a sword.
It's a suppose to loose fight that lasts for 30 seconds at which point you'll get the cut-scene.
During the first boss fight, at the opening's sequence.
You fight the final boss with nothing but a sword.
It's a suppose to loose fight that lasts for 30 seconds at which point you'll get the cut-scene.
I... actually didn't know you were supposed to lose.DementedSheep said:
I just thought it was a particularly difficult boss, but I managed it on my third try. Or maybe the fourth, don't remember. I did it on the first try on my second playthrough on the hardest difficulty.
Planescape: Torment. In [spoiler but not really because it's obvious]'s tomb, there are a bunch of deadly traps and a puzzle. The only way to get through the tomb is to die multiple times. Which means sacrificing a whole bunch of random people around the multiverse, because that's how the protagonist's resurrection functions.
And in Jedi Outcast, you have to lose the first fight with Desann. Not a difficult thing, as he essentially turns you into kebab in roughly 15 seconds. The fact that this is all done in gameplay, rather than a cutscene is pretty cool nonetheless.
And in Jedi Outcast, you have to lose the first fight with Desann. Not a difficult thing, as he essentially turns you into kebab in roughly 15 seconds. The fact that this is all done in gameplay, rather than a cutscene is pretty cool nonetheless.
Damn, the Puzzle Canal was just what I stuck my head in here to say.FizzyIzze said:
Err, Halo: Reach I guess - although that's less 'die to continue' and more 'die to see end credits'. And a fair few CoD games have a high PC body count requiring the PC to die/become mortally wounded before the plot will move on.
There are other examples I seem to vaguely remember as well, but I can't recall the names of any of them for the life of me.
Final Fantasy IX has a few of these. Mostly when you fight Kuja and he pulls out his "Taking my ball and going home" spell I.E- Ultima.
In Prince of Persia 2008, you have to jump off a tower to a certain death at one point in order to defeat an enemy. May I remind you that this is the game where you CANNOT die by any means, because your magic-wielding partner will always be there to save you. The whole point of the "suicide jump" maneuver was to get her to come back to you after she disappeared for a while.
It took me forever to figure this out!
It took me forever to figure this out!
There isn't. If you were to get up to Battery Park, there's an immortal mechanically augmented bloke who I won't name so I won't spoil a decade old game that everyone really should have played already with some troops. You could get past him by cheating, but there's nothing there.Squilookle said:
OT: I actually can't think of anything. How odd.
A heartfelt thankyou for avoiding spoilers- I'm still first-playing through it. Loving it so far, though I'm stuck in that damned helibase en route to Hong Kong at the moment, so I guess I haven't gone -that- much further than Battery Park.VeryOddGamer said:
