Give me a reason to play Dota 2 (EDIT: entire new OP)

[Dys]

If you play, and are happy playing LoL, then dota isn't for you. The games may look similar, but they are not. Simple as that.

I've seen some crazy shit in the DOTA 2 videos i've watched. Blitzcrank 2.0 who can hook his own team from crazy range, some spells have ridiculous effects (5 second stun? Turns your entire team invisible for a time? On the same character?!)

Good luck to you if you're using POTMs arrow for 5 second stuns during teamfights consistently. It's nearly impossible. The invisibility ability has a cooldown, so while it can be useful for ganking, it is nearly hopeless as an escape mechanism. All in, it's one of the less powerful ultimates (despite how imba it may seem on paper).

But none of these characters seem as interesting to me as the LoL Champions. Sure LoL has it's share of boring generic characters as well but... I don't know. I look through the entire character list, watch gameplay footage etc etc but I can't find a single truly interesting character.

That's G fucking G as far as i'm concerned.

One exception. Templar Assassin. She's pretty cool looking with her invisiblity, God Mode, blade thingies and traps. I like her facination with secrets mainly though. Reminds me of me

She's no Irelia though. Nowhere near. Love that girl <3

The gameplay is kind of primary to the heroes backstories etc. There are still a lot of heroes missing as well, but at any rate the back story is kind of irrelevant and simply tacked on. If you're playing for the lore it seems you may be missing the point some.

[sub]You rely on your weapons too much... Try letting go![/sub]

That's exactly what it is that makes dota dynamic. The item build that you take can completely change the dynamic of your hero.[/quote]


This is all a moot point anyway, since my laptop can't run DOTA 2 for shit. You need to down the settings to lowest so everything is a mess of polygons. Perfectly functional polygons mind. However half the fun in these games is seeing all the cool effects spells have so fuck that.

Shocking as this may be to some people, but I would be perfectly happy with splitting my time between both DOTA 2 and LoL. I think I would enjoy DOTA but why should I have to "switch over" completely at all? There's room in this world for both y'know.[/quote]
Mmmm, maybe. I (as well as a few of my friends) certainly tried to go from dota to LoL and found that we couldn't handle it. It didn't reward good play at all (it actively stops you controlling your lane via denies!). It's too samey but with differences that make the one you're not used to infuriating and 'wrong' to play.

 

[SomeLameStuff]

Lane compositions that work in Dota 2:
1. One top, one mid, two bot, jungler.
2. Two top, one mid, two bot.
3. Three top, one mid, one bot.
4. One top, one mid, three bot.
5. One top, one mid, one bot, two roaming.
6. One top, one mid, one bot, one jungle, one roaming.

You forgot the two mid option =P And also,

7. One top, one mid, one jungler, two roaming, 0 bot.

It happens when the suicide bottom can't get xp and just jungles/roams.

EDIT: This is also why I'm certain a high tier LoL team would fail in DOTA, even after months of practice, while a DOTA team could be very successful in LoL - and bored at that.

Oh yeah. Milkfat, leader of clan MILK in Heroes of Newerth (or was anyway) decided to prove a point by playing LoL and getting to the top ten best players on the leaderboards in as quick a time as possible. He managed it in three months.

Chu, the (arguably) world best HoN player, took up that challenge as well. He did it on ONE.

So yeah, League of Legends is ridiculously easy compared to Dota 2 and HoN. People may prefer that, and that's fine, but if you decide to jump over to the harder side, don't whine about how badly you're sucking.


EDIT:

I've seen some crazy shit in the DOTA 2 videos i've watched. Blitzcrank 2.0 who can hook his own team from crazy range, some spells have ridiculous effects (5 second stun? Turns your entire team invisible for a time? On the same character?!)

That 5 second stun is the HARDEST stun to land in the game. It's hitbox is tiny, easily dodged, and the stun duration is reduced the closer you are to the target (a point blank in-your-face hit only gets you a 0.5 second stun, which makes me sadface.) AND it can hit creeps, so you have to line that up PERFECTLY and PRAY.

Also, uninteresting heroes? =P

 

[CpT_x_Killsteal]

someone who's a bit of a DOTA 2 fanboy,

A BIT of a fanboy?!?! right...

 

[NerfedFalcon]

So yeah, League of Legends is ridiculously easy compared to Dota 2 and HoN. People may prefer that, and that's fine, but if you decide to jump over to the harder side, don't whine about how badly you're sucking.

Do you want to know what my problem is with Dota 2? Burden of knowledge. It just assumes you know everything about the game and pushes you in at the deep end - not even a tooltip when you mouse over an item telling you 'Press button so-and-so to buy this item'. Also, some of the interface designs are just completely "WTF", like that you have to press two buttons to upgrade an ability. Is there any good reason for that second one?

 

[SomeLameStuff]

Do you want to know what my problem is with Dota 2? Burden of knowledge. It just assumes you know everything about the game and pushes you in at the deep end - not even a tooltip when you mouse over an item telling you 'Press button so-and-so to buy this item'. Also, some of the interface designs are just completely "WTF", like that you have to press two buttons to upgrade an ability. Is there any good reason for that second one?

Having to press two buttons to upgrade is how it was done in DotA 1. I think it's a little unwieldly as well, but the target audience ARE old DotA 1 players, so I can let it slide somewhat.

And people forget that DotA 2 is a BETA. IE, not all features are in the game yet. They're working on a tutorial, but it's obviously not ready just yet, and obviously not a particular priority. My only advice is to go into a game against AI and practice. Playing against the AI is more or less the tutorial anyway.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

Having to press two buttons to upgrade is how it was done in DotA 1. I think it's a little unwieldly as well, but the target audience ARE old DotA 1 players, so I can let it slide somewhat.

Aren't sequels meant to evolve? Especially to get rid of bad things about the original? So that basically makes Dota 2 a graphical upgrade that doesn't require you to own Warcraft 3.

 

[Comic Sans]

So yeah, League of Legends is ridiculously easy compared to Dota 2 and HoN. People may prefer that, and that's fine, but if you decide to jump over to the harder side, don't whine about how badly you're sucking.

Do you want to know what my problem is with Dota 2? Burden of knowledge. It just assumes you know everything about the game and pushes you in at the deep end - not even a tooltip when you mouse over an item telling you 'Press button so-and-so to buy this item'. Also, some of the interface designs are just completely "WTF", like that you have to press two buttons to upgrade an ability. Is there any good reason for that second one?

You realize that LoL was very similar in beta, right? No bots, no tutorials of any kind. It will be added later. In any case, at least they have private games you can do versus bots if you do desire to learn. That's more than LoL had in beta. I don't see how the burden of knowledge is really that much worse than LoL. Yes, there are more mechanics with denying and whatnot, but you don't need most of it (besides denying) at pub level play. Either way you need to know all the heroes and items to play properly.

 

[NerfedFalcon]

You realize that LoL was very similar in beta, right? No bots, no tutorials of any kind. It will be added later. In any case, at least they have private games you can do versus bots if you do desire to learn. That's more than LoL had in beta. I don't see how the burden of knowledge is really that much worse than LoL. Yes, there are more mechanics with denying and whatnot, but you don't need most of it (besides denying) at pub level play. Either way you need to know all the heroes and items to play properly.

And since you're given everything at the start but only in terms of unexplained in-game jargon (and a really bad picking interface), not to mention that finding the secret shop is impossible without consulting the Internet or months of throwing random iterations at the game, that means that success at even 'pub level play' is impossible until you've wasted years of your life on it.

 

[Comic Sans]

You realize that LoL was very similar in beta, right? No bots, no tutorials of any kind. It will be added later. In any case, at least they have private games you can do versus bots if you do desire to learn. That's more than LoL had in beta. I don't see how the burden of knowledge is really that much worse than LoL. Yes, there are more mechanics with denying and whatnot, but you don't need most of it (besides denying) at pub level play. Either way you need to know all the heroes and items to play properly.

And since you're given everything at the start but only in terms of unexplained in-game jargon (and a really bad picking interface), not to mention that finding the secret shop is impossible without consulting the Internet or months of throwing random iterations at the game, that means that success at even 'pub level play' is impossible until you've wasted years of your life on it.

Okay now you are using hyperbole. I don't like the single-card screen for picking, but grid view is fine. I like it better than LoL's where you can't even see all the champs on screen at once and have to scroll. You can even customize the grid in order to put your favorite heroes off to the side for quick access or something. The secret shop is not hard to find, at all. You can see it even through the fog, and there's 3 distinct paths that lead to it that you have to pass in two of the lanes for each team. If you do some basic map exploration it's easy to find. Most of your problems are related to there being no tutorial, which they are going to add at some point. They are hammering down the functionality of the main features before adding that and it will certainly be in by release. Even without it, there are many tutorials available online, and with the spectator mode you can watch games and see how it works and where things are easily. It does not take years to learn Dota. Hell, I taught myself to play the first one in about a week when I was 17. I wasn't great by any stretch but if you pay attention you can figure it out. It just requires more thought than other games do. It's worth it though. Just don't jump right into matchmaking without taking a little time to figure things out.

 

[RQshadowe]

The number of Dota fanboys in this thread is too damn high.

In response to the "only one strategy in LoL" argument. You are plain wrong. Most of the top american teams all of the top korean teams and at least two top european teams have their own metagames that they play to an extent. the whole 1-1-2+jungler meta is just a strategy that has dominance at the moment. If you knew anything about competitive LoL then you would know that in the latest two tournies people were running 2-1-1+j, 1-2-1+j and even 1-1-1+J+Roamer and those are just the examples in mind, what you see as a "META" in Dota is a loose outline and within that other meta play styles emerge for example Azubu Blaze tried out a new massive push strat and swept some serious games with it. However Dignitas prefer more of a endgame comp and TSM mix and match strats between double AP and protect the carry comps. Again just a few examples. In LoL the meta game doesn't necesarily revolve around lane composition but team composition, do you take a bruiser, or an AP for top lane? Do you play your ADC/Support Top lane because you will come out ahead on farm or do you take a soloADC (like urgot) and have a roaming ganking support (like alistar).
And yes, I have played Dota: Allstars and HoN I know the charm of that game and I also know how completely not fun it is learning that game, and I was being taught it by friends. The thought of attempting to learn it with no resources is... daunting.
A lot of the mechanics in Dota are just not necessary HOWEVER I do agree in that riot is making LoL too simple, I will miss dodge and manaburn but the decisions make sense as far as welcoming new players to the game.
And whoever said POTM is balanced is a moron. She is FB'd against every team with a POTM player on because in the right hands she is BROKEN.
And although people argue that DOTA players and HoN players come to LoL and make it look easy, that's all it is. Single players, LoL at the highest level is more of a team game than Dota 2 or HoN will ever be.
Dota2 is worth playing don't get me wrong. But implying it's superior to LoL or that the two are even comparable on anything past the most basic level is pure stupidity. It's like Xbox360 and Ps3 or Apple and Microsoft.
On a final note, @OP give Dota2 a chance, it does have a steep learning curve but it can be fun, I would NOT suggest playing with pubs. It's a waste of time. If you think the LoL community is terrible it has nothing on the Dota2 community, I'm pretty sure I have learnt several new racial slurs in the 6 months I have been playing Dota2. In the end if you are playing with friends that will be what makes either experience memorable in my opinion. As far as enjoying yourself I would say LoL is the wiser choice.
And yeah, my spelling sucks it's 7AM so sue me.

 

[lordmardok]

A friend of mine got me a beta key for the game because he thinks that I'm a casual cancer for still playing LoL, even though Dota 2 still isn't out of 'open' beta. So I eventually managed to get a game (seriously, the accept/decline thing is something that should be erased from existence in every universe) and from what I could tell, it was basically LoL except much, much more obtuse. It doesn't have a learning curve so much as a learning brick wall that starts from the instant you boot up the game - especially since the difficulty options outright lie. It should be more along the lines of 'Normal mode: I have played DotA: Allstars.'

Nobody thinks that I Wanna Be The Guy is a well-designed game for anything except making LP'ers cry. Why does Dota 2 get away with stuff like only having one way to do everything and no hints as to what that way is? That was everything I gleaned from one game, and based solely on that, I don't think it's worth my time to try again. First impressions last, after all.

But in the interest of being fair to a game that's still in 'beta', please give me one good reason (no, 'it's better than LoL because I say so' is not a good reason) to give it a second chance.

Edit: Somehow, all of you missed the point of this thread. Instead of making me want to play the game, now that I know that the community is worse than Xbox Live, I only hate it more. Great job.

Personally I don't want to give you a good reason to play DotA II. In my opinion it's terrible for a lot of reasons. So instead I'm gonna give you a lot of reasons to not play it and either go back to LoL or pick up HoN which is actually pretty good. Bear in mind, I have played many many games of DotA II so I'm speaking entirely from experience.

1. The unit pathing is so bad I've gotten glitched inside minions just running down a lane and it's gotten me killed more than once.

2. The 'Secret Shop' is retarded, I know DotA had it but that doesn't make it a good idea. It makes buying shit really fucking hard and annoying.

3. There are champions that are flat out broken in a manner that even a Beta can't excuse. Pudge and Riki are the main offenders, the former being able to Deny himself with ease and grant no gold and little experience even when he's been utterly outmaneuvered and deserves to die legitimately. To say nothing of his insane grab/ultimate combo that's basically a free 'Fuck You' for anyone play him who doesn't have a second-hand consolation prize for a brain. The latter possesses a literally infinite stealth that has a Fade Timer (thats the time it takes to go from visible to invisible) of a second or less. This means that no matter how hard you shut him down pre-level-6 it will never matter unless his player is a complete idiot.

4. The player community is a giant bag of dicks. Don't be fooled and go thinking that one game may have been a fluke. It wasn't. I only ever played DotA II because I liked the diversity of the heroes. There is a much higher ratio of Dickbag to Decent Player in this game than in LoL.

5. The reward system is crap and there's basically no means of banning leavers like LoL has.

So what I'm saying is, stick with LoL, your friend who thinks you're a 'casual cancer' is an idiot. League of Legends is the most player PC game in the world right now. Legitimately, I made a post about it, it clocked 1.3 billion hours played in six months, over twice what the runner up had. League of Legends is a far better game than DotA II objectively speaking because it is more polished, has better programming, has a decent user community that is regularly self-policed, quite successfully, and a massive international presence resulting in everything from national to world-level championships.

Good Day Sir (or Madam)

Postscript: For those who say "Oh it's still in beta!" can go suck on a septic tank. It's been in beta FOREVER. I've been playing this fucking 'beta' for nearly a YEAR. So they've had plenty of fucking time to iron out the basic bugs like tightening up the absolutely shit-tastic unit pathing.

 

[lordmardok]

And whoever said POTM is balanced is a moron. She is FB'd against every team with a POTM player on because in the right hands she is BROKEN.

Lol, I agree entirely. When I do play DotA 2 I play her because I am that player. The one who makes the entire team go invisible right before a big fight, or right in the middle of a massive gank to prevent our entire team from dying.

A champion with a global invisibility ult is not balanced. I'll bet these are the same people who claim that Pudge and Riki are balanced. Liars.

 

[Comic Sans]

A friend of mine got me a beta key for the game because he thinks that I'm a casual cancer for still playing LoL, even though Dota 2 still isn't out of 'open' beta. So I eventually managed to get a game (seriously, the accept/decline thing is something that should be erased from existence in every universe) and from what I could tell, it was basically LoL except much, much more obtuse. It doesn't have a learning curve so much as a learning brick wall that starts from the instant you boot up the game - especially since the difficulty options outright lie. It should be more along the lines of 'Normal mode: I have played DotA: Allstars.'

Nobody thinks that I Wanna Be The Guy is a well-designed game for anything except making LP'ers cry. Why does Dota 2 get away with stuff like only having one way to do everything and no hints as to what that way is? That was everything I gleaned from one game, and based solely on that, I don't think it's worth my time to try again. First impressions last, after all.

But in the interest of being fair to a game that's still in 'beta', please give me one good reason (no, 'it's better than LoL because I say so' is not a good reason) to give it a second chance.

Edit: Somehow, all of you missed the point of this thread. Instead of making me want to play the game, now that I know that the community is worse than Xbox Live, I only hate it more. Great job.

Personally I don't want to give you a good reason to play DotA II. In my opinion it's terrible for a lot of reasons. So instead I'm gonna give you a lot of reasons to not play it and either go back to LoL or pick up HoN which is actually pretty good. Bear in mind, I have played many many games of DotA II so I'm speaking entirely from experience.

1. The unit pathing is so bad I've gotten glitched inside minions just running down a lane and it's gotten me killed more than once.

2. The 'Secret Shop' is retarded, I know DotA had it but that doesn't make it a good idea. It makes buying shit really fucking hard and annoying.

3. There are champions that are flat out broken in a manner that even a Beta can't excuse. Pudge and Riki are the main offenders, the former being able to Deny himself with ease and grant no gold and little experience even when he's been utterly outmaneuvered and deserves to die legitimately. To say nothing of his insane grab/ultimate combo that's basically a free 'Fuck You' for anyone play him who doesn't have a second-hand consolation prize for a brain. The latter possesses a literally infinite stealth that has a Fade Timer (thats the time it takes to go from visible to invisible) of a second or less. This means that no matter how hard you shut him down pre-level-6 it will never matter unless his player is a complete idiot.

4. The player community is a giant bag of dicks. Don't be fooled and go thinking that one game may have been a fluke. It wasn't. I only ever played DotA II because I liked the diversity of the heroes. There is a much higher ratio of Dickbag to Decent Player in this game than in LoL.

5. The reward system is crap and there's basically no means of banning leavers like LoL has.

So what I'm saying is, stick with LoL, your friend who thinks you're a 'casual cancer' is an idiot. League of Legends is the most player PC game in the world right now. Legitimately, I made a post about it, it clocked 1.3 billion hours played in six months, over twice what the runner up had. League of Legends is a far better game than DotA II objectively speaking because it is more polished, has better programming, has a decent user community that is regularly self-policed, quite successfully, and a massive international presence resulting in everything from national to world-level championships.

Good Day Sir (or Madam)

Postscript: For those who say "Oh it's still in beta!" can go suck on a septic tank. It's been in beta FOREVER. I've been playing this fucking 'beta' for nearly a YEAR. So they've had plenty of fucking time to iron out the basic bugs like tightening up the absolutely shit-tastic unit pathing.

Oooooh boy. One of THOSE posts. You're entitled to your opinion and all that, but you are wrong in several of the aspects you call facts.

1. It's not glitchy, body blocking is there on purpose. You can block creeps to slow their progress to the lane and make the fight closer to your tower, and you can also body block heroes. I've seen plays many times where a team mate is one hit from death and survives because someone runs in front of the enemy and blocks their pathing to give the near-dead a chance to escape. Heroes with summons or dominated creeps are great for this. Using Lycan's wolves to body block is high level micro and quite effective.

2. Secret shop is so you can't just turtle in your base all day. If you want good stuff you have to come out. The area it is in is great for fog juking as well.

3. Pudge and Riki are not broken. Far from it. Both have had their time to shine at high level but are very rarely picked. Pudge is hard countered by map awareness and good positioning. He is great against new players and uncoordinated pubs because they don't have high map awareness and probably aren't warded, so they get hooked out of nowhere. Knowing where he's roaming and keeping creeps between you and him does wonders. He also drops off as the game goes on. He's a good ganker but it's all he can do. And Riki has decent armor but low health, and absolutely explodes if he gets focused on a bit. There are WAY more stealth counters in Dota than LoL. Rev wards have higher reveal radius than LoL's vision wards, a Bound Eye can be picked up by your team if you die, unlike the potions in LoL. And Dust is cheap and comes with multiple charges. He's a solid hero, and like Pudge he wrecks uncoordinated players which is why he might seem OP but he's really not, at all.

4. The dick ratio is about even in my experience. People are bad at lower levels in Dota but get better as you go. Same as LoL. Both have dicks. If anything HoN is the bad one.

5. What would you have for rewards then? Free cosmetics is nice, and you get all the heroes for free. And Valve DOES punish people. They are forced to play with other trolls and leavers, and repeat offenders can lose access to the game. I've been notified several times that people I reported got punished.

Personally, I find Dota much more polished. The graphics are great, the voice acting is phenomenal, the spectator system is leagues above anything else in the genre, it has fully functional replays, and doesn't run on Adobe Air. Dota 2 had over half a million people watching it's International finals, it is a solid contender and will do well.

And whoever said POTM is balanced is a moron. She is FB'd against every team with a POTM player on because in the right hands she is BROKEN.

Lol, I agree entirely. When I do play DotA 2 I play her because I am that player. The one who makes the entire team go invisible right before a big fight, or right in the middle of a massive gank to prevent our entire team from dying.

A champion with a global invisibility ult is not balanced. I'll bet these are the same people who claim that Pudge and Riki are balanced. Liars.

PotM is fine. She is a good all-around hero but doesn't excel. She can't carry like dedicated carries, doesn't gank as hard as dedicated gankers. She is picked sometimes in high level play, but barely. There is almost always a better pick. You can't take the balance into account in LoL terms. While in LoL something like that seems unbalanced, in Dota it is not. The threshold of power is higher, and the game doesn't play the same.

 

[JaceArveduin]

So you like LoL and you want a reason to play DOTA?

It's not shit.

/thread

Spoiler

Alright, alright! I'll make a proper post.

Why does Dota 2 get away with stuff like only having one way to do everything and no hints as to what that way is?

Because DOTA 2 is in beta and the tutorials aren't finished yet.

But in the interest of being fair to a game that's still in 'beta', please give me one good reason (no, 'it's better than LoL because I say so' is not a good reason) to give it a second chance.

I'll give you more than one. Heres a post I made in another thread.

Just to touch on a few things:


2) Your views on rune pages, hero/champion unlocking and customization in general are strange to put it kindly. LoL really does ride the fine line between pay2win and acceptable cash shop. Champions having to be unlocked is alright, I guess - after all, theres more than one champion that can fill a specific role. The thing is this practically makes nerfing shit into the ground an absolute necessity. Imagine Riot brought out a support champion that can disable an entire team in an instant for 5 seconds, while other cheaper champions only have a tiny one target, 3 second stun up their sleeve. Suddenly it's become pay2win.

What this ends up meaning for LoL is Riot can't ever give a champion an absolutely crazy ability, because most of the playerbase lacks the currency to unlock him.

Anyway, so champion unlocking rides the fine line. Rune pages take the fine line and leap over it. You can outright buy health, regen and AP, which is fucking bullshit. I don't think I need to explain why. Excusing it by saying it overs customization? Why not make rune pages and runes completely free right off the bat? Best of both worlds. Oh, sure, Riot might loose a little profit, but that still doesn't make the mechanic any better. Understandable, but still a good reason to not play LoL.

Now for the big one - balance. DOTA 2 has some balancing problems, theres no arguing it. Some heros are just flat out overpowered - Rubick and Lycan spring to mind. (If you want to argue about that, I'd be more than happy to.)

LoL approaches balance differently. Riots balancing plan seems to consist of nerfing everything they can every 2 months, until one day, you join a game only to realize all weapons have been replaced with foam. Mana burn and good disables are left out completely, because they are "anti-fun". That's a kind way of saying "The more casual people in our audience can't handle these abilities and would get slaughtered when confronted with them because they refuse to learn counter picking, map knowledge and cannot into situational awareness".

On top of that LoL offers free "out of jail" cards, like blink. Sorry, I can't deal with that. So this guy I just outplayed is going to get away because every player on the map gets a free you-suck-but-oh-well-so-here-just-escape ability with a low cooldown? Fucking seriously?

LoL's main problem is how low the skillcap is when compared to DOTA and HoN. As a result, it's more forgiving and easier for the first 10 games maybe. Nevertheless, getting into any MOBA title is a daunting experience, so why someone would just refuse to hold out for 10 more games when it means they will have more fun later is beyond me. I have even more things to write but I have to go now. If anyone disagrees I'm open to a discussion, and I'd elaborate on my points.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and 2 more things; the European servers for LoL are fucking awful and Riot deserve thousands of feet up their ass for daring to implement Pando Media Booster in their game. If you demand money for champions and let players buy power you better fucking make sure your servers are up to scratch. And please, if you're letting players pay 10 dollars for a bloody skin use that money to buy servers so you don't have to leech off a users internet connection when sending patches.

Just for the record, and I'm pretty sure I responded to this the first time you posted it... But you can not buy runes and masteries with cash. They're all ingame cash. Now you can buy boosts so that you get experience and ingame points faster, but that's convenience. Honestly? I've got more than I'd ever need to be competitive with only buying the boxed version, which was only for the skin and RP card. AKA I'm sitting on 27000 IP with nothing I feel like spending it on.

Not everyone has an innate blink, though some do, and I couldn't call ~5 minutes a low cooldown for Flash's blink. Though I will admit Riot's balancing can be iffy, they usually nerf/buff things to shift the meta.

Okay, that's my only two complaints with your post, the rest is probably true. I'll even add a point against Riot: Manaless champs, hate those bastards. Though I'll add the reason I didn't like HoN (it's close enough, and I played it during free weekends before f2p) was that it was unforgiving and unclear in places. I do play a mean blacksmith, as it so happens.

Oh, and denying, never understood the reason behind allowing it.

 

[RivFader86]

Well the reason i want to play DoTa2 (having played neither DoTa nor LoL for an extended time) is that a game with a steep learning curve usually has a bigger payoff at it's "peak" than a game that is easy to get in to.

But i get where you comming from or as TB said in some video

"Why would i want to play game xxx when i have learned to play LoL why should i go through the learning process all over again when i learned LoL"

(well he didn't say that word for word but something along those lines...i guess you get the point though)

 

[schtingah]

You just have to ask yourself what you're looking for in the MOBA genre.

Are you looking for a bit more of a laid back casual experience? Good, keep playing LoL and have fun doing so.

Are you more of a competitive gamer who likes to be challenged and can you deal with people being assholes? Might wonna give DotA 2 another try.

The learning curve IS a ***** for sure but if you can find a friendly community and read guides it isn't impossible to get through, does take effort though.

 

[SomeLameStuff]

Oh, and denying, never understood the reason behind allowing it.

Denying is actually pretty damned important. Denying creeps prevents the enemy hero from getting the gold from the creep, and gives them reduced xp. If you're good enough, you can have a one or two level advantage over the opponent in the LANING phase, which can be massive.

Against heroes who thrive off early farm and levels, it can absolutely devastate them and reduce their effectiveness for the entire game. Heroes like Tiny/Pebbles who shine when they have that early blink and level advantage? Absolutely gone.

Also, denying pulls the creep wave closer to your tower, so you can stay relatively safe next to it. And anyone diving the tower can be met with your allies teleporting in to save your ass much quicker than if you were pushed up.

And also, the guy who said Riki was overpowered? Tell me how overpowered he is when he's HARD countered by an item which costs 100 gold and is frequently bought by players. And countering Pudge is done easily as well. Hook? Meet creep wave. DERP!

 

[StBishop]

Blitzcrank 2.0

You mean Pudge? The guy who both devourer and blitzcrank are based off of?

Yeah, that guy.

It shits me to tears when people act as if HoN and LoL aren't the derivative ones. Really does.

OT: Dude, do what you want. DotA is awesome, LoL is awesome, HoN is awesome. MOBA's are awesome. If you don't like DotA and don't have friends to play with then stick to LoL. There's nothing wrong with that.

I don't like LoL and the only reason I play is because my mates play. I still prefer DotA, Dota 2, and HoN, but I just suck it up.

[Rikimaru is broken]

Buy an eye.

 

[major_chaos]

snip

I can't say I have played DOTA2 but from what I have gathered on the net I would answer your question with "don't, and tell your friend to pull the stick out of his ass". Everyone is entitled to his own opinion but absolutely nothing about DOTA2 appeals to me, the community seems to be just as bad as LoL but less "clueless morons" and more "massively elitist assholes", the champ designs just don't look good to me, the obtuse mechanics like denying and losing all gold on death seem to take the normal MOBA skill gap and expand it to more of a skill abyssal trench, I don't see how the lack of a strong meta could possibly be a good thing rather then a recipe for zero coordination and terrible team comps and new players not having roles and end goals, while I don't always love the LoL approach of "nerf everything till balanced" I prefer it to the DOTA2 opposite approach of "buff moar!, global ults! Insta-kills! 30 second stuns!" aka "if everyone is OP then we have balance", I also really don't like the "all champs unlocked from the start your reward is stupid hats" model, I'm a progress whore damnit and I just don't feel like i'm making progress if there is nothing meaningful to unlock. And thats just off the top of my head, so if you are (like me) perfectly happy with LoL as your MOBA of choice just stay with it, contrary to what the fanboys say I really doubt its going to go away any time soon.

 

[Vigormortis]

So yeah, League of Legends is ridiculously easy compared to Dota 2 and HoN. People may prefer that, and that's fine, but if you decide to jump over to the harder side, don't whine about how badly you're sucking.

Do you want to know what my problem is with Dota 2? Burden of knowledge. It just assumes you know everything about the game and pushes you in at the deep end - not even a tooltip when you mouse over an item telling you 'Press button so-and-so to buy this item'. Also, some of the interface designs are just completely "WTF", like that you have to press two buttons to upgrade an ability. Is there any good reason for that second one?

The two button thing for upgrading is because, even though someone may have just leveled, they may not want to upgrade their ability at that exact moment. Therefore, having the ability hot-keys be the upgrade keys, by themselves, would be counter-productive.

Sometimes you'll want to save an upgrade for a later moment. For example, you may not know which ability you'll need in given situation, so saving an upgrade point is smart.

Other times, you'll want to save that point for basic stat upgrade. Why? Let's say you're in a group fight, it goes badly, and you need to escape. Popping that point into your baseline stats will give you a buff to your hitpoints, your speed, and your mana pool. This can, at times, be the difference between escaping or dying.

As for the "burden of knowledge", it bares reiterating:

It's a beta.

It's not complete yet. Ergo, many of the tutorials, of which will be made available to everyone upon release, are not implemented yet.

Why? Because getting the game into a complete, functional state is a tad higher on the priority list than putting in some tutorials.

They'll be added. Have no fear about that. They just aren't of a higher priority than adding all of the heroes, items, features, and engine polishes. It doesn't "assume" you know everything already, as you seem to think it does. If Valve thought that they wouldn't have taken the time to add "learn" tabs and menues into the game, now would they?

It seems to me you went into playing Dota 2 wanting to find things to hate about it. I mean, you felt like passing judgement on the game in it's entirety based on one bot match. That doesn't really seem fair or even logical.

A lot of people have explained to you the key differences, pros and cons, between Dota 2 and LoL. I won't waste time reiterating. However, I can offer this:

If you like action-RTS games, then Dota 2 is easily one of the best examples of the genre.

Is it better than LoL? Sure, in a lot of ways. Just as LoL is better than Dota in many ways. The thing you need to ask yourself is - Are you willing to learn how Dota actually plays, and as a result have a more challenging but far more expansive experience than LoL? Or, are you happy to just stick with the knowledge you have and fore-go learning a new game?

If you're open to the former, than keep playing Dota 2. I'd wager you'll find it very fun and rewarding in no time. If the latter, than just stick to LoL and don't give the matter another thought.

It's your choice.