God of War Team "Pulling Back" From Violence Against Women

[cynicalsaint1]

I... I don't understand this website. If we switched the situation here and the heading was something like "God of War Devs Refuse to Tone Down the Violence on Women in their Games", the responses would probably be similar to what we've seen in the Tomb Raider threads and so on. You know... I'm beginning to suspect people just like to oppose things for the sake of opposing them!

Shit guys, I think I'm onto something here! -.-

Pretty much this.
I don't know what it is but there's something about being on the internet that makes people want to be outraged.

Probably appropriate for God of War seeing as Kratos has the biggest rage-hard on of them all.

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

I... I don't understand this website. If we switched the situation here and the heading was something like "God of War Devs Refuse to Tone Down the Violence on Women in their Games", the responses would probably be similar to what we've seen in the Tomb Raider threads and so on. You know... I'm beginning to suspect people just like to oppose things for the sake of opposing them!

Shit guys, I think I'm onto something here! -.-

Pretty much this.
I don't know what it is but there's something about being on the internet that makes people want to be outraged.

Probably appropriate for God of War seeing as Kratos has the biggest rage-hard on of them all.

It didn't make me outraged but it did make me roll my eyes as they completely missed the point as to why the Hitman and Tomb Raider issues came up.

 

[SFMB]

Ok: I just hope the developers, instead of focusing in violence on women, decide to make the world more accurate by showing Kratos making love to young boys, like any philosopher of old.

 

[Treblaine]

...I do view it as a good thing in general, although the early steps taken, including this one, are pretty bumbling and inept. Games and gaming culture do have serious issues with underlying currents of pretty vicious sexism, as evidenced by the embarrassing parade of practically weekly debacles lately...

lol WUUUUUUTTT?!?!?!?

Reasoned and considered debates that DARE to challenge assertions like Anita Sarkeesian are not a "debacle" and not evidence of vicious sexism.

I mean what kind of logic is this "You can tell he's guilty, because when I accuse him of being guilty he disputed it".

and moves like this are the awkward flailing of a homebody dragged out into the light desperately trying to clean themselves up before anyone else sees them looking so disheveled.

As for treating violence against men and women differently, well without defending this particular case (honestly, did we need any particular reason to shake our heads at the blatant wringing of a tired old cash cow long past the point of any real innovation?), violence against men and violence against women do have significantly different connotations, not because of any reality within the game--which might be an immersive imaginary world without millenia long legacies of sexism where men and women might be treated completely equally by the game's idealized fictional society--but rather because the games themselves exist as physical objects within a world where sexism and oppression of women is very much a real thing, both historically and today, around the world and 'here' in wherever 'here' happens to be for you.

"violence against men and violence against women do have significantly different connotations"

Is an example of sexism. Just as:

"violence against blacks and violence against whites do have significantly different connotations"

is racist.

"sexism and oppression of women is very much a real thing"

Yes, sexism exists, so we should have some more sexism as a solution. Did you really think such an argument could stand up to any kind of scrutiny? How can Two Wrongs make a right? Sexism cannot be solved by banishing women from and significant role in video games, and denying female voice actors work as well as women feeling they have any relevance in such epic stories. There ARE women in the Greek mythology from which God of War series draws its material, both as antagonists and allies, but all are being censored to appease the Conservatives dressed in the sheep's clothing of the label "feminist".

It's not feminism to remove women from such games, it's conservatism.

The sexism that continues to exist in the world are things like forced marriages, death sentence for adulterous women (while polygamy permitted for men), people trafficking that is little more than sex slavery. That is NOT best solved by refusing to have any women in an emerging media form like video games.

There is a lot of homophobia in the world, with many part of the world having the death penalty and other parts de-facto allowing lynching and other abuse of homosexuals. That doesn't mean you can't have a gay character in a video game.

 

[cynicalsaint1]

It didn't make me outraged but it did make me roll my eyes as they completely missed the point as to why the Hitman and Tomb Raider issues came up.

I can't say I'm surprised seeing as they've also completely missed the point of Kratos as a character since the first game, strange how no one's seemed to really care before ...

 

[Ukomba]

Would female Kratos also be topless?

I'd imagine she would wear something that made her look powerful like Kratos... who isn't sexualised at all.

Mmmm, not sure that's true. Unless you believe the Spartans from the movie 300 weren't sexualised. They wear about the same amount of clothing. Given some of the other imagry in the original trilogy, I could easily see keeping the same outfit and making it a simple gender swap.

But That probably wasn't your point, but my original comment was a joke so that's only fair .

Anyways, you'd run into the same basic problem that the genders are simply different. Kratos is pretty much running around in just a loin cloth with some body paint (ashes). If you did the same style with a female, even covering the top, she'd seem more sexualised and less powerful simply due to physique.

 

[Soxafloppin]

I wonder if he will still do sex to them via quick time events.

 

[WindKnight]

Seriously? Your games have treated women like sex puppets sitting on beds waiting for men to bonk em.

Please don't tell me that suddenly you're all up for feminism. Because that's the wrong way to go. Long as you don't sexualize the violence against women, which until now you haven't done (you have used women for nothing but sex), it's all right.

I looked up the 'door stopper' sequences mentioned in the main article, and an old critical miss. The gameplay leading up to it involves, apart from hacking and slashing your way through monsters, roughly pushing and pulling a topless woman around the level. (the gameplay seemed to give several closeups of her chest so the guys could totally ogle her naked tits if they wished to) So, yeah, she was pretty much sexualised as a weak, frightened and naked woman being manhandled by a powerful, burly guy, and is 'used' in a clearly fatal manner.

 

[Kahunaburger]

It didn't make me outraged but it did make me roll my eyes as they completely missed the point as to why the Hitman and Tomb Raider issues came up.

I can't say I'm surprised seeing as they've also completely missed the point of Kratos as a character since the first game, strange how no one's seemed to really care before ...

You can even make the case that making a game set in Greek mythology the sort of "edgy" that appeals primarily to 14-year old boys is missing the point from the get-go. *cue Inception bwoon.*

 

[Moonlight Butterfly]

Would female Kratos also be topless?

I'd imagine she would wear something that made her look powerful like Kratos... who isn't sexualised at all.

Mmmm, not sure that's true. Unless you believe the Spartans from the movie 300 weren't sexualised. They wear about the same amount of clothing. Given some of the other imagry in the original trilogy, I could easily see keeping the same outfit and making it a simple gender swap.

But That probably wasn't your point, but my original comment was a joke so that's only fair .

Anyways, you'd run into the same basic problem that the genders are simply different. Kratos is pretty much running around in just a loin cloth with some body paint (ashes). If you did the same style with a female, even covering the top, she'd seem more sexualised and less powerful simply due to physique.

Personally I wouldn't have a problem with lady Kratos running around with her top off ripping dudes apart. As long as she was muscular, bald and badass.

300 is very sexualised (glistening abs ahoy) but Kratos isn't. Clothes aren't the reason something comes across as sexualised it's also how a character acts and comports themselves and how the camera and narrative treats them.

It's the difference between

Spoiler: This

and

Spoiler: This

 

[Jak23]

I know I'll get a lot of flame for saying this, but I'm actually glad they did this. I always feel like I have a giant dirty rock of guilt and disgust in my stomach when I beat up/kill women in games.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Would female Kratos also be topless?

I'd imagine she would wear something that made her look powerful like Kratos... who isn't sexualised at all.

Mmmm, not sure that's true. Unless you believe the Spartans from the movie 300 weren't sexualised. They wear about the same amount of clothing. Given some of the other imagry in the original trilogy, I could easily see keeping the same outfit and making it a simple gender swap.

But That probably wasn't your point, but my original comment was a joke so that's only fair .

Anyways, you'd run into the same basic problem that the genders are simply different. Kratos is pretty much running around in just a loin cloth with some body paint (ashes). If you did the same style with a female, even covering the top, she'd seem more sexualised and less powerful simply due to physique.

Re: Kratos and sexualization, look at a picture of Kratos and some ancient Greek depictions of armed dudes. Just sayin'

 

[Ukomba]

Would female Kratos also be topless?

I'd imagine she would wear something that made her look powerful like Kratos... who isn't sexualised at all.

Mmmm, not sure that's true. Unless you believe the Spartans from the movie 300 weren't sexualised. They wear about the same amount of clothing. Given some of the other imagry in the original trilogy, I could easily see keeping the same outfit and making it a simple gender swap.

But That probably wasn't your point, but my original comment was a joke so that's only fair .

Anyways, you'd run into the same basic problem that the genders are simply different. Kratos is pretty much running around in just a loin cloth with some body paint (ashes). If you did the same style with a female, even covering the top, she'd seem more sexualised and less powerful simply due to physique.

Re: Kratos and sexualization, look at a picture of Kratos and some ancient Greek depictions of armed dudes. Just sayin'

Ancient Greeks were pervs. An accurate movie of Greek mythology would not only be rated X, but would probably be illegal.

 

[Micalas]

Oh good! Sony Santa Monica has single-handedly stopped violence against women. What's that? Nothing changed? Statistics wouldn't have budged one way or the other? Oh...

 

[SquidVicious]

Considering this is set in the time before the original God of War game, it kind of makes sense that he won't be as sociopathic as he was in the series after the first one. I actually recently replayed the original God of War and was amazed at a scene where you come across a group of massacred soldiers and Kratos actually looks horrified by what's infront of him. If it was GoW2 or 3 he would have been saddend that it wasn't his fine work he was observing.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Would female Kratos also be topless?

I'd imagine she would wear something that made her look powerful like Kratos... who isn't sexualised at all.

Mmmm, not sure that's true. Unless you believe the Spartans from the movie 300 weren't sexualised. They wear about the same amount of clothing. Given some of the other imagry in the original trilogy, I could easily see keeping the same outfit and making it a simple gender swap.

But That probably wasn't your point, but my original comment was a joke so that's only fair .

Anyways, you'd run into the same basic problem that the genders are simply different. Kratos is pretty much running around in just a loin cloth with some body paint (ashes). If you did the same style with a female, even covering the top, she'd seem more sexualised and less powerful simply due to physique.

Re: Kratos and sexualization, look at a picture of Kratos and some ancient Greek depictions of armed dudes. Just sayin'

Ancient Greeks were pervs. An accurate movie of Greek mythology would not only be rated X, but would probably be illegal.

Probably for more reasons than one haha. I've run into at least two scenes so far in the Iliad where people get stabbed in the face in an angle that causes their eyes to fly out, complete with description of trailing ocular nerve. Also there's a scene in the Oddyssey where a traitor gets killed in a way that wouldn't be out of place in A Song of Ice and Fire, except that GRRM writes elaborate tortures for shock value and Homer writes elaborate tortures because that's what happens to traitors in ancient Greece. Which is part of why when God of War tries to be edgy I have a hard time taking it seriously.

[small]More interestingly, the characters all this terrible stuff happens too aren't faceless in the same way the characters that get killed off in our fiction are. There's a lot of stuff in the Iliad along the lines of "this guy lived in [city]. He was always kind to his dogs, and left behind a kid who would be 10 now. He always fights alongside his brother. Then Ajax ran them both through." So the ancient Greek version of violence is more mature than God of War's version of violence in more ways than one.[/small]

 

[kommando367]

I see where they are coming from with this becuase this is Kratos before he let his vengeance consume him and indiscriminately killed everything that moved. Still, I better be able to decapitate gorgons or there will be hell to pay!

 

[Frankster]

snip

In that first pic it's like she tried to swing a heavy sword too suddenly and is in the process of breaking her spine due to the momentum of the swing, it's actually a really gruesome pic :S Even the facial expression seems to match.