Hacking/BOTTING on MMOs is morally superior over hacking FPS etc
- Thread starter ionveau
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Why play the game if you aren't going to play the game?
I've had this discussion many times with a few friends of mine. As it turns out, most people spend hours on end watching their bot. If you're sitting at your desk watching the screen, you may as well just play.
Also; If you'd like to see a game that was ruined by botting, go check out International Silkroad Online(ISro). Oh wait, you can't log into any of their 46 servers(total capacity of 161,000 players) because they're always completely full. Not even half of the people are players, they're bots. I've met more than my share of people running 6-7 bots on 1 computer, and running 3-4 computers.
I've had this discussion many times with a few friends of mine. As it turns out, most people spend hours on end watching their bot. If you're sitting at your desk watching the screen, you may as well just play.
Also; If you'd like to see a game that was ruined by botting, go check out International Silkroad Online(ISro). Oh wait, you can't log into any of their 46 servers(total capacity of 161,000 players) because they're always completely full. Not even half of the people are players, they're bots. I've met more than my share of people running 6-7 bots on 1 computer, and running 3-4 computers.
Either the OP is a troll or simply mentally deficient. Either way you'd be much more likely to get an intelligent discussion from any random wall than this idiot. By arguing with him you're just playing right in to his sad sad cry for attention. We get it junior you were either not hugged enough or hugged too much and in an inappropriate manner as a child. Now please go do us all a favor and go bother someone else. I hear 4chan is lovely this time of the year. You'd probably fit in perfectly.
This argument boils down to "which is better, a punch to the face or a kick to the groin?" While one is arguably a more preferable choice than the other, I would opt to not have to choose between the two.
Hacking/botting is cheating no matter the game or the genre. You are playing the game in a manner that is deviant from what is intended such to gain an unfair advantage. In an FPS, you gain the unfair advantage of speed, precision, or dodging/defense over those not playing with such hacks/bots. In an MMO, you gain an unfair advantage of resources and number of rare drops over those not playing with such hacks/bots. No matter how you look at it, the person hacking/botting gains an unfair advantage over those who play the game as it was intended by using their own skill and efforts; in both cases, the game is completely ruined for these players. There is no difference of degree because the effect spans the entirety of that game's community.
One mitigation for this unfair advantage is if everyone plays with hacks/bots, but this will de-value the game because people are no longer really playing, the hacks/bots are. Another mitigation is to design the game such that it does this sort of thing intrinsically, but this will de-value the game because people are no longer really playing, the game is. Third mitigation is to build the game such using such hacks/bots is impossible; unfortunately, this has significant cost issues for the developer and has yet to be completely successful.
Cheating is cheating, and it causes problems for everyone.
(Personal rant: I really wish the internet would stop with these "moral" arguments regarding things. They're often just silly BS arguments that are 10x worse than anything you'll hear from the religious zealots the internet loves to mock, especially considering the internet's morality seems to boil down to "give me what I want, let me do what I want, and leave me alone", as opposed to any actual principles of right or wrong.)
One mitigation for this unfair advantage is if everyone plays with hacks/bots, but this will de-value the game because people are no longer really playing, the hacks/bots are. Another mitigation is to design the game such that it does this sort of thing intrinsically, but this will de-value the game because people are no longer really playing, the game is. Third mitigation is to build the game such using such hacks/bots is impossible; unfortunately, this has significant cost issues for the developer and has yet to be completely successful.
Cheating is cheating, and it causes problems for everyone.
(Personal rant: I really wish the internet would stop with these "moral" arguments regarding things. They're often just silly BS arguments that are 10x worse than anything you'll hear from the religious zealots the internet loves to mock, especially considering the internet's morality seems to boil down to "give me what I want, let me do what I want, and leave me alone", as opposed to any actual principles of right or wrong.)
Hacking and botting is wrong no matter what type of game you do it on. It ruins the fun for others and people using hacks and bots are only making the experience with the game worse for themselves. If they're not going to play a game properly then why fucking buy it in the first place.
Yeah, but how many legitimate players have suffered because your bot was hogging the resources to train their Mages as well? The problem is training most skills in an MMO is competitive, if you have a tonne of bots working faster than any human could, then actual humans are blocked from experiencing that gameplay, because they can't compete, or have to try and compete with the bots, making it an unenjoyable experience, and taking them 10 times as long.ionveau said:
It also ruins any high scores, if you are in the top 50,000 for a skill, how many players got there legitimately, how many used a bot, taking absolutely no effort? And how many players were held back from being able to train that skill because the place was full of bots hogging it up?
It harms the gameplay, the economy, the competitiveness and highscores.
I'm sorry, but MMORPG's aren't competitive. The skill cap is way, WAY too low. Especially in WoW's case.Hero in a half shell said:
To play a "fixed" MMORPG experience try Progress Quest.
http://progressquest.com/ - The world's first (and best) 0-player game.
Training skills is often competitive, if you have a limited number of places to train a skill, (Eg. 5 rocks to mine at) and seven people are there to train, then mining the rocks is a competitive skill. And if 6 out of those 7 people are botts, the legitimate player gets stiffed.Chibz said:
Uh, no. That's a very bad analogy.Tax_Document said:
After all, a bot is a program specifically designed to do a task.
It's more like, why bother making things by hand, when you can use an industrial robot?
And guess what? The only answers typically given are:
"Hand-made things are better"
or
"If we allow robots to do our jobs we won't have any work."
The second is particularly stupid.
It creates a perverse incentive to ignore improvements in efficiency for the sake of people having work.
Answer me this; Which is better?:
Getting people to do work that could be done more efficiently by machines, just so they'll have something to do?
Or
Giving people money to not do anything at all?
But that's beside the point.
Comparing a computer game to work is pretty much the stupidest comparison ever. If you feel the need to cheat at a multi-player game, why are you playing it at all?
Or maybe the people who can't handle the grind and have to bot should mozy over to a less time consuming game, and let the MMORPG players actually play their game in peace.Chibz said:
I sound angry here, but it's just at the way some MMO's have been invaded with bots, hogging resources, making actually playing them frustrating and a lot more time consuming.
The problem is, the all consuming nature of an MMORPG is deliberate. It's to make the game more and more like cocaine than a real game.Hero in a half shell said:
I honestly doubt anyone REALLY enjoys the grind. But it's there for less-than-wholesome/honest reasns.
My number is higher than yours therefore I win. But my bonuses aren't anywhere nearly as high as yours so now I lost? WTF. THAT is how they are competitive. The rolls are RANDOM. If you bot to get a certain item or items or farm somethings so that you change the economy of the game it is A LOT more damaging than if you were to bot a FPS. Botting and hacking an FPS is not damaging to the games system at all just takes the fun out of it for who you are versing at the time. Botting/hacking an FPS has dire repercussions throughout the ENTIRE player base of the game because of the effects on item numbers and the economy.ionveau said:
Your argument makes sense at the simple level of affecting the fun of someone right away. But then after a while botting/hacking is a lot more damaging.