Han and Greedo : Am I missing something?

[Sniper_Zegai]

OK so having watched Clerks 2 the other day this whole thing with Han Solo and Greedo from Star Wars cropped up again but I keep hearing about this.

So I should just ask, is there something I missed that actually makes this subject care worthy?

 

[Drong]

Han shot first


(or he did in the original then in the first re-make Mr Lucas decided to screw things up and have Grredo shoot first but somehow miss from point blank range, the fans were in uproar and in the final re-make it got changed back to Han shooting first.) It's just a example of directors messing with classic films many years later when they should realise that it's art and you can't go changing it

 

[tiredinnuendo]

I'm not sure what you're asking, so I'll just fill you in on the situation as best I can, and if you knew all this already, my apologies.

The original Han Solo from Star Wars was not really a big thinker, and the line about having "a blaster at your side" was kind of him defined. He gets frustrated on the intercom, he shoots the intercom. Greedo is going to take him in, he blows him down without a second thought.

In the new version, Lucas changed many things, almost all of them for the worse, and one of them was having Greedo shoot at Han first, thus making Han shooting "self defense" as opposed to "murder". The problems with this were many, but in short:

1) Softening the character of Han offended some die-hard fans
2) Greedo's gun is clearly pointed at Han, at point blank range. When it goes off, Han doesn't dodge, the gun doesn't move, nothing like that. Instead, it just fires off to the side for some reason. The idea that he missed doesn't make any kind of sense.

- J

 

[Asymptote Angel]

Han shot first


(or he did in the original then in the first re-make Mr Lucas decided to screw things up and have Grredo shoot first but somehow miss from point blank range, the fans were in uproar and in the final re-make it got changed back to Han shooting first.) It's just a example of directors messing with classic films many years later when they should realise that it's art and you can't go changing it

It's his movie... he can do whatever he wants to it. If the movie were made by another director, I'd be with you completely. It's your prerogative to crucify the man for changing something that wouldn't have noticed if you weren't looking for it, but remember that it's his property (both intellectual and physical) and you have no right to tell him what to do with it.

 

[Drong]

Han shot first


(or he did in the original then in the first re-make Mr Lucas decided to screw things up and have Grredo shoot first but somehow miss from point blank range, the fans were in uproar and in the final re-make it got changed back to Han shooting first.) It's just a example of directors messing with classic films many years later when they should realise that it's art and you can't go changing it

It's his movie... he can do whatever he wants to it. If the movie were made by another director, I'd be with you completely. It's your prerogative to crucify the man for changing something that wouldn't have noticed if you weren't looking for it, but remember that it's his property (both intellectual and physical) and you have no right to tell him what to do with it.

Ahh here is where we hit semantics, granted it was his movie but it has been in the public domain for along time and in the hearts and minds of fans and surely these must be considered before any changes to the existing material are made, South Park did an episode about this (609 - free hat) here is an excerpt...

George Lucas: M-that's different. These are my movies. I made them, and I have the right to do whatever I want with them

Stan: [steps forward] You're wrong, Mr. Lucas. They're not your movies. They're ours. All of ours. We paid to go see them, and they're just as much a part of our lives as they are of yours.

Kyle: When an artist creates, whatever they create belongs to society

 

[The Reverend]

I thing Drongs SP reference sums it up really. If we, the people, don't like a film, it will bomb and slide into obscurity. If we like it, like SW's, then we will throw a sh*t fit if it gets changed. Its the original that people "fell in love" with, and if you change it, well, you piss alot of people off. Hell, you don't see anyone running off to change the Mona Lisa (Granted, Da Vinci is dead, but I doubt he would want it changed) and if someone did change it, France and Italy would probably go to war with whatever country the changer came from.

 

[mshcherbatskaya]

Oh, man, here's where the difference between fangirls and fanboys rears it's ugly head. I immediately thought, "Han/Greedo fic? I've never seen Han/Greedo fic anywhere." And then I had to stomp a plotbunny to death.

As for George Lucas, he needs, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" tattooed on his forehead. Backwards, so he can read it every morning in the mirror. Sure, he can mess with his movie all he wants, and in return, we can rage about it all we want. That's how it works.

 

[Uncle Comrade]

I refuse to credit the idea of Greedo shooting first. Aside from the already mentioned fact that a professional underworld enforcer isn't going to miss from that range, it fits perfectly with Han's character for him to take Greedo out before he has a chance.

I accept that it's Lucas' film and he can choose to change things if he wants, but he ought to have forseen the fan reaction to his changes.

 

[Cousin_IT]

doesnt really matter to him though. The rereleases made obscene amounts of money; as did the woeful by comparison 2nd trilogy. The cash talks loudest at the end of the day, & no matter how vocal "fans" are in criticising the changes, johnney average will still go out & buy it up with glee.

Oh, & personally, till I saw this thread I didnt actually pay any attention to the fact Greedo missed. Stupid as it is, doesnt really make much of a difference to the film.

 

[LisaB1138]

Star Wars is not and has never been in the public domain. George Lucas holds the copyright and will continue to hold it for quite a long time.

 

[Spinwhiz]

Still amazed Lucas even decided to remake those. So awful.

 

[GrowlersAtSea]

After reading the post by mshcherbatskaya, the idea of a Han/Greedo fic terrifies me beyond belief. I blame the anime fangirls (and probably fanboys) for the images that pop into my head now that I hear of a fan fiction about two characters. There are some scary things out there, especially between protagonists and antagonists.

But about the issue.

The reasoning behind the change was pretty bad, I thought. Essentially to make Han Solo more huggable, but this makes his development throughout the trilogy less significant (aw, he was just a nice guy with a gruff exterior, not a murderer).

It's true that they're George Lucas's movies, but the reason why people are offended by it because it goes back and changes something pretty significant in the development of Han Solo's character. Not a year later, not in a Director's Cut a couple years later, but twenty years down the line. You can't go and change something like that after literally a generation watched those films, and then their own children grew up with them too and expect all of them to just say it's cool.

There were some additional changes to the DVD release to try to make the fans happy, but they still looked pretty weak. The unaltered version was released though a couple years ago on DVD, devoid of the change, so that is nice.

That's my opinion. He can do it because they're his films, but you can't expect people to accept major changes to things after decades.

 

[mshcherbatskaya]

After reading the post by mshcherbatskaya, the idea of a Han/Greedo fic terrifies me beyond belief. I blame the anime fangirls (and probably fanboys) for the images that pop into my head now that I hear of a fan fiction about two characters.

You just know I had to google that, right? And apparently Han/Greedo has been done at least once.

Those doujinshi, man, that can be some scary sh*t. But fanfic (or slash) goes back to 1971 (if I remember the the date correctly) and the original slash fandoms were Star Trek and Starsky & Hutch. As scary as Han/Greedo may be, I still say the weirdest pairing I've ever seen is Odo/blender.

 

[PurpleRain]

It's his movie... he can do whatever he wants to it. If the movie were made by another director, I'd be with you completely. It's your prerogative to crucify the man for changing something that wouldn't have noticed if you weren't looking for it, but remember that it's his property (both intellectual and physical) and you have no right to tell him what to do with it.

As a movie prick (we call ourselves buffs) I want to say the original of any movie is as perfect as it's going to get. Changing it and adding things onto it just cocks it all up. People like George Lucas forget that it wasn't the SFX that sucked people into watching his movies, it was the characters and stories. Just adding in more SFX just pushes those things to the side to get comfortable. The series declined as soon as he made Episode 1. He forgot that he had to make likable charcaters with diversity not just carboard, feel good characters. Then he just raped it with the SFX.

George Romero cocked up his series with Land of the Dead. He cocked up the genre he basically made by fidling around, and in turn, screwing up his own work.

If it's not broken, great pieces of art with a huge dedicated fan base, then don't try to fix it!

 

[Cousin_IT]

George Romero cocked up his series with Land of the Dead. He cocked up the genre he basically made by fidling around, and in turn, screwing up his own work.

If it's not broken, great pieces of art with a huge dedicated fan base, then don't try to fix it!

Frankly I thought Day of the Dead was the film that ended the awsomeness of Romeros films though. Compared to Night & Dawn it was just so...mediocre. Kinda looking forward to Diary of the Dead though, though that might only be because UrbanDead.com is doing a promotional game for it \o/

 

[Yan-Yan]

George Romero cocked up his series with Land of the Dead. He cocked up the genre he basically made by fidling around, and in turn, screwing up his own work.

If it's not broken, great pieces of art with a huge dedicated fan base, then don't try to fix it!

Frankly I thought Day of the Dead was the film that ended the awsomeness of Romeros films though. Compared to Night & Dawn it was just so...mediocre. Kinda looking forward to Diary of the Dead though, though that might only be because UrbanDead.com is doing a promotional game for it \o/

I really thought the remake of Dawn of the Dead was a really good variation. Not to replace the original, but as 'yet another zombie movie'. Heck, it's the reason I went out and watched the rest of the Dead movies. And bought Marvel Zombies. I thought the plot was pretty solid, the characters were pretty real, and while sure, the zombies moved fast, they were shocking and surprising.

Plus the ending, from the point where they got on the boat to the end of the credits, was just fun. I don't think I would object if they were to do the same to Land of the Dead. That one feels like it could use a slight overhaul.

 

[broadband]

i saw land of thedead, a bit stupid in script yeah but the basic idea of city of survivors and all that, was someway interesting, what if we go back to the other George

 

[Sniper_Zegai]

I saw the Dawn of the Dead remake in the cinema and besides the b-movie roster of actors who were in it, I personally liked it alot, it had some genuinly freaky moments as well as some laughs but I thought the main let down of it was the uber defined roles the actors played. The good guy, the nice guy, the bad guy, the tough guy, the love interest, the family woman, the slut, the innocent girly. It just felt like a bunch of cardboard cut-outs, although I thought the interactions with Andy, the man on the other roof were very interesting and was saddened when the group finally get a radio to him.

 

[nightmare_gorilla]

never liked star wars much, and from the sounds of it the first three movies were a total fluke on lucas's part like some retard kid who accidentally typed a decent plot on his typewritter by smashing his skull into it. then procedes to whore this one good idea out to the point where all the holes on it's body must be rubbed raw and bleeding, then it got whored out some more. seriously i've seen porn stars less worn out than the star wars concept and while other people continue to do some actual decent things with it lucas himself i think should be banned from touching it ever again.

as people have said, han shot first in the original release, greedo shot first in the next release. and so on and so forth. i can't recall anyone argueing the change as a good thing other than filmakers, so i can't really understand why there's an argument at all really but it's just one of those things thats part of "pop culture" i guess.

 

[broadband]

i think the same thing about star wars, gorilla