Hatred of PUAs? Why?

[blackrave]

Let's start with what I consider to be a Pick-Up Artist.
It is an artist who prefers practicality and comfort of pick-up truck
It is, usually, a guy who learns and uses methods to manipulate female psyche to achieve his goals (usually sex with said female).
[I may miss certain aspects of PUAs, since my investigation in their "culture" was brief and shallow, so feel free to add things]

In short- manipulation to have sex.
Sounds horrible right?
Until you think about it a bit.
What is make-up, fake nails/hair/eyelashes, push-up bras, shape improving lingerie, high heels, revealing clothes, etc., if NOT manipulation of male psyche.
And feminine flirting methods aren't something people shun or hate.

So ladies have been doing this for a very long time.
Now, in presumed age of gender equality, some guys are trying to do similar things and suddenly they are the worst people ever?
What is going on here?
Did I missed something?
If yes, then what?
If no, then what the fuck?

 

[Zhukov]

I'm just going to take a wild fucking guess here and say it might have something to do with the "manipulate" part of that description.

 

[Hoplon]

I'm just going to take a wild fucking guess here and say it might have something to do with the "manipulate" part of that description.

just a wild stab in the dark but i would guess Zhukov is correct. The dressing up is something everyone has done for a very long time. Negging and like are fucking horrible.

 

[PainInTheAssInternet]

They take men with very low self-esteem and train them to put on a facade that at the best of times is a negative presence and at worst is downright predatory.

 

[blackrave]

I'm just going to take a wild fucking guess here and say it might have something to do with the "manipulate" part of that description.

just a wild stab in the dark but i would guess Zhukov is correct. The dressing up is something everyone has done for a very long time. Negging and like are fucking horrible.

That's the thing, many of PUA methods have similarly horrible female equivalents (especially from "men like abusing bitches" relationship approach).
That is the moment that puzzles me.

 

[Hoplon]

That's the thing, many of PUA methods have similarly horrible female equivalents (especially from "men like abusing bitches" relationship approach).
That is the moment that puzzles me.

really? where are the websites extolling these as virtues?

 

[blackrave]

They take men with very low self-esteem and train them to put on a facade that at the best of times is a negative presence and at worst is downright predatory.

Isn't that what people who hook up for one night stands do anyway?

 

[blackrave]

That's the thing, many of PUA methods have similarly horrible female equivalents (especially from "men like abusing bitches" relationship approach).
That is the moment that puzzles me.

really? where are the websites extolling these as virtues?

I've encountered them in magazines and books
Most probably there are websites too, but I'm not aware of them.

 

[Thaluikhain]

What is make-up, fake nails/hair/eyelashes, push-up bras, shape improving lingerie, high heels, revealing clothes, etc., if NOT manipulation of male psyche.

Er...dressing up, either in the hope that that others will find them attractive, or because they want to do so for themselves?

Until you think about it a bit.

Evidently, it's until you think about it for a bit. Believe it or believe it not, other people have thought about PUAs before you created this thread, and find them to be horrible.

 

[bartholen_v1legacy]

Point me to a video where a woman is actively harassing men, forcing herself on them, using their insecurities against them to make herself seem more appealing and then teaching other women how to do that as a positive thing and then get back to me.

 

[FalloutJack]

Nope, sorry. Gentleman Jack, always. The ladies shall not be messed with on my watch.

 

[blackrave]

Until you think about it a bit.

Evidently, it's until you think about it for a bit. Believe it or believe it not, other people have thought about PUAs before you created this thread, and find them to be horrible.

I don't doubt that.
I'm asking because from where I stand I don't find them as horrible as other people tend to.
Miserable? Yeah. Sad? Sure. Lonely? Most probably. Laughable? Definitely.
But evil? Not really.

And like I wrote previously, what they are doing isn't something entirely new.

That is why I'm asking.

 

[PainInTheAssInternet]

They take men with very low self-esteem and train them to put on a facade that at the best of times is a negative presence and at worst is downright predatory.

Isn't that what people who hook up for one night stands do anyway?

No. People who go out looking for one-night stands are fairly straightforwards. They also tend to be positive presences. Something attractive. PUAs are all about being a negative presence and putting them down in the hopes that their self-esteem is down to their own levels.

 

[blackrave]

Point me to a video where a woman is actively harassing men, forcing herself on them, using their insecurities against them to make herself seem more appealing and then teaching other women how to do that as a positive thing and then get back to me.

Most make-up videos?
I don't find them to be much better than what PUAs are doing.

 

[blackrave]

They take men with very low self-esteem and train them to put on a facade that at the best of times is a negative presence and at worst is downright predatory.

Isn't that what people who hook up for one night stands do anyway?

No. People who go out looking for one-night stands are fairly straightforwards. They also tend to be positive presences. Something attractive. PUAs are all about being a negative presence and putting them down in the hopes that their self-esteem is down to their own levels.

We apparently have different experiences.
I'm jealous a bit to be honest.

 

[Thaluikhain]

And like I wrote previously, what they are doing isn't something entirely new.

So? That's not a defence.

Point me to a video where a woman is actively harassing men, forcing herself on them, using their insecurities against them to make herself seem more appealing and then teaching other women how to do that as a positive thing and then get back to me.

Most make-up videos?
I don't find them to be much better than what PUAs are doing.

How? Putting on lipstick is not manipulating people.

 

[Hoplon]

Most make-up videos?
I don't find them to be much better than what PUAs are doing.

Wow. that's some serious issues with women there my friend. That is not the same thing at all, Make up is done to ones self for ones self.

 

[DoPo]

Point me to a video where a woman is actively harassing men, forcing herself on them, using their insecurities against them to make herself seem more appealing and then teaching other women how to do that as a positive thing and then get back to me.

Most make-up videos?

I've not seen such videos. The ones I've seen have had somebody explain how to use make-up so it matches...or whatever it is that it's supposed to do.

 

[Hoplon]

I think it's less about the method and more about that it works, men don't like other people to, for a lack of a better term, "soil" the herd.

Women don't like it because it ruins the "every women looks for a good man" idea, that women can be just as fickle as man.

Apparently not any more than regular talking to people does. It's just a really unpleasant way of doing it.