Homophobia in a university newspaper, as well as other things!?

[WaReloaded]

I'm an avid supporter of equal rights and even I can see the humour in this; some people are far too eager to over-politicise issues.

 

[Artemis923]

Some people just need to man the fuck up and take a joke.

 

[Altorin]

Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequence. That's all that needs to be said.

Or in other words, people can say whatever they want. Once they've said their piece, they've already exercised said freedom, so whatever comes afterwards has nothing to do with their freedom of speech.

Freedom of Speech is a tricky thing, but a good barometer for whether it's relevant is "Who's doing the censoring?" Because unless it's the government, that's not really a violation of free speech. If the University wants to fire him or whatever, that's really on them, and has nothing to do with actual freedom of speech. Now, if it were the government busting in and arresting the guy for expressing himself in a way they didn't care for, then you have a thistle bush.

Public Spaces + Government censorship = bad
Private Spaces + Controlling the Expression in your Private space = well, I'd call it stupid, but it's not a matter of freedom of speech.

I think the best counter to speech you dislike, is your own speech.

The way it works in the UK is you can say and do whatever the crap you like, as long as you aren't bothering or upsetting anyone else. The moment you do, bam, the law will drop on you like a ton of bricks.

That's actually pretty appalling. You don't have any real freedom of speech there if that's the case. Unless you're just talking about verbal abuse, like calling someone a horrible name and screaming at them. We call that assault 1 here, but it only applies to individuals. Like if that comic were calling some specific person a queer and laughing at them, that would be wrong. But if just holding an idea that someone doesn't like and expressing it in earshot of that person can get you arrested, then, well, frankly, I hope that Great Britain sinks into the sea.

 

[Eddie the head]

because you are allowed too SAY anything you want, if what you are saying is true than we would be living in an opinion suppressing society. for example if what you are saying is true, back when the taliban were in charge of afganistan, the women there had the right to free speech the whole time?.

Umm. . . . . . . Is English your fist language? I don't mean to sound insulating, I just can't tell.

Chptcha: Mumbo Jumbo. Well, yeah.

 

[Altorin]

after seeing the comic, it strikes me as something that wasn't meant earnestly. It wasn't very well pulled off, but it was certainly intended to incite a reaction, but I don't think the cartoonist was necessarily being hateful.. It looks like there's a meta-joke there that just didn't land at all and flew way over anyone's head. Like, it's the idea that parents teach their kids stupid shit. Like, we're not supposed to laugh with the characters in the strip, but at them. Or think "holy fuck, that's pretty messed up"

So.. Fire the cartoonist for being a poor cartoonist.

 

[Vegosiux]

People are allowed to say what they want, how they want, wherever they want when using a public means for doing so. So it is on that merit that I disagree with you.

Even in USA there are situations where you cannot say anything you want and however you want, and those limitations are in place for a reason. But that's not exactly what I'm talking about.

What I'm talking about is that you can't expect to get away with "Lol, freedom of speech, *****" when you get called out on what you said.

 

[FitScotGaymer]

The way it works in the UK is you can say and do whatever the crap you like, as long as you aren't bothering or upsetting anyone else. The moment you do, bam, the law will drop on you like a ton of bricks.

That's actually pretty appalling. You don't have any real freedom of speech there if that's the case. Unless you're just talking about verbal abuse, like calling someone a horrible name and screaming at them. We call that assault 1 here, but it only applies to individuals. Like if that comic were calling some specific person a queer and laughing at them, that would be wrong. But if just holding an idea that someone doesn't like and expressing it in earshot of that person can get you arrested, then, well, frankly, I hope that Great Britain sinks into the sea.

Clearly I wasn't speaking of censorship. Considering we are talking about something that was clearly homophobic and was encouraging hate and violence towards gay folk I think it's fairly obvious that, hey funnily enough, I was speaking in relation to that kind of behaviour. The kind of behaviour that would land you in hot water.
Verbal, and physical abuse. Hate speech. Causing harm. Causing a nuisance. And so on.

I am kinda surprised I have to actually spell that out.

 

[FitScotGaymer]

@EccentricLich

As I said I DID clarify myself, apologise for it, and own up to it prior to your post so thus it is not my fault or problem that you did not bother to read that post that clarified and apologised.

I also again apologised, and admitted responsibility for my lack of clarity in the Edit part of the post, and reclarified myself AGAIN.

And no it really isn't your place to make personal attacks on me based around my sexuality, my self identification, and my username. It is something that has nothing to do with you.

You COULD have challenged me in the way that AngloDoom did - in a polite and measured way instead of launching personal attacks.
Perhaps if you hadn't been so needlessly rude I would have responded less "defensively".

Really, learn some manners.

And also actually read posts and the thread before you start mouthing off at someone.

 

[ReservoirAngel]

This is offensive? Really guys? Really?

Yeah it's a little dark and not entirely in good taste, but come on. This is nothing. Is it just me, am I just really hard to offend or something? Because this doesn't seem in any real way to be a big deal.

I hate to say this, because I know somebody will take it the wrong way but: Gay dudes need to man the fuck up sometimes.

 

[Risingblade]

I laughed, it was cute.

 

[demoman_chaos]

That wasn't that bad, twas kind of funny actually (short giggle worthy).

 

[Piorn]

You can hate people for what they do, not for what they are.
That is basically my stance on sexism, racism, homophobia, xenophobia, and everything else.

 

[Justice Shades]

The comic made reference to violence and homophobia, therefore it is condoning them! Hurp!

I mean, it's not a great joke, but Jesus Christ ...

 

[BiggyShackleton]

Just pointing out, that last panel (which makes the whole thing seem kinda fucked) doesn't even look like it should be there. It has no border, the grammar is all fucked up...

I'm calling conspiracy. You all just got trolled by Michael Webb and his petition.

 

[Char-Nobyl]

I understand that due to the lack of context I can't definitively say that this is a satire/parody, but I do think that the father threatening to shoot his son qualifies as outlandish considering that for one, most fathers would never do that, which qualifies it as abnormal,

Most people in general don't kill other people. That doesn't make murder an less abhorrent or any more wacky.

Look, if you want to make an outlandish threat, you don't say something that's completely feasible. I can think of a dozen possible 'threats' that would be both funnier and less controversial. All of them involve being more complex than "I'm going to shoot you with a shotgun, and I'm even going to aim at you face! How zany I am!"

and two, the fact that he said it right to his son's face and was so explicit his thought out plan of shooting him, rolling him up in carpet and throwing him off a bridge, also makes it even more abnormal, as on the off chance they actually would shoot their son, I doubt they would tell them right to their face and then expect everything to be cool between them, unless he is messed up in the head, i.e., abnormal/outlandish.

...except that it wasn't the father who made the joke. He was issuing a horrific threat, and then his young son, who for all we know is too young to understand that there are people perfectly willing to murder other people just because of their sexual orientation, makes a joke because some of the words in the threat reminded him of a snack food he likes.

And just being 'abnormal' doesn't qualify something as satirical. He could've said, "Son, if you turn out gay, I swear I will fill your lover with bees" or something equally unfeasible, but no. He said, "I will shoot you in the head and dump you in a river." I couldn't care less if he's the kid's father. Those are two completely doable things. It's the difference between, say, telling your roommate, "If you eat that last taco, I'll lock you in the bathroom with a mountain lion" versus "If you eat that last taco, I'll slit your throat while you sleep."

Also notable, is that they immediately switched from that lethal absurd threat to a silly joke, which kind of makes light of the father's opinion/threat. I don't particularly care for this comic at all, but it doesn't seem like one that reflects a hateful view of homosexuals, but in my opinion, it seems more like they just forgot to add a more definite punchline or something of the sort to solidify it as a joke on how terrible homophobic people are versus an attack on homosexuals. But like I said before, since there's not enough context, I can't really say that this is 100% the case, but I am just giving you my thoughts on the matter so maybe you can understand a bit better why I find this absurd enough to be a satire/parody.

933.54

Can you guess what that number means?

It's the price you'd need to purchase a firearm permit, a name-brand shotgun, a 10x10 carpet, and a box of shells. Most of that cost is the gun, so in reality, if someone is threatening someone with a shotgun, they probably already own one. The number should actually be lower than 200.

That's how much it would cost for someone to carry out the deed depicted in the comic. And no, the fact that it's the person's own son means absolutely nothing. After all, you said it yourself: the idea that a father could murder his own son over such a trivial thing is so alien to your moral compass (which is a good thing) that it strikes you as almost satirical.

 

[FitScotGaymer]

You are hilariously easy to rile. When did I make fun of your sexuality? That'd be pretty damn hypocritical of me. No, it's not your fault that I didn't read your other post. It IS your fault that you started getting defensive over pretty much nothing and overreacted to the comic. Your reasoning for it being anything but a bad joke is laughable. It's like you've never listened to a comedian or even been on the internet before. I don't feel the need to be polite with you because, quite frankly, I don't have to be and you and people like you rub me the wrong way. Gays are never going to be accepted if people like you keep going around crying about everything being offensive or insensitive. That's just reinforcing the stereotype that we're whiny and girly.

By the way, crying to the mods and getting my post reported just because I used a single insult is pretty pathetic.

Once again you prove yourself completely incapable of reading my posts, or the thread properly.

And then feel like you can accurately and legitimately verbally (or rather by type) assault someone based on your own lack of comprehension.

That IS your fault.

As I said, I wasn't annoyed or offended at the comic per se. And I don't believe the cartoonists or editors deserve to be fired.
The comic was stupid, unfunny, and offensive and those involved did deserve some sort of censure but calling for their heads is a vast over reaction. The reason it didn't bother me much before is I put it down to a guy being a bit ignorant and having a bit of a stupid moment thinking he was being funny.
We have all had moments like that. I said this before.

What irritates me is the fact that not one of them put their hands up to it and accepted responsibility for what happened. They kept, and continue to keep, making excuses, justifications, and then assigning blame for it all.
And to me THAT is why they deserve to go.

And this post of yours also exemplifies why I reported you.

From your very first post you were launching very personal unwarranted attacks on me, because you took a dislike to my username because I publicly and openly say "hey im a gay gamer."

I'm proud of who I am, and while sometimes I don't express myself correctly, I always endeavour to be nice as much as possible.

"Freedom of speech" which is what you are claiming as your defense here for your attack on me - "I can say what I want!"
No you can't.

First, freedom of speech is not a blanket defense. It does not protect you from the consequences of your actions.
Your right to say what you want does not override my right to go about my life without being attacked.
Second, The Escapist forums are not a democracy. They have a very clearly list of rules about what is and what is not acceptable here. If you recieved a warning for your behaviour you have obviously broken those rules. And thats your own damn fault.

Clearly you saw my username and fot that it was an offense that I self identify as a gay gamer. Well you know what thats your problem. Not my fault if you want to be irrational and make prejudicial assumptions about me.

Also when you attack someone in the way you did to me, then naturally they are going to be defensive. That is kinda the point. Someone attacks you? You defend yourself. It's not rocket science buddy.
Your rude to someone? Chances are they are going to be rude right back.

I suggest that you stop and think about your next post, because at the rate you are going the mods are probably going to ban you very shortly if you keep your aggressive and rude behaviour up.

 

[Moth_Monk]

I'll let Christopher Hitchens speak for me here