Homosexuality: Nature or Nurture?

[VanityGirl]

Edit: Double Post? WTF?

 

[VanityGirl]

Long snip

I salute you good sire, but I will say that you're probably going to get quote spammed for the next 10 pages. Good luck to you!

 

[Alphavillain]

Sexuality is in my opinion governed by genetics/nature, but the enactment of a gay lifestyle -in other words, doing something about the impulses- is due to acceptance of society, i.e, nurture.

 

[rutger5000]

First of I know jack shit about psycologhy, I can't even spell it right. But I do know this.
Every human action, believe, thought etc etc is dictaded by a balance of nature and nuture, (+ soul if you believe in that). Being homosexual is just the same in that regard. It's a mix of nature and nuture.
I call myself bicurious by mostly nuture. I've been raised in such a way to be confident and positive about myself regardless of things like sexuality, and to look down on people who look down on other people based on things like sexuality. So I figure why not try it at some point? Granted I don't know how nature kicks in in that. But I'm sure it does somewhere.

 

[rayen020]

i feel sexuality is a very fluid thing. i think nature forms a base starting point and i think homosexuality is one of those base starting points. however i think nurture can have an effect although not as much as i think many people believe. people are very strange things and there is very little that can apply to all of us. saying that sexuality is born from either nature or nurture or even both is oversimplifying it. i think its a very internal and complicated thing. and as far as America is concerned i think our self repression of our sexual identities complicates things even further.

 

[AnkaraTheFallen]

I was horribly disgusted with the first page of this thread. It's all dolts screaming Nature without a dam clue.

Firstly how the "frunk" would genes know the difference between men and women? They're just genes. All they can do is release chemicals into body. Things like puberty, fertility and the occasional growth disorder that's it. Remember they're operating blind. They have no idea what the outside world looks like. They can't tell you to like anything. Genes can make you more sexually active but the target of that feeling is up to Nurture.

Secondly if homosexuality were genetic it would be localised to an ethnic group or region. It's not. Homosexuality is too far spread to be genetic. If sexual inclination was genetic chimpanzees, that share 97% of our genetic code, wouldn't want to "frunk" with other chimpanzees only sexy humans. Also if Homosexuality is Nature it would have a gene that could be identified and like all others turned on and off. That just isn't going to happen.

So I've made my points that it's not Nature, so why is it Nurture.
Imagine a baby, it came into the world knowing nothing. What's gravity? how do I control my bowels? are my feet tasty? What is sexy...Men? Women? Dogs? I don't know I'M A BABY!

All infants have to learn the difference between male and female, associate themselves with one and learn what is correct action from others of their gender. All this is done before the child is 5. Believe it or not everyone picks up what is correct for them to be sexually attracted to long before they become sexually active. This is why so many claim "I've always felt gay". Well obviously you didn't think about it when you were 7!! This is where boys and girls need good role models for their gender. To teach them Men are masculine and Women are feminine.

It's not right to say you learn to be gay, but rather that you don't learn to be straight. On failing to pick up a sexual orientation an individual will most likely go for what ever they see others of their peer group doing later in sexual development. Commonly taking a homosexual or bisexual sexual preference.

As I mentioned earlier we associate with figures around us in our formative years and without realising it pick up their behaviours. This does not have to be direct and often very subtle influences will drastically change a persons development. An example would be the predisposition of those abused as children that will do so to their children later in life. Or children of alcoholics having higher tendencies to problems with alcohol. Even if you consciencely don't like the influence you may adopt that behaviour.

I could go on and I might continue this post later, but everyone hates a wall of text.

TLDR It's NURTURE NOT NATURE FOOL!!

There is so much I feel I should point out here.
1. Gene's decide if you are male or female, and we know very little of how they work.
2. Homosexuality is show in every other species capable of it to some degree, even ones that we say aren't able to think as we do, there for there is no nurturing for them.
3. We no very little of how our brains and gene's work and almost nothing about what some gene's decide.
4. I was brought up in a home, and school where I was always told and show being gay was wrong, and yet I am gay.
5. Everyone else I was around when growing up was straight, and I thought I was for a long time, but looking back it's clear I wasn't.

And lastly, saying it is caused by a gene doesn't mean it should show up in only one area, we all have most gene's that people have, it's whether or not they are active (or dominant). And even if it was passed on as you seem to think, we have spread across the whole world, ultimately everyone is related to a common ancestor at some point in the past.

So all experience's I have and all the evidence I have seen indicates it is something you are born with and your nurturing has very little to do with it.

 

[incal11]

I'm having trouble imagining how homosexuality could be caused due to fear or bias against the opposite sex seeing how it's not too uncommon for gays to have a large amount of female friends, and how almost all gays don't like their sexuality to begin with (hence the denial period) and how a large percentage of gay people don't like what is known as the "gay culture".

I do know some homosexuals who are that way because of their bias to the other sex, it doesn't mean they can't get along. A lot of gays dislike their sexuality probably because of their education, the social climate, and maybe how they are artificially restricted by the label "gay". I was only giving a few examples to give you an idea.

I stand by that it only stands up in specific circumstances, namely straight people with undiscovered bisexual tendencies (which isn't too uncommon by the way).

That could be because "bisexual" is the default, don't think of it as a label though. But as how anyone can engage in any behaviors they like.

I'm not sure the fruitfly study can even be related to humans that closely. Our minds are a lot more complex. A fruitfly's brain might not have the full capacity to understand sexuality the same way we do, so for them there's a good chance it might just be inhibition. Humans however would work very differently, and the factor of inhibition would be introduced purely by social factors rather than by instinct.

It seems insulting, but it's nonetheless a fact that we work on the same basic principles than much simpler species. In any case we agree that "gay" and "straight" are purely cultural.

But all studies I have seen indicate that being gay is something you are born as, and I know I was always gay. As for the culture part, I was brought up in a home were being gay was thought to be a sin and wrong, and yet here I am, so I don't think culture affects it at all, I think that is all nature's work.

http://www.mygenes.co.nz/download.htm
read it if there's a shred of honesty within you.

 

[Irony's Acolyte]

Both. I'd say it's probably heavily nurture but I wouldn't be surprised if there's some nature in there. Maybe that's just me as I believe that nurture, rather than nature, is the greatest influence on who a person becomes, but I do believe that sexual orientation is heavily reliant upon how you grew up, or even just your surrounding. I'd go as far to say that any sexual orientation is a result of nurture and that only the base want to be attracted to something is the result of nature. I'm no expert, so take my words for what they're worth.

 

[The Stonker]

snip

First of all, you assume that I simply "forgot" that there are primates that use tools.
Yes you little monkey, of course I know that there are primates that use tools, but that's the thing.
You're a douche.
Now, why I'm calling you a douche is a pretty complex thing, but I'm not going to read the stars at you, because with that post you just called me stupid.
Now, there are a loads of animals that are gay, loads of species that bang everything.
We could name some, but what's the point?
You could forget all studies about the human mind concerning human sexuality and I will bring up one point that Ricky Gervais talked about in one of his standups.
You can't just make your son gay, for instance, I have a son, lets call him...
Brad, yes! Brad.
Now, I bring in a gay male hooker and I tell my son Brad to suck his cock, Brad says no.
I say common Brad! Suck his cock! You might like it!
Then he tries a little bit then he says, I fucking love it.
Now that just doesn't happen, you just don't think one day, yep, I like it up the ass now.
Also, denying that genetics has nothing to do with it is... .
Fake&gay.
P.s. Probably going to get banned for this so I'm calling troll since it's so easy to do here on this bloody website.

 

[Black Prism Adel]

i personally feel that it could be both nature and nurture a person can be born into the whole homosexuality thing but at the same time it can also be upbringing, like statistically if you have an upbringing that if your male is dominated by female attention your more likely to bey homosexual, and vice versa. where as with nature people still believe that it could be found on a genetic level, but again there are factors in both cases that point to reasonable ways for both.

 

[jakefongloo]

nurture obviously because straight parents never have gay kids............

-.-'

 

[AnkaraTheFallen]

But all studies I have seen indicate that being gay is something you are born as, and I know I was always gay. As for the culture part, I was brought up in a home were being gay was thought to be a sin and wrong, and yet here I am, so I don't think culture affects it at all, I think that is all nature's work.

http://www.mygenes.co.nz/download.htm
read it if there's a shred of honesty within you.

From what I can understand here, it is saying that scientists think that behaviours and sexuality is decided by many gene's working together. Which would make it seem it is something that you are born with to me.
Admittedly that is a quick overview of it, and I don't have the time to read it in detail, but if it is a study to say homosexuality is learned, then I'm sorry, but as far as I see it, there are many more studies saying it isn't, and my own experience tells me it isn't, and as I know very little of how the brain works, I need to go with the evidence, and there is more to say I was born gay.
But I will read that when I have the time free to sit through it all.

 

[Brandon237]

Nature decides your sexuality, nurture decides how you will express it, if at all.

I'd say this is probably the best way to word it. Thank you for this.

Only a pleasure

 

[Joey Wonton]

"I did it, lol" - Aphrodite, Greek god of sexuality.

But I would put my feelings towards nature, unless I've been conditioned to give that resoponse, then ARGH!

 

[incal11]

Why would it decide straight and bi but not gay? That's just being silly.
(...)I like to think that flamboyant gay people were born gay, while non-flamboyant gay people such as myself were nurtured towards being gay.

Nature "deciding" was just a figure of speeech, and read my link.
The flamboyants merely convinced themselves, what experience made them so probably happen very early.
http://www.mygenes.co.nz/download.htm

I say common Brad! Suck his cock! You might like it!
Then he tries a little bit then he says, I fucking love it.
Now that just doesn't happen, you just don't think one day, yep, I like it up the ass now.
Also, denying that genetics has nothing to do with it is... .
Fake&gay.

first read the link in this post. I wasn't calling you stupid, just explaining my reasoning, it's a debate after all. This discussion is interesting, though I still think "pure" homosexuality is only a cultural product I am now convinced "nature" has it's role. Though maybe not the role the "pro gay-born" think of.
And yes, I know personally some who just one day decided they wanted to try, and not because they were "bi-curious". Another stupid label.
Also there are Brads in the worlds, but of course I don't approve of coercion.

 

[Brandon237]

Nature decides your sexuality, nurture decides how you will express it, if at all.

Yes, nature "decides" that you are straigh, or more probably bi. But not gay, which is a cultural trait.

uhh....
Considering that about a fifth of rams are gay, not bi, gay, I call bull on that idea.
Considering the way genetics work, and brain chemistry works, That makes NO sense, your sexual orientation can be greatly varied purely by genetics, there is no reason it will stop someone from being gay if you have a genetic variation from the norm based around your sexual preferences. And culture actually encourages people NOT to be gay.
Sexual orientation, whatever it may be, is not up to either the person or the culture short of horrific brain-washing, and even that often does not do it. I is genetic in all but extreme cases.

 

[DracoSuave]

The evidence science currently has says it's a little of column A and a little of column B.

 

[smegmar]

There is so much I feel I should point out here.
1. Gene's decide if you are male or female, and we know very little of how they work.
2. Homosexuality is show in every other species capable of it to some degree, even ones that we say aren't able to think as we do, there for there is no nurturing for them.
3. We no very little of how our brains and gene's work and almost nothing about what some gene's decide.
4. I was brought up in a home, and school where I was always told and show being gay was wrong, and yet I am gay.
5. Everyone else I was around when growing up was straight, and I thought I was for a long time, but looking back it's clear I wasn't.

And lastly, saying it is caused by a gene doesn't mean it should show up in only one area, we all have most gene's that people have, it's whether or not they are active (or dominant). And even if it was passed on as you seem to think, we have spread across the whole world, ultimately everyone is related to a common ancestor at some point in the past.

So all experience's I have and all the evidence I have seen indicates it is something you are born with and your nurturing has very little to do with it.

1. NO, WE know quite a lot. YOU know very little of how they work. Also this doesn't work in your favour if you're relying on gene to be the cause of homosexuality

2. NO, we are the only animal in the world to exhibit lifelong homosexuality. All other animals might do it once or twice but go back to heterosexual relationships later on.

3. No, see answer 1

4. Congratulations here's a medal. I did say it isn't direct, and subtle influences that you might not consciously recognise were working subconsciencely to give you the orientation you have. (Side note I don't think there's anything wrong with being homosexual, just know your facts about it.)

5. Once again I did mention it's not direct and quite possible you just weren't show heterosexual influences rather then shown homosexual influences. Also I did mention you will develope you sexual orientation long before you start consciencely thinking about it.

P.S and a thank you to Vanity Girl.

 

[jebussaves88]

I've never really bought into that whole "It's in the genes" argument, and I therefore believe that sexuality, along with all aspects of a persons personality, is created by the environment. However, I don't want to sound homophobic. I don't believe that it would de-legitimise it as a lifestyle if it were, as such, a "choice".

 

[mrdude2010]

nature. otherwise no son/daughter whose parents are strongly against homosexuality would ever be gay. since this happens all the time, it has to be something in the person themselves, rather than an outside influence