How comes gamers are "entitled" when they don't get what they expect from a product?

[GiantRaven]

...that's basically the problem. We used to get a full game that was a lot bigger and offered a lot more playtime. Now, some studios seem to be hell bent on stripping it down to the skeleton, offer that skeleton as the "game", while everything that fleshes it out is just a "bonus" that they don't "owe" to us, and anyone who still thinks some meat should come on those bones if only so we don't break our teeth when we bite in is "entitled".

Are you seriously suggesting that Mass Effect 3 without DLC is a skeleton of a game? The 26 hours I spent diving into it suggest otherwise. Now, if you aren't talking about Mass Effect 3 (I presume you to be since it's what everyone is talking about right now), what games are you talking about since none come to mind for me.

 

[Vegosiux]

Are you seriously suggesting that Mass Effect 3 without DLC is a skeleton of a game? The 26 hours I spent diving into it suggest otherwise. Now, if you aren't talking about Mass Effect 3 (I presume you to be since it's what everyone is talking about right now), what games are you talking about since none come to mind for me.

Well, I remember logging over 80 hours on Baldur's gate 2 on one playthrough...I remember logging a good 50 in Mass Effect 1.

What I'm "seriously suggesting" is that some gaming studios are going into that direction - how far they will go down that road is up to us. The actual game time of the "core game" is decreasing yet the price doesn't reflect that, that's what my beef is with.

And, also, I suppose in essence I meant about what A-D. posted a few posts back (though I would have a thing to say about capitalizing every noun), that the process of developing a game has changed, and that, as a gamer, I do not consider such change to be good.

 

[GiantRaven]

Well, I remember logging over 80 hours on Baldur's gate 2 on one playthrough...I remember logging a good 50 in Mass Effect 1.

So Mass Effect was a skeleton of a game because it was only 50 hours long? What was it missing?

What I'm "seriously suggesting" is that some gaming studios are going into that direction - how far they will go down that road is up to us. The actual game time of the "core game" is decreasing yet the price doesn't reflect that, that's what my beef is with.

There are long games now, and there are short games now. The same was true of games made in the past. The respective cost of those games weren't different then either.

 

[Rack]

Are you seriously suggesting that Mass Effect 3 without DLC is a skeleton of a game? The 26 hours I spent diving into it suggest otherwise. Now, if you aren't talking about Mass Effect 3 (I presume you to be since it's what everyone is talking about right now), what games are you talking about since none come to mind for me.

Compared to Baldurs Gate those 26 hours don't even constitute a skeleton. Certainly it fares badly in comparison to Witcher 2. Realistically though it's not a terrible deal it's just designed to feel incomplete. People ought to feel unsatisfied with such behaviour.

 

[GiantRaven]

Compared to Baldurs Gate those 26 hours don't even constitute a skeleton. Certainly it fares badly in comparison to Witcher 2. Realistically though it's not a terrible deal it's just designed to feel incomplete. People ought to feel unsatisfied with such behaviour.

So a games worth is based solely on length? Surely most games are mere unsatisfying bones compared to Baldur's Gate.

Portal 2? What a piece of shit.

Ok, another question. At what point was Mass Effect 3 'incomplete'? I played through the game without any DLC and I still got a complete story.

 

[Johann610]

Car, shmar. I think it's more like airline flights. Used to be, pay a fortune and you get legroom, food, a deck of cards, helpful service, and all the bags you could check.
Now, we get none of the above for free, but even WHEN you add it up, we pay less than ever. Same goes for DLC--it's cheaper than the full-size games (most of the time), and WAY less than the "expansion pack" sequels, which means more download time, but I remember all-night downloads for all sorts of things--if you know what I mean.

 

[Dryk]

Because some

Why are gamers specifically targeted as being entitled?

Probably because gamers aren't as good at asserting their right as consumers to complain. Unlike most other industries media companies have this crazy idea that WE owe THEM and seem to get very frustrated when we act like more than wallets on legs

 

[Rack]

Compared to Baldurs Gate those 26 hours don't even constitute a skeleton. Certainly it fares badly in comparison to Witcher 2. Realistically though it's not a terrible deal it's just designed to feel incomplete. People ought to feel unsatisfied with such behaviour.

So a games worth is based solely on length? Surely most games are mere unsatisfying bones compared to Baldur's Gate.

Portal 2? What a piece of shit.

Not at all, I was just trying to head off "it's 26 hours, don't complain". ME3 isn't amazingly long for the style of content it has and so should not be considered immune to criticisms based on value.

Ok, another question. At what point was Mass Effect 3 'incomplete'? I played through the game without any DLC and I still got a complete story.

Actually I've not played 3 so it might be exempt from this one. Certainly there are 2 clear points everyone says ME3 is incomplete and those points are incredibly compelling. Also Mass Effect 2 was a similar length and that definitely felt incomplete at launch. On the other hand Human Revolution was shorter, and actually had a chunk missing from the middle of the game and still managed to feel more complete.

 

[Beryl77]

I'm really tired of people using the word "entitled" the whole time. Yes there are a few gamers who really are entitled but the majority aren't. Most producers just use that word as a weapon against complaining consumers.

 

[wooty]

Once again its all modern sensitivity and pointless symbolism if you ask me.

Like if someone says something bad about a sports team, makes fun of a game you like, criticizes your religion or burns your countries flag......it hurts absolutely no one, but they all seem to see it in the same light as someone physically punching you in the face. I dont get it really.

 

[AbstractStream]

OH MY CHRIST YES WE KNOW MASS EFFECT 3'S ENDING SUCKS JESUS LET'S TALK ABOUT SOMETHING ELSE PLEASE
Sorry, I just got a bit worked up.

Yes, please. I'd like to forget about this whole thing already D:

 

[Thoric485]

Because that's the most profitable stance for gaming sites to take.

1. They don't bite the hand that feeds them
2. They get thousands of article hits (angry or happy, an impression's an impression)

 

[Qitz]

so in your world theres dlc that takes from the core of the game
so it comes without music
or movement
or the ability to shoot in a shooter
oomes with an incomplete story (a story you dont like =/= incomplete)

no they all have little extra bits.

You know, it's funny you mention that because there's a little game called DLC Quest [http://goingloudstudios.com/games/dlc-quest/] that would like a word with you Granted its a satire but it's pretty much exactly what we have to look forward to if this trend continues to be supported.

As for gamers = entitled.

Demanding you get an xpac for free? Entitled.

Demanding you get pre-order exclusives for free later? Entitled.

Demanding you get your monies worth and not get nickle and dime to death? Not entitled.

Demanding a product work as advertised and not be a bug riddled mess? Not entitled.

Demanding a product not have core parts removed and held for ransom? Not entitled.

But hey, that doesn't matter when you can just throw $10 at it and get it anyways right?

 

[Fappy]

OH MY CHRIST YES WE KNOW MASS EFFECT 3'S ENDING SUCKS JESUS LET'S TALK ABOUT SOMETHING ELSE PLEASE
Sorry, I just got a bit worked up.

It was so bad we're still recovering from the fallout. Every game forum is going to look like Chernobyl for the next month.

 

[Nimzabaat]

Games should feel entitled to good games. Do you know why? Because video games are one of the few products that you can't return if you're not satisfied.
Don't like a movie? Walk out and get your money back.
Don't like your meal? Complain and get your money back.
Don't like your car? Furniture? T-Shirt? You can get your money back.
Don't like a video game? Sell it for 5 bucks.
And that is why we're entitled to a product we will be completely happy with. Until game companies allow you to return products that you are not satisfied with, we should feel entitled to a perfect product.

 

[Vegosiux]

You don't have the money for this hobby? Get a new one.

Rude, crude, but it gets the point across.

*groan* It's not about having money for it, it's about not getting your money's worth because there are some services that use sleazy underhanded practices to milk more money out of you. And the worst bit is, people are defending that, I dunno, I as a consumer am pretty rational about what I throw my money at, I don't spend my money under emotion.

And gaming isn't THAT expensive if you know how to look for good deals and if you aren't a complete recluse (okay, that one I need to work on), either. So, all you accomplished with your post is make yourself look like an ass. But hey, don't let a peasant like me tell your highness to not act like a prick.

A more realistic thing to say would be "Don't want to spend money on this game? Go buy a different one and enjoy that instead." Why yes, good sir, that's exactly what I'm doing ^^

Ah, yes the random internet guy #2012321 is calling me an ass, even though he immediately insults me afterwords. Great. [For Reference in case it is deleted: So, all you accomplished with your post is make yourself look like an ass. But hey, don't let a peasant like me tell your highness to not act like a prick.

If you got called an ass (which I didn't do, by the way...yes, mincing words I am.) 2012320 times already, you might want to look into reasons for that. Just saying.

And, you know, if mods delete it, they will delete your reference too...but thank you for considering my words important enough to preserve. I am flattered, I truly am. *blushes*