How did The Escapist's culture change so much?

Recommended Videos

Eri

The Light of Dawn
Feb 21, 2009
3,626
0
0
Exley97 said:
Eri said:
Loop Stricken said:
Scarim Coral said:
I just assuming the site change according with the times (internet news and social etc) since a few years ago there was no such thing as "gamergate", Mass Effect 3 wasn't made and Anita Sarkeesian was setting up her kickstarter.

In saying so I do know alot of people left during the Extra Credits controversial.
I still don't know what Gamergate is, and at this poin t I'm too afraid to ask.

(I lied, I kinda know, but I don't know which side of the fence is the "stop shagging people for good reviews and lying about it" camp. Pro or anti? Iunno.)
I'm sure someone replied already but in case they didn't- The pro gamergate people are the ones who want people to stop shagging others for reviews and want ethics in journalism. Anti gamergaters want to continue with a lack of ethics because most of them to believe being "impartial" to be impossible so it's okay to be as biased or partial as you want. They also love censoring anyone who disagrees with them.
The above statements epitomize virtually everything that is wrong with Gamergate. GGers pruport to want "ethics in journalism" yet puts the focus/blame/responsibility squarely on Zoe Quinn for "shagging others for reviews" [she didn't] and not THE ACTUAL JOURNALIST in question [he didn't either, but that's beside the point]. GGers repeatedly claim that the movement isn't about Quinn and that the only people mentioning her are "aGG" but they can't help bringing her back into it all, repeating the same BS claims about sleeping with reporters for positive reviews/coverage again and again. They just can't help themselves, because they've invested so much in hating her over the lst 8-plus months, so they keep harping on what they believe was *abusive behavior* toward her ex-boyfriend [LOL give me a fucking break] or her supposed *history of online harassment* [ditto, what a fucking joke] and slam her efforts with Crash Override or her feminist views on gaming, all of which have FUCK ALL to do with ethics in journalism.

Meanwhile, Nathan Grayson sleeps in his own bed, gets a fraction of the criticism/harassment/abuse that Quinn gets, and takes a back seat to Quinn and other female "LWs" on the Gamergate enemies list, and GGers keep denying this movement has anything to do with gender/feminism/sexism with a straight face and stunning lack of self-awareness. It'd be hilarious if there weren't real people being hurt.
Everything I said is factual and provable information. I don't want to hear this from the guy who pretended for so long to be neutral and be a journalist and then was outed as being neither.

Self reflection would be amazing for anti GG.
 

BloatedGuppy

New member
Feb 3, 2010
9,572
0
0
Zontar said:
Obsidian's forum and the game's steam community hub are good places to start. The people there that took offence to the joke where few and far between.
Questions of Burden of Proof notwithstanding, why would I spend time combing Obsidian's forums looking for proof to support your unsupportable claim? Even if you were to spend hours/days parsing the forums and believed you'd found the proof you were looking for, would you then issue a statement that the forums represented a sufficient sample size to make claims of "universality"? Are you often given to believing that the arguments/opinions you hear on internet forums form some kind of quorum that is representative of people everywhere? Does that strike you as a rational argument, or an emotional one?

Zontar said:
...it's a pretty decent description of GG...
Odd. Such a generalization could just as easily be applied to GG's ideological opposites, and in fact frequently is. Much of it is lifted almost verbatim from "definitions" provided for the popular pejorative "social justice warrior". Why would you automatically presume I was describing GG?

Zontar said:
Because of the past year it's one of the three such controversies that happened
Only three? That doesn't seem like very many controversies, particularly if the PoE "incident" is considered one of them. I am given to understand there is a plague of such incidences devouring gaming and the "geek community" at large, and it must be opposed. Surely there are more than three examples used as data points to define this trend? Even at most pessimistic/dismissive of such claims I would never hypothesize only THREE examples. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding the window of time you've allotted and/or your use of the word "controversy" in this particular circumstance.

Zontar said:
one of the remaining two is not being defended by anyone on either side of this argument (and for good reason).
Who is specifically "defending" the offense taken at the PoE poem in this argument? Is it me? Are you aware of what my position on the poem is? If I was "defending" anything it was the right of people to get offended if they feel offended. Which included yourself, Stephen Fry, gamers, or anyone else who decided they were upset/annoyed at something. Do you find that to be a debatable premise? Do only some people have the right to be offended? Which people? Who decides?

Or are you just speaking about "two sides" in a general sense, imagining you have the question of "PoE poem, offensive Y/N" and there are literally only two positions to be taken on the subject? Are you not a believer in nuance or moderated positions? Do you believe all questions are best answered by settling into one of two polarized and opposed camps?
 

Hyrist

New member
Apr 5, 2005
37
0
0
Adeptus Aspartem said:
This thread should actually answer everything to you OP. Write something about ANYTHING at it turns into a GG discussion.

The website is still gaming related, just with less quality content than before (imo) but the forums are now a GG-discussion forum.
It's boring and draining at the same time.
You know, as someone who has ghosted these forums with relatively no post activity for many years (Just look at my join date and post number), I actually feel the opposite. I'm more engaged into the ongoing conversations on these forums now than before - mainly because I am greatly concerned by the back and forth politics on a subject that, honestly feels should exist devoid of them.

I'm going to quote a list of questions I saw on the first page, with my answers to each of them:

Is there inequality in videogames representation of women? Yes, but this is also true with all gender issues concerning all media. Video games, as a Case Study are, in my opinion, typically more progressive in this matter. Especially when compared to printed publications.

Does a negative portrayal of a fictional woman have a negative effect on women in real life? Yes, but not just women. Again many of the negative tropes involving gender is often an offense of all of the gender spectrum. It's just as bad to look at a 'Gamer' as a neck-bearded nerd with no respect for women as it is for women to be used as an objectified too or a female gamer to be seen as an in-genuine attention-seeker. This is to say nothing of LGBTQIA issues. This is where games themselves have, I feel, began to outpace their audience in terms of progressive acceptance. We have a sever problem with trolls and those easily pulled into polarizing arguments that is systemic across the entirety of gaming culture and it stalls everything, including this conversation.

Should we encourage more female developers into the videogame industry and how? Yes, but how is a loaded question. Beyond offering equal wages and position opportunities, we deal with the reality that women interest in majority of gaming genres are in a strong minority. The start of this has to begin with a more friendly and accepting environment for all. Simply put, no matter what 'side' you are on, the pitchforks and torches need to be put down. In the end, the political grand-standing, counter-arguing and finger-pointing on both sides is ultimately counterproductive. This is a matter that will begin to resolve itself as other gender issues in writing, designing and the conditions in the work environment continue to evolve to feature a broader range of acceptance.

Should we encourage more female protagonists in videogames and how? Yes. By producing more successful games featuring strong female protagonist leads. It will be their popularity alone that will encourage the continuation of them. We already have good examples throughout our history. Let's have more of them.

Is videogame journalism corrupted if the journalists and developers are friends/living together/in business together/giving each other money/sleeping together? Yes. There has been enough logical evidence provided to show that this effects writing tone, ratings, and therefore developer wages and attention at games to cause a physical draw of attention. There is a lot of power of having the spotlight and such power should be held with respect and humility.

That is not to say that writers in these compromised positions should not write. Or that their views political should be removed from sight. That's taking the idea of integrity and breaching it into the same sort of censorship problems that those opposed to Corruption in Journalism often face.

How can we hold videogame journalists and game developers to higher standards of ethics? There needs to be a neutral fact-checking aspect to this. A group that is part of no 'movement'. Populated by those who are capable of leaving whatever stances they have behind and are able to take a critical eye upon the whole scope of media in gaming - that includes addressing matters such as the toxicity level in gaming communities. Pointing out valid criticisms from emotional outbursts or blatant trolling and misconduct, and civilly yet firmly holding these groups accountable for them. I want to stress: Gamergate cannot fill this role as it has evolved into a part of the gaming subculture.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



None of these issues for me draw a sociopolitical line in and of themselves and should be freely discussed. The fact that each discussion on this topic devolved into "Oh, you're one of them" really detracts from the intelligent discourse and discussion on the above issues.

I feel that all matters concerning the above should be free to be discussed without the necessity of drawing political lines or rallying behind political causes. And that the change is that, at one time, they used to be. However, the scandal has become the conversation, and the concerns on both ends of the spectrum are being drowned out. The causes on gender equality and gender acceptance is not reaching the audience it needs to improve the culture. And those who are trying to bring the spotlight on the issues of Journalistic integrity are failing to meet their aims by doing it so loudly that they, and not the issue, become the story.

The issues here are more important, and should be the conversation. The Gamergate Controversy is the biggest Red Herring in the history of gaming. It serves only to distract and polarize the conversation. We as both individuals and a culture should be focusing on our collective goals, not fall into the same rut as our continually dysfunctional governments.