How do you reason with religious people?

[teebeeohh]

i gave that up long ago. most reasonable religious people are just that, reasonable and when trying to talk to fanatics they have 1 argument and repeat it again and again and again, just phrase it differently.
a very wise man once said:
Everybody should treat their religion like their balls: don't have them out in public and don't shove them down your kids throats.

 

[RobCoxxy]

I can get along with religious folk, but disagree with their beliefs.
And Christians are more in-your-face and annoying about it than any other.

And they seem to have a tendency to try and brainwash/shove it down children's throats more. Which I despise.

 

[Mr. Eff_v1legacy]

You don't. Some people are stuck in their ways. Don't bother.

 

[EllEzDee]

Other worthwhile questions:
How do you reason with a furry?
How do you reason with a blind-patriot?
How do you reason with an idiot?

 

[CrustyOatmeal]

you cannot reason with religious people simply because their faith is not based on reason to begin with. you disprove a mathematical theory with reason because it was formulated with reason and falls within the confines of reason. religion is based off of faith and a belief in something outside the realm of reason and physical proofs and thus you cannot reason with a person when talking about something that lies outside of its realm. this is why atheist dont make any headway when trying to disprove the existence of a higher power, they try and prove it with science and reason when that is not the foundation a persons religion is formed.

 

[Irony's Acolyte]

I think you need to edit your title from "How do you reason with religious people" to "How do you reason with ignorant people". Because I can reason just fine with religious people. It's not like they abandon logic and clear thinking in favor of superstition and faith. Now some of them do, but there are atheists out there who don't really follow well-thought out logic themselves. Religion and reason are not mutually exclusive.

It all comes down to your interpretation of the world around you. Some people look at the world and feel that there has to be something out there that we can't see that's affecting everything. Others feel like everythings just random and there is no purpose. And some can't yet decide. To religious people, believing in their religion is logical from what they've seen in life.

So seriously, all just because you're friends ignorant, don't think that it's due to his religion.

 

[starkiller212]

In my experience, people will generally think/argue whatever is necessary to preserve their own beliefs. Once someone is indoctrinated into religious beliefs, they pretty much have to experience and verify their doubts independently for any changes to occur. Unfortunately I don't think this is limited to religion, it's just human nature in general. It might be best to simply present your side/evidence in whatever discussion you're having, so they are at least aware of it, and then withdraw before it becomes too hostile. Hopefully they will eventually realize the truth, but there's not much else you can really do about it.

 

[HT_Black]

"Hi, there, religious person!"
"Hi there, Harry!"
"Did you know that I'm religious?"
"Oh, get out of town! So am I!"
"Are you insane?"
"Nope! How about you?"
"Neither am I!"
"That's great! Why the hell does this question even need to be asked?"
"Beats me, religious person! Beats me."

It goes a bit like that.

 

[Bugerion]

A lot of people here where I live are ''religious'' but I have a feeling they never really go to church or anything like that only one guy asked me what do I think happens after life I answered and he said ok so that was the end they don't really bug you here.

 

[standokan]

You can´t and you shouldn´t, leave unreasonable people alone, I´m not saying that religious are unreasonable but you get the point.

 

[SkellgrimOrDave]

You can't.

 

[Whitenail]

As a Catholic I'd like to think that I don't adhere to the stereotypes of being unreasonably undeterrable and disrespectful of the beliefs of others and I suppose my method for stepping around people who probably would scream and shout when their faith came under fire is simply to try and not bring it up.

Don't get me wrong, being able to have a mature discussion about religion with others is something I'd love to do, but at the end of the day considering how deep-running and personal someone's faith is I see no real reason to bring it under scrutiny, come face to face with someone who does scrutinize the beliefs and practices of others (unless it's something extreme, like some cult of baby-eaters) like a judgemental asshole (believe me I've interacted with hundreds of these types in the past, offline and on) I just try to ignore them, their beliefs probably aren't going to change under such conditions and neither are mine.

 

[Paksenarrion]

This is a little embarrassing, but us religious people have a quota, kind of like highway patrol officers do. If you pay attention to when we try to convert you, you'll notice we do it at a particular time of the month.

 

[InfiniteSingularity]

WBC and anyone who supports them are NOT religious, they're simply fucking morons.

Well, they are religious. How many different interpretations are there of single religions? You can't just discount one because it's views are abhorrent.

Sorry, but saying the WBC are Christians is like saying the Dalai Lama is a fascist. The WBC completely misses the point of their own religion, which is compassion, kindness, and other such things that Jesus taught. Everything they do goes against everything Christ said, things like "peace to all man", "God loves everyone", and whatnot. There isn't anything about homosexuality in the Bible, nor is there any evidence that God demands "cleansing" such things. They just made shit up. And when they quoted that part from the Bible (can't remember what it was) and said that it meant the Interned was made for the WBC to spread their messages is all bullshit. They are completely insensitive (protesting AT people's funerals?) and lack compassion to anyone outside their group. They lack intelligence (they have stated that their goal is effectively to scare people into sinning so other people will sin and go to hell), and they have absolutely no evidence or reason to believe, preach, and justify their beliefs (Barack Obama, the fucking Antichrist? Give me a fucking break). In short, they're just believing what they're to believe, and doing what they are told to do. I've even heard stories that the WBC raises children on these beliefs

There is no "Christianity" in the WBC, just hate. What happened to "Love your enemy"? A fundamental principle in Christianity, WBC goes entirely against that. They're not Christians. They might be Theist, but their God is definitely not the Christian God

You can find any passage in the Bible and bend it to whatever which way you want to interpret it. There's stuff in the Old Testament that's particularly nasty.

So, yes, your interpretation is that. But that's it, an interpretation. It's the more popular interpretation, but again, interpretation.

There's a difference between interpreting something that fits with your beliefs, and disobeying the majority of the Bible. I take again "Love your enemy", this was Jesus' fundamental message throughout the Bible, and they've done the exact opposite of what it said. And that's not the only thing.

The other thing is that these people were raised from birth by the WBC (correct me if I'm wrong but this is what I've heard) and indoctrinated by the original beliefs of the WBC. So there isn't any rationality in this "interpretation" of the Bible, as they're just doing what they've been told all their life. So you can't really justify what they are saying as "their opinion" because it's not; it's someone else's opinion they're parroting because they're too stupid to think for themselves

 

[Jegsimmons]

most of us religious people are usually open minded to a point, but only the insane take the side of WBC.

but im not honestly sure why you have to "Reason With Us", every one has their own beliefs, you wont change their mind just by stating your point. after all, i know atheist and people of other beliefs, i'll have a conversation about our differences in beliefs and why i follow mine, but i wont try to convince them to join me.

 

[pwnzerstick]

Just a quick note: How come, that whenever someone is talking about God they feel it neccecary to say it in the same voice Samuel L Jackson gives his speech in during Pulp Fiction, and say it with a lexicon from scripture.
OT: I would reason that the WBC's assuptions about God are wrong by asking them if God is perfect. I'm guessing that they would say yes. I would then say that if hates gays and wants to kill them all, then doesn't that make God wrathful, and if wrath is a sin then wouldn't that mean that God is a sinner, and therefore not perfect.

 

[Nikokvaj]

But WBC really is the winner of that debate.

The only real objective of Anonymous is to create rage and butthurt, exactly what they are experiencing because of WBC.

As for reasoning with a member of the WBC, you can't.

You can't reason with a person who thinks it's his or her right to tell other people what to do based on morals, ethics, ideology or religious belief because neither of these things are objective, and therefore aren't subject to objective reasoning.

 

[Woodsey]

WBC and anyone who supports them are NOT religious, they're simply fucking morons.

Well, they are religious. How many different interpretations are there of single religions? You can't just discount one because it's views are abhorrent.

Sorry, but saying the WBC are Christians is like saying the Dalai Lama is a fascist. The WBC completely misses the point of their own religion, which is compassion, kindness, and other such things that Jesus taught. Everything they do goes against everything Christ said, things like "peace to all man", "God loves everyone", and whatnot. There isn't anything about homosexuality in the Bible, nor is there any evidence that God demands "cleansing" such things. They just made shit up. And when they quoted that part from the Bible (can't remember what it was) and said that it meant the Interned was made for the WBC to spread their messages is all bullshit. They are completely insensitive (protesting AT people's funerals?) and lack compassion to anyone outside their group. They lack intelligence (they have stated that their goal is effectively to scare people into sinning so other people will sin and go to hell), and they have absolutely no evidence or reason to believe, preach, and justify their beliefs (Barack Obama, the fucking Antichrist? Give me a fucking break). In short, they're just believing what they're to believe, and doing what they are told to do. I've even heard stories that the WBC raises children on these beliefs

There is no "Christianity" in the WBC, just hate. What happened to "Love your enemy"? A fundamental principle in Christianity, WBC goes entirely against that. They're not Christians. They might be Theist, but their God is definitely not the Christian God

You can find any passage in the Bible and bend it to whatever which way you want to interpret it. There's stuff in the Old Testament that's particularly nasty.

So, yes, your interpretation is that. But that's it, an interpretation. It's the more popular interpretation, but again, interpretation.

There's a difference between interpreting something that fits with your beliefs, and disobeying the majority of the Bible. I take again "Love your enemy", this was Jesus' fundamental message throughout the Bible, and they've done the exact opposite of what it said. And that's not the only thing.

The other thing is that these people were raised from birth by the WBC (correct me if I'm wrong but this is what I've heard) and indoctrinated by the original beliefs of the WBC. So there isn't any rationality in this "interpretation" of the Bible, as they're just doing what they've been told all their life. So you can't really justify what they are saying as "their opinion" because it's not; it's someone else's opinion they're parroting because they're too stupid to think for themselves

What's rational about following the guide of a book that's a few 1000 years old anyway?

And yeah, but again, people with the more standard interpretation (who also just pick and choose what they want to follow) push their kids into it, which I don't agree with either. It's not as bad, but they're not wholly different.

 

[Chibz]

I never said you should, and where does it say to kill homosexuals anyway? In fact I don't think homosexuals were even mention of not brief till non-existent. Never called you dogmatic either, just saying that both sounds so much alike that neither recognizes the similarities that they share, that which being that no one really cares their belief when put out in the open with such zealotry of pushing their values on others, or telling them that their values are wrong because it doesn't fit their beliefs. Sorry if I made it to be a personal attack to you.

It's mostly old testament, in leviticus. It's brief, but it's there. It's actually about as lengthy as any one of the ten commandment rules. Bible talks more about the fatty area around the kidney and liver (I think?) and how it's perfect to burn as a sacrifice. And in more detail about how to massacre EVERYONE who doesn't follow him as their deity. Guess those parts were just more important.

With me I recognize that people have the right to be mentally unwell, and people have the right to be wrong. But please, PLEASE, PLEASE do not try to force the words from a book written by primitive desert nomads onto me. I find that incredibly offensive.

Also, no offense taken.

What's rational about following the guide of a book that's a few 1000 years old anyway?

And yeah, but again, people with the more standard interpretation (who also just pick and choose what they want to follow) push their kids into it, which I don't agree with either. It's not as bad, but they're not wholly different.

Pushing a religion onto a kid with the sole purpose of making them religious is, at its core, child abuse. You're warping their young minds long before they're finished forming. It's monstrous and unforgivable.